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420A Intermittent loss of 2nd gear

Posted by BLACK'98DSM, Jan 21, 2020

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  1. BLACK'98DSM

    BLACK'98DSM Proven Member

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    Hoover, Alabama
    It feels like 2nd gear is still there. It gently clicks into "2nd gear" just like it always has. But when I let the clutch out it does not engage. It just revs the engine like it would if I was in neutral.

    I hear a grinding/scratching/rattling sound at idle if that makes a difference, although I've been hearing this sound for a year now.

    The shifter bushings on the trans are new and so are the ones on the shifter base. 1st, 3rd, 4th, 5th, and reverse work like a charm. It is literally like 2nd gear magically dissapeared overnight.

    Thoughts?
     

    Road Race Build 3K  25

    1998 Mitsubishi Eclipse N/T
    fwd · manual · 2G DSM

    41  3

    2008 Tomberlin Crossfire 150R
    rwd · manual · Misc Vehicles

    53  6

    2008 Tomberlin Crossfire (325 swapped)
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  2. BLACK'98DSM

    BLACK'98DSM Proven Member

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    Hoover, Alabama
    I should add that the synchro would occasionally grind when shifting into 2nd. Not very often, but it did happen.
    So, is it possible that the 2nd gear synchro got destroyed and therefore can't shift into 2nd?
     

    Road Race Build 3K  25

    1998 Mitsubishi Eclipse N/T
    fwd · manual · 2G DSM

    41  3

    2008 Tomberlin Crossfire 150R
    rwd · manual · Misc Vehicles

    53  6

    2008 Tomberlin Crossfire (325 swapped)
    rwd · manual · Misc Vehicles
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  3. silvreclips

    silvreclips Proven Member

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    Greenville, South Carolina
    That's very strange. I know you just put that short shifter on. Maybe check that out to make sure nothing is restricting the shifter from letting 2nd engage all the way. If you still have nothing, I would disconnect the linkages from the trans and manually put it in 2nd. This would eliminate any shifter/cable issue. If you still have no 2nd gear, something must have broken in the trans. I cant think of what would happen to only loose 2nd after just sitting
     

    Autocross Build 376  1

    1998 Mitsubishi Eclipse N/T
    fwd · manual · 2G DSM
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  4. Canadian_CD9A

    Canadian_CD9A Proven Member

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    Winnipeg, MB, Canada
    The slider may still be moving onto the 2nd gear engagement teeth, but part (or all) of a gear is gone. Your transmission needs a rebuild. Get the transmission fluid out of it and you'll probably see fragments of gears in the pan.
     
  5. silvreclips

    silvreclips Proven Member

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    Greenville, South Carolina
    It's just seems odd that it worked one day and the next it doesn't have 2nd. If you can't find anything wrong with the shifter, drain the oil and check for debris.
     

    Autocross Build 376  1

    1998 Mitsubishi Eclipse N/T
    fwd · manual · 2G DSM
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  6. BLACK'98DSM

    BLACK'98DSM Proven Member

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    Everything seems ok as far as the cables and shifting assembly go. It definitely is internal. I'll have to inspect everything and see what's going on, maybe this weekend, if not tomorrow. I do agree, this is strange. I will keep this thread updated...
     

    Road Race Build 3K  25

    1998 Mitsubishi Eclipse N/T
    fwd · manual · 2G DSM

    41  3

    2008 Tomberlin Crossfire 150R
    rwd · manual · Misc Vehicles

    53  6

    2008 Tomberlin Crossfire (325 swapped)
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  7. Hickory-NC-2Ggsx

    Hickory-NC-2Ggsx Proven Member

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    Try putting it in second outside the car then start it and see if it moves.
     

    Street Build 192  1

    Mitsubishi Mighty Max
    manual · 4G63t Swapped

    Street Build 527  1

    1997 Mitsubishi Eclipse GSX
    awd · manual · 2G DSM
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  8. 609DSM

    609DSM Proven Member

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    Princeton, New Jersey
    This worries me because mine has the same sound you've described in the past. ONLY during a cold start its like there are rocks spinning inside the trans, the colder the louder. When it's hot out the sound is diminished and once the car is up to temp and the gears have spun enough the sound is gone. I hope you can find an answer to this.

    I have not checked the fluid level or replaced because of the controversy of what fluid the nvt-350 trans uses and the fact that it is no longer sold by mopar. Also I only have two jack stands and I know you need it up on four jack stands to change the fluid
     

    Street Build 279  1

    1998 Mitsubishi Eclipse N/T
    fwd · manual · 2G DSM
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  9. TK's9d2TSi

    TK's9d2TSi Previously tk106

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    If you can see the full plug from up top, you don’t need to jack up all 4 corners. Drain the fluid, tighten the drain plug, then fill with all 4 wheels on the ground until fluid starts to run out of the fill plug. Just have something underneath to catch the fluid and you’ll need a long hose attached to a funnel.
     

    289  3

    2000 Jeep Cherokee Sport - Classic
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    1992 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
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  10. silvreclips

    silvreclips Proven Member

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    Greenville, South Carolina
    @609DSM noise on cold starts isnt all that uncommon. If the trans has ever been replaced or rebuilt, that could be the reason.

    As far as oil goes. Amsoil synchromesh, ATF, or 5w30 mobile 1 high mileage engine oil.

    Any of these work fine.

    @BLACK'98DSM to bad your not closer to me. I would help you tear it down
     

    Autocross Build 376  1

    1998 Mitsubishi Eclipse N/T
    fwd · manual · 2G DSM
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  11. motomattx

    motomattx Proven Member

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    Silvereclips seems to know exactly what he is talking about on this transmission! become good friends with him.
     

    Drag Race Build 3K  24

    1995 Mitsubishi Eclipse GST
    fwd · manual · 2G DSM
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  12. Canadian_CD9A

    Canadian_CD9A Proven Member

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    Winnipeg, MB, Canada
    My Neon's transmission (NVT T-350) sounded like a rock tumbler on start-up, it went away with the clutch pushed in. I forget if it was the input shaft bearing or the clutch release bearing.
     
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  13. BLACK'98DSM

    BLACK'98DSM Proven Member

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    That's almost exactly what mine is doing.
     

    Road Race Build 3K  25

    1998 Mitsubishi Eclipse N/T
    fwd · manual · 2G DSM

    41  3

    2008 Tomberlin Crossfire 150R
    rwd · manual · Misc Vehicles

    53  6

    2008 Tomberlin Crossfire (325 swapped)
    rwd · manual · Misc Vehicles
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  14. BLACK'98DSM

    BLACK'98DSM Proven Member

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    Hoover, Alabama
    Yea, he's a veteran :sneaky:
     

    Road Race Build 3K  25

    1998 Mitsubishi Eclipse N/T
    fwd · manual · 2G DSM

    41  3

    2008 Tomberlin Crossfire 150R
    rwd · manual · Misc Vehicles

    53  6

    2008 Tomberlin Crossfire (325 swapped)
    rwd · manual · Misc Vehicles
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    silvreclips likes this.
  15. BLACK'98DSM

    BLACK'98DSM Proven Member

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    I shall add this... This has me very very confused.

    So I try to take to for another spin. And it goes into 2nd gear just fine and works properly... But then the next time I try it, I get nothing... So, second gear comes in and out? This is pretty crazy...
     

    Road Race Build 3K  25

    1998 Mitsubishi Eclipse N/T
    fwd · manual · 2G DSM

    41  3

    2008 Tomberlin Crossfire 150R
    rwd · manual · Misc Vehicles

    53  6

    2008 Tomberlin Crossfire (325 swapped)
    rwd · manual · Misc Vehicles
    Loading...
  16. 609DSM

    609DSM Proven Member

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    Princeton, New Jersey
    Thanks everyone!

    Yes I forgot to mention this as well. When my clutch pedal is depressed the sound instantly goes away. I have no history of prior modifications or work done to my car other than what I can see with my eyes. When I go to shift it goes into gear fine.
     

    Street Build 279  1

    1998 Mitsubishi Eclipse N/T
    fwd · manual · 2G DSM
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  17. BLACK'98DSM

    BLACK'98DSM Proven Member

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    Hoover, Alabama
    The trans is coming out in March... I will update here...
     

    Road Race Build 3K  25

    1998 Mitsubishi Eclipse N/T
    fwd · manual · 2G DSM

    41  3

    2008 Tomberlin Crossfire 150R
    rwd · manual · Misc Vehicles

    53  6

    2008 Tomberlin Crossfire (325 swapped)
    rwd · manual · Misc Vehicles
    Loading...
  18. BLACK'98DSM

    BLACK'98DSM Proven Member

    1,524
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    Joined Feb 9, 2019
    Hoover, Alabama
    The 1/2 synchro is toast. I can see the excessive wear on it. Also the clutch was toast. Pretty sure it was the stocker. The TOB still felt smooth, but it was most likely the stock one as well so no doubts it was also toast. And to top it all off the trans was filled with regular gear oil. So there was just a list of things that could have been causing this issue. I will update once I get everything back together.
     

    Road Race Build 3K  25

    1998 Mitsubishi Eclipse N/T
    fwd · manual · 2G DSM

    41  3

    2008 Tomberlin Crossfire 150R
    rwd · manual · Misc Vehicles

    53  6

    2008 Tomberlin Crossfire (325 swapped)
    rwd · manual · Misc Vehicles
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