Help Choosing Mods

[Iliketogofast]

Ok so I've been reading quite a bit about my 6bolt 4g63t Eagle talon tsi
I have my mods listed to my account, I want to build a 2.3 stroker and I have the block figured out, My concern is the head, What cams do I need retainers springs and valves and anything else I need, Im looking to build a 700 horse motor. Also where I can find transfer cases, rear diff, and good m/t parts I can build it my self if need be. I don't want to go through process and repeat if I don't have to, So any of you guys that have built a car like im trying to, could you throw some head part combinations at me? moneys not a problem. also what kind of compression will I expect with a stroker 0.030 bored over, If any at all. And what kind of head parts will I need and block mods aswell, To handle high revs. I want to go with a 6266 turbo with a titanium turbine. So injector sizes aswell would be nice. Its confusing when working with these 4g63 for the first time, Like how much fuel do I need to stuff down its throat with larger cams to keep up in high revs, I also would like it to be reliable, lots of spare power but not unleashing the beast completely Most bolt on parts I have got figured out, What ignition cooling etc, I got that covered but this has been a problem area and I need help haha. I don't wanna buy valve springs and have them break or have a weak point because of my ignorance. Thanks a lot guys!

Theres a MAP stroker kit I want to go with eagle forged Crank Connector rods Wiesco 0.030 pistons ACL bearings ARP head studs, One more thing, What kind of clutch will I need, and fly wheel so when I dump my clutch I wont blow anything apart.

 

[My1GLaser]

Not sure that they have .030" over pistons for our application. I believe it's either .020" or .040", but I could be wrong.

Eagle crank isn't really necessary IMO.

Your probably going to want a twin-disc at that power level. Check out what twicks69 has said in various threads about clutches since that's around the power level he has been.

Your not really going to be revving a stroker to the moon. 8k-8.5k is what most would suggest. Some keep it lower and I am sure some rev it higher. The problem is the rod ratio with the stroker.

Look into Kelford cams and a set of Kiggly beehive springs for that power level. There are other comparable spring manufacturers as well.

Jacks transmission and tmzperformance.com(twicks69) are good places for tranny parts and/or rebuilds.

Injector size is going to be somewhat dictated by the fuel you are running. Pump gas or E-85? If you are running ECMLink and have the money then get 2150s.

 

[96accordsir]

ya just get fic or I'd injectors around 2000cc

 

[Iliketogofast]

What size of kelford cams? And im going to be running a water Meth injection. I got a schematic from Tom's Turbo Garage's site. And isn't 2000cc injectors A bit over kill? or give me a lot of wiggle room with tuning? And Yes ECM link when I send my ECU out to be chipped Im gunna run speed density. im not entirely sure about the fuel system but wouldn't that large of injectors really stuff too much in? unless the cams are big bastards haha! Also what Pound of spring will I be looking at for the specified size of kelford cam? so I don't get valve float or have them not open properly due to being too stiff?

 

[92AWDHX40]

Well with link you can get the biggest size you like then if you want more power you can always have the fuel on tap.

 

[1G Eclipse94928]

Ok so I've been reading quite a bit about my 6bolt 4g63t Eagle talon tsi
I have my mods listed to my account, I want to build a 2.3 stroker and I have the block figured out, My concern is the head, What cams do I need retainers springs and valves and anything else I need, Im looking to build a 700 horse motor. Also where I can find transfer cases, rear diff, and good m/t parts I can build it my self if need be. I don't want to go through process and repeat if I don't have to, So any of you guys that have built a car like im trying to, could you throw some head part combinations at me? moneys not a problem. also what kind of compression will I expect with a stroker 0.030 bored over, If any at all. And what kind of head parts will I need and block mods aswell, To handle high revs. I want to go with a 6266 turbo with a titanium turbine. So injector sizes aswell would be nice. Its confusing when working with these 4g63 for the first time, Like how much fuel do I need to stuff down its throat with larger cams to keep up in high revs, I also would like it to be reliable, lots of spare power but not unleashing the beast completely Most bolt on parts I have got figured out, What ignition cooling etc, I got that covered but this has been a problem area and I need help haha. I don't wanna buy valve springs and have them break or have a weak point because of my ignorance. Thanks a lot guys!

Theres a MAP stroker kit I want to go with eagle forged Crank Connector rods Wiesco 0.030 pistons ACL bearings ARP head studs, One more thing, What kind of clutch will I need, and fly wheel so when I dump my clutch I wont blow anything apart.

For your driveline check out jackstransmissions, and driveshaft shop.
The Driveshaft Shop | Mitsubishi - Import Axles
The Driveshaft Shop | Mitsubishi - Import Driveshafts

 

[Iliketogofast]

I will Transmission seems to be expensive I was checking out johnsheps prices and they are insane.. So id rather build one my own. and have it sturdy. But back to the head thing, I do need to know size of cams /should I have 1mm over valves and what weight of springs I will need for the cams I know im gunna need bigger than 272 cams to achieve my goal. Or maybe im wrong, So im asking the pro's. I want massive power, But im not planning to build an all out drag car that's going to break and cause issues, Im gunna daily drive that sucker! and if I wanna go to the track for fun and see my cars progress I can, Im sure many of you can relate and thanks for the imput guys! keep it coming please

Not sure that they have .030" over pistons for our application. I believe it's either .020" or .040", but I could be wrong.

Eagle crank isn't really necessary IMO.

Your probably going to want a twin-disc at that power level. Check out what twicks69 has said in various threads about clutches since that's around the power level he has been.

Your not really going to be revving a stroker to the moon. 8k-8.5k is what most would suggest. Some keep it lower and I am sure some rev it higher. The problem is the rod ratio with the stroker.

Look into Kelford cams and a set of Kiggly beehive springs for that power level. There are other comparable spring manufacturers as well.

Jacks transmission and tmzperformance.com(twicks69) are good places for tranny parts and/or rebuilds.

Injector size is going to be somewhat dictated by the fuel you are running. Pump gas or E-85? If you are running ECMLink and have the money then get 2150s.

Im going to be running pump gas with water meth injection and octane booster. the little bottles are supposed to give you premium fuel octane and the water meth injection even better and I will definitely get ECM link. I also would like to know what size of cams from kelford and what weight of kiggly beehive. im also wondering whats a good brand of valves that can hold up, and a good set of retainers?

 

[twicks69]

Use a search button instead of PM'ing me expecting answers.

There is a wealth of information on this forum.

You literally joined less than 24 hours ago, USE THE SEARCH BUTTON.

 

[Iliketogofast]

Use a search button instead of PM'ing me expecting answers.

There is a wealth of information on this forum.

You literally joined less than 24 hours ago, USE THE SEARCH BUTTON.

Ok, thanks for coming to my post tho

 

[GRAVEDIGGER]

Im looking to build a 700 horse motor. One more thing, What kind of clutch will I need, and fly wheel so when I dump my clutch I wont blow anything apart.

I want massive power, But im not planning to build an all out drag car that's going to break and cause issues, Im gunna daily drive that sucker!


Im going to be running pump gas with water meth injection and octane booster. the little bottles are supposed to give you premium fuel octane and the water meth injection even better

#1) You say you want a 700 horse motor, but you're not planning on building an all out drag car that's going to break. You ain't gonna build a 700 horse motor and never have anything break... Just not gonna happen. Period.

#2) There is NO clutch dumping with an AWD. That's how you break shit!

#3) Pump gas with octane booster isn't gonna work either. That octane booster in a bottle is useless. Either run E85, race gas, or pump gas with water/meth injection. Forget about upping the octane of pump gas with octane booster.

Good luck! No offense, but you have a lot to learn before you build a 700 hp daily driver.

 

[LandSpeed-DSM]

Please don't take this as rude, but an observation from someone who's played with multiple platforms and learned a lot the hardway:

It's taken me just about 6 years and several DSMs to get to where I am at with the current project, with much yet to learn still.

Based on your (admittedly brief) post history... I also started with a much stronger background in performance modification as well. This does not bode well for your patience and wallet.

It's good to have goals, but there are many milestones you need to reach before then.

Before posting more, making new threads - Take in a minimum of 6 more months of research and reading to develop a coherent idea of what you may need to do such things.

Not knowing something as utterly basic as what injectors you would need should tell you just how far there is to go from here.

 

[Archer Fabrications]

Get 550cc injectors and a 35r . Sorry i had to..

 

[1G Eclipse94928]

#1) You say you want a 700 horse motor, but you're not planning on building an all out drag car that's going to break. You ain't gonna build a 700 horse motor and never have anything break... Just not gonna happen. Period.

#2) There is NO clutch dumping with an AWD. That's how you break shit!

#3) Pump gas with octane booster isn't gonna work either. That octane booster in a bottle is useless. Either run E85, race gas, or pump gas with water/meth injection. Forget about upping the octane of pump gas with octane booster.

Good luck! No offense, but you have a lot to learn before you build a 700 hp daily driver.

These guys are extremely knowledgeable and you should take this advise seriously, IMO try to take it a little more slowly and remember not to use ebay parts if you want reliability. If you can build a transmission yourself then thats a good start to saving money and having a strong dsm, but realistically your first build should be around 400-500awhp at most. (having a budget could also help me help you decide a reasonable hp range, cause if your rich then just go all out.) Using jacks awd rebuild value kit for the transmission will only cost you 900$ and you can safely push 400-500 horses threw it.

decide a reasonable REV limit!! this affects your turbo choice and cams.

IMO

For your top end get 272 cams and upgraded springs, etc. That should last for whatever turbo you end up using. then while you have the top end off get the bottom end done with forged internals. (and re machined by a DSM SPECIALIST!! I would recommend using someone who is on these forums and offers the service even if its more money to ship it to them, because it will end up being worth it!)

For your fuel system i would start off with just a FPR, walbro 400lph pump, and Fic injectors.(size depends on what you want to pay, for now i would say FIC 950cc are PLUNTY. I chose FIC 950cc personally cause of the great price.) then redo all the lines with high pressure fuel hose(not required but will make your car a lot more reliable.)

For your driveline: I dont have but have only seen amazing reviews for southbendclutches, and that is what i am going to purchase when my clutch dies. http://www.tmzperformance.com/Mitsubishi SBC Clutch Parts.html. (also get the other driveline parts i previously mentioned from driveshaft shop, and the rebuild kit from jacks)

Let me know what you want as a rev limit and new reasonable horsepower range, and ill help you decide what turbo is best for you, if this is still a project your interested in.

Some good street turbo options starting from smallest to biggest are the evo 3 16G, TD05H 20G HYBRID, TD06H 20G, FP green(regular or XL), Or the FP red.

Please don't take this as rude, but an observation from someone who's played with multiple platforms and learned a lot the hardway:

It's taken me just about 6 years and several DSMs to get to where I am at with the current project, with much yet to learn still.

Based on your (admittedly brief) post history... I also started with a much stronger background in performance modification as well. This does not bode well for your patience and wallet.

It's good to have goals, but there are many milestones you need to reach before then.

Before posting more, making new threads - Take in a minimum of 6 more months of research and reading to develop a coherent idea of what you may need to do such things.

Not knowing something as utterly basic as what injectors you would need should tell you just how far there is to go from here.

Take this advise to heart and research everything I recommended before buying anything. The only thing i disagree with is the 6 months, but if your really set on 700awhp then you really should take the 6 months researching.

and landspeed's picture reminded me of something that's more important then anything else IMO, and that is HOOD PINS. Buy them first and get them installed asap. hoods coming off is more common then you would think in higher horsepower cars, and they can do thousands in damage.(Or more if it hits someone else.)

Get 550cc injectors and a 35r . Sorry i had to..

and post the video of it going BoooM

 

[boostfeddGSX]

You should definitely do a lot more research its take time and patience. 700hp is a lot of power to start off at and you will probably have to run e85 or race gas to achieve that number. It's going to take a lot of money to get there. You should also make some more realistic goals for example like making 300hp then 400hp etc you get the point.

 

[Archer Fabrications]

Hood pins are a good idea. I havent done this yet but it scared the shit out of me not having em.

 

[LandSpeed-DSM]

Get yourself the cotter pins if you go this route. Strictly "lost" mine and their anchor cables, then gave me these shitty circle spring clips I'm guessing they had lying on a bench somewhere.

OP is not going to have to worry about that for quite a while though. Even with the pins, plenty of people still forget to put them back in before going out and wreck their sh!t anyway.

 

[Iliketogofast]

My rev limit will be around 8k and me asking what injector sizes doesn't mean I'm ignorant to my the build with the 4g63t I'm not sure how much I'd need to keep a good optimal air to fuel with 280 cams.. And as for valve springs.. I don't want valve float.. I'm going to be running a 6266 turbo.

And I've been reading for quite some time but information on the head was becoming scarce so I decided to sign up. This is not the only website about dsm

 

[LandSpeed-DSM]

My rev limit will be around 8k and me asking what injector sizes doesn't mean I'm ignorant to my the build with the 4g63t I'm not sure how much I'd need to keep a good optimal air to fuel with 280 cams.. And as for valve springs.. I don't want valve float.. I'm going to be running a 6266 turbo.

And I've been reading for quite some time but information on the head was becoming scarce so I decided to sign up. This is not the only website about dsm

Now don't get heated but that is actually a prime indication of ignorance on this topic.. if you can't find through research or some quick math how much fuel you need to make that power you have a long way to go.

That is VERY basic.

Another indicator is that you don't pick injectors for a set of cams.

Why does everyone take insult to someone going: "Hey man, slow down. We don't want you to throw a bunch of time and money at this to blow it up because you weren't ready."

This isn't an e-penis waving contest, we'd love to see you hit your goals.

But there is a foundation of both practical knowledge and experience you need to build such a project and this is precisely the sort of red flag that tells us you have a months of research yet to go.

 

[GRAVEDIGGER]

My rev limit will be around 8k and me asking what injector sizes doesn't mean I'm ignorant to my the build with the 4g63t I'm not sure how much I'd need to keep a good optimal air to fuel with 280 cams.. And as for valve springs.. I don't want valve float.. I'm going to be running a 6266 turbo.

And I've been reading for quite some time but information on the head was becoming scarce so I decided to sign up. This is not the only website about dsm

Uhhh... okay....
Here's a good calculator to help you decide which size injectors you want to go with. Choose the type of fuel used, the desired injector duty cycle, plug in the injector size, and hit calculate. It will tell you how much hp it can support.

HP Calculator

 

[twicks69]

Uhhh... okay....
Here's a good calculator to help you decide which size injectors you want to go with. Choose the type of fuel used, the desired injector duty cycle, plug in the injector size, and hit calculate. It will tell you how much hp it can support.

HP Calculator

This HP calculator for injector sizing is pretty accurate with about a 5-10% safety factor built in; definitely a useful piece of information here.

As for fuel injectors, personally, the high impedance RCI 2200cc fuel injectors are a great choice for either type of fuel (pump gas/race gas or E85) to meet your power levels and are considerably more accurate to tune with in comparison to a FIC 1350-1650cc injector. The highest volume/most accurate low impedance injector I have used have been the FIC BlueMAX 1350cc injectors, and when compared to the RCI 2200cc High-Z injectors, the high impedance injectors were substantially more accurate on low and high duty cycle ranges, decel throttle, part throttle/vacuum-to-low boost ranges without any sorts of hiccups. Don't let the size scare you to think that because they are a large injector that they are uncontrollable; they are quite the opposite. If you intend on sticking with a low impedance fuel injector, then stick in the 1000cc-1350cc range if you are only going to be on pump gas/race gas as they will not safely support your goals on straight E85.

 

[Iliketogofast]

Reason I'm worried about fuel is because of the cams. Larger cams keep the valves open longer to let air in and out yadda Yadda you guys know that. But I'd like to know for 36 psi what is the Best choice for cam and what size of injector provides enough fuel to keep air to fuel at optimal and I have stated I will be running water meth injection. And back to the cams. And for that specific cam say it be 272s or 280s I'd like to use 280s but valve spring is bothering me. I could end up with to stiff of spring or too light and end up with larger problems. This is a planned build I'm not cutting corners I spent several months picking parts out that will be great for the talon . Even got a binder full of to do lists and procedures. It's bothering me ### I've been stuck on the psi vs fuel vs open close time and valve springs as I don't know much about them. I have looked it up many times but all I get most of the time is arguments about it or indirect info. And thanks for the hp calculator. And I don't think my question is too difficult either it's all compatibility if I had known what I was going to need for the head I wouldn't be asking guys who have done it before. I was planning on 1650cc injectors but I wanna go with 280 cams so I wasn't sure if it would be enough. I don't wanna rush my build either so I haven't ordered any of the parts of the head. I got the car all tore apart I'm just gathering info. See what other people suggest and make an informed decision from there money's not a problem I'm gunna go all out ### I love my car haha. Got vertical doors new paint under coated it new sound system xD. And I'm not getting all heated up but I like to get to the point on the head. I have copper retainers all ready new seals fluid damper block will be O ringed. Already blew my head gasket on my first build by using stock. I've got exhaust covered tho as for clutch I got a act twin disc on the way the 770 torque looks perfect for my goals. And 700 is a goal but if I only make. 550 600 ill be happy but building for more and being able to safe tune sounds like a good idea to me. I won't be bugging you guys about timing and how to install or build it. I got that covered. Extremely carefull measurements and take my time. I romance every part. That and I have a Chrysler service book for electrical and mechanical as I used to be a tech there but the allur of oilfield money draws me in . And hole set turbos suck idk how many times I'd replace them on cummins for being burnt up. Once again thanks for the help and if anyone has the time to text or talk further about the head and give insight about the cams that'd be great. I'm a cool guy and i bet you guys are too after all we drive a DSM