Resolved GVR-4 - Another coolant boiling thread

[DarkKnight86]

So I'm having this problem with my coolant boiling in the overflow but my car temp gauge is staying in the middle. When I log the data using ecmlink my temps go from 180 then 200-223. The highest temp I seen was 226. I have done a compression test and have 160 across the board, replaced my head gasket twice and head l19 head botls are tq'd to 100 lbs, replaced the thermostat twice, changed from a 90 style water neck back to the coolant neck with the coolant temp sensor on top. When I burped the coolant system I notice the coolant isn't circulating, rather just rises. I just went from a 16g to hy35 turbo. My water pipe isn't wrapped, I am using a scircco radiator from amazon. I have searched countless of overheating threads on the form, galantvr4.org, dsmtalk and googled. I'm going to replace the water pump in the morning and if that doesn't work I will get my spare head resurfaced and redo the head gasket again.

I'm thinking it could be the radiator I'm using from amazon. My water pump is a gates water pump, current head gasket is a fel pro that I copper sprayed on both sides. At this point I'm lost and probably put the car back on jackstands.

 

[motomattx]

Try a new radiator cap before going any further.

 

[DarkKnight86]

I've tried 3 radiator caps, 3 thermostats also. I don't see the coolant flowing, it only rise and that is it.

 

[FIBA M - EC17PSE]

So when you got the cap off and its upto temp and fans kick on yoir not seeing any fluid moving. You got a blockage then somewhere. Is the gates pump impeller still attached as those are plastic ones right. Is the bottom rad hose getting hot? To me it certainly seems like your blocked due to no flow of coolant

 

[Vegas Smith]

Sorry you’re having all these problems. I would also think your water pump isn’t working.

 

[Stapl3]

There's a giant air pocket in your system. You have to take the cap off, start the car, and let it idle until the thermostat opens. You have to baby sit it waiting for it to open so you can add fluid. This could easily take half an hour. I've done this probably 20 times and it's always the same. Right when you're about to give up and think nothing's happening and this is a giant waste of time, it opens.

edit: I'll also add that I've done this method to a myriad of other cars from the 90's and it's still the same deal. My Montero I had to idle for almost an hour, a Dodge Ram I remember doing was 45 minutes. No one I know does this right and has problems because it takes so much time and patience, hence me stepping in and say let me just do it . There's probably better methods but this 100% works. Eventually the thermostat will crack open and then it's mind blowing how much coolant can be added, bubbles pop out, etc. Have 20-30oz of water/coolant on hand! Once it opens you can blip the throttle and get some bubbles out from the thermostat housing, and it'll surge/puke too sometimes. You're not going to get it 100% (maybe 98% instead of your current 85%) but if the reservoir is connected properly and half full it will be 100% correct after one or two hot drives followed by parking the car and letting it sit.

 

[DarkKnight86]

I have heat, I redid my heater hose as well. I just replaced my water pump, I did see coolant starting to flow re bled the system. After bleeding the system I took it down the street and running stream watched the temps climb from 186 to 216. Turned around pulled the car back into the garage waited for the car to cool down a little. Coolant was full in the overflow bottle. Opened up the radiator cap and upper hose was empty. I topped it off and left the cap open, temps was 190 and climbed to 216, I noticed a bunch of bubbles so I will be getting a spare head sent off the machine shop.

 

[Stapl3]

I have heat, I redid my heater hose as well. I just replaced my water pump, I did see coolant starting to flow re bled the system. After bleeding the system I took it down the street and running stream watched the temps climb from 186 to 216. Turned around pulled the car back into the garage waited for the car to cool down a little. Coolant was full in the overflow bottle. Opened up the radiator cap and upper hose was empty. I topped it off and left the cap open, temps was 190 and climbed to 216, I noticed a bunch of bubbles so I will be getting a spare head sent off the machine shop.

I encourage you to try my method above. It was empty under your cap because the thermostat opened and there was the air. You were chipping away at the process without knowing it. BUT, eventually you'll open that cap and it has coolant there, and well, I wouldn't want any part of being there while opening it.

Sorry you’re having all these problems. I would also think your water pump isn’t working.

It's belt driven. There's no option for it aside of spin. It's not gonna move an air pocket well though, and that's the bi*** of it all.

 

[DarkKnight86]

I will try again after work tomorrow. It would be nice if it works, if not I will be sending off my spare head to the machine shop.

 

[motomattx]

If you think that you have a cracked head or bad head gasket, there is a set up that you can rent (for free) at most local parts stores that will use a chemically reactive liquid to check for by products of combustion in the coolant system, the blue fluid changes colors in the presence of combustion gasses, its not hard to use or very time consuming.

 

[DarkKnight86]

I bought the coolant tester that came with the blue fluid and vacuum pump and the fluid didn't change to yellow. When I get home from work, I will try what Stapl3 recommend.

 

[AWD-Tony]

Is your coolant temp sensor new and is it from the parts store? Reason I ask is because I bought one from the parts store just to have a new one and it was acting funny. It would jump real high and actually skip the 190's. Threw my old one back on and it was fine.

I know you have coolant flow now that you've replaced the wp.
Just an FYI - If you suspect your water pump isn't moving coolant, you can remove the thermostat to inspect the flow with the cap off.

 

[TerminalTalon]

Before anything you need to pressure test the cooling system.

 

[TCB91GSX]

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I bought one of these and happy I did. They are cheap on Amazon right now, probably $50 at your local parts store. IF there is a bubble in the system or you are having trouble burping this works like a charm. Screw it on, fill the funnel with coolant, and let your car run and take as much/little of anti-freeze as it needs. Once you are done, it comes with a plug to stick in and take out. You can take the excess and put it back into the jug.

 

[rEclipserGST]

What was the first waterpump you had? Was it also a Gates waterpump?

 

[Vegas Smith]

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I bought one of these and happy I did. They are cheap on Amazon right now, probably $50 at your local parts store. IF there is a bubble in the system or you are having trouble burping this works like a charm. Screw it on, fill the funnel with coolant, and let your car run and take as much/little of anti-freeze as it needs. Once you are done, it comes with a plug to stick in and take out. You can take the excess and put it back into the jug.

This thing is total gold.

 

[DarkKnight86]

Well I tried the bleeding method like I've done and what many of you suggested while running a stream on ecmlink. Temps slowly climbed to 216. So I have an update, I have a bad head. I did a leak down test and air is escaping out from the number 4 cylinder. I have a spare head I'm sending off to the machine shop. Back to being jsb.

 

[Dericsh]

Bummer, but thanks for updating us with your findings.

 

[txbluebeast]

There's a giant air pocket in your system. You have to take the cap off, start the car, and let it idle until the thermostat opens. You have to baby sit it waiting for it to open so you can add fluid. This could easily take half an hour. I've done this probably 20 times and it's always the same. Right when you're about to give up and think nothing's happening and this is a giant waste of time, it opens.

edit: I'll also add that I've done this method to a myriad of other cars from the 90's and it's still the same deal. My Montero I had to idle for almost an hour, a Dodge Ram I remember doing was 45 minutes. No one I know does this right and has problems because it takes so much time and patience, hence me stepping in and say let me just do it . There's probably better methods but this 100% works. Eventually the thermostat will crack open and then it's mind blowing how much coolant can be added, bubbles pop out, etc. Have 20-30oz of water/coolant on hand! Once it opens you can blip the throttle and get some bubbles out from the thermostat housing, and it'll surge/puke too sometimes. You're not going to get it 100% (maybe 98% instead of your current 85%) but if the reservoir is connected properly and half full it will be 100% correct after one or two hot drives followed by parking the car and letting it sit.

X2

ive had this happen with a number of cars and I just sat there letting it boil over and spill until the large air pocket went away also. It's no fun but I don't think it's anything more than a large air pocket as mentioned above.

 

[txbluebeast]

Oh

Well I tried the bleeding method like I've done and what many of you suggested while running a stream on ecmlink. Temps slowly climbed to 216. So I have an update, I have a bad head. I did a leak down test and air is escaping out from the number 4 cylinder. I have a spare head I'm sending off to the machine shop. Back to being jsb.

damn sorry I read this after. Well that sucks
Recently I purchased a complete head from a place in ft worth Texas for a 98 NT that was great and under $400 shipped. It came assembled complete with cams and everything for my nephews car. If you want the information I can send you the link. Sorry for your troubles man, hope you get it up and running soon.

 

[txbluebeast]

Here you go just in case. Found it in my contacts.
cylinder heads international
+1 (817) 229-4408
They will have a rebuilt head for your 4G if you still need one. They will want your core after your install if you go down this route.

 

[waltah]

Needing a new head is definitely a bummer.

The shop manuals for our cars give a procedure for refilling coolant. It's worth looking it up and doing it per the book because it saves you the risk of an air bubble in the head which is very likely to give you a cracked head.

Shop manuals aren't perfect but the things that will cost a dealer big money -- like cracking a head on a customer car -- are pretty well covered.

 

[Widgmaster]

Reading the original post from @DarkKnight86 brings me to this question… You said you have your heads torqued to 100lbs?. Did you use new head bolts? From every thing I have read, there is a chance the original bolts may be stretched, giving you a faults reading. Any professional builder will tell you, always use new head bolts.
Is there a possibility this may be your problem. Also, I may mention, elevating the front of the car while burping the rad will help.

 

[DarkKnight86]

Well after getting the head back from the machine shop and putting a new head gasket as well. I'm still pushing coolant into the reservoir. I will be getting new studs, doing the head gasket again. I did a coolant test and the fluid changed from blue to green. I bled the coolant for an hr and temps climbed up to 226, coolant was bubbling in the funnel as well.

 

[TerminalTalon]

Invest in a pressure tester and vacuum filler. It sounds like either an air pocket, radiator cap or the system isn’t holding pressure. Leaning towards the last two.