FP: GREEN vs. RED vs. Garret: T60-1

[niterydr]

argg this #@%#@%#@%#@% makes me mad when people do this, i plan on building my motor and going with a full garret setup (60-1) and am hoping for mid 11's on race gas w/o n20 (hopefully low 12's on pump), if i spray, get everything just right, and don't destroy anything, i may just get a 10.99 out of my car..
how many on this board have (asking how to run 9's, 10's, 11's, 12's) have actually ridden in a 108mph trap dsm? Most of those are 13-12 second cars and they are brutal on the street, i should know, my friend has a galant that is that quick.
this is the last time im posting any sort of a reply to any one of these questions..
if we just ignore the question, it will eventually stop being answered.

 

[thump]

yeaaa this guy up here had a talon that was running 11's, that thing was constantly breaking #@%#@%#@%#@%. That car was a constant project. Seemed like somtehing would break every weekend.

 

[NDgsx]

Did he end up rebuilding his engine or did he buy a jdm one? I remember he spun a rod bearing or got rod knock after his first trip out with the green.

 

[JustDSM]

BrokeAWD sold his Talon... Later buying a Laser and its motor died too. DSM's are hatin' y0!

 

[NosLaser]

...If you want 9s and somewhat reliability then buy a domestic....

This statement makes the most sense of all I have seen. You want a 9 second car? You are gonna need 8 cylinders, not 4. I would venture to say that over time, figuring in trial and error, ANY of the 9 second 4 cylinders you have seen out there have 10's of thousands of dollars invested. You will spend BIG money getting a domestic into the 9's with any kind of regularity. The easiest route to a 9 second car is a fox body Stang, a lot of suspension work, a good stiff rollcage, and a carburated nitrous setup. If you want to take the fun route, you'll use a twin turbocharged fuel injected setup. It will make HUGE power, and cost huge money; to the tune of 30-40K PLUS the price of the car. I have thrown around the idea of a TT Firehawk or C4 Vette, and I was planning on spending upwards of 30-40K to complete my project, which called for about 1300 RWHP. I could throw some terms at you that would prolly fry your brain; and if you couldn't define EVERY SINGLE ONE OF THEM, you would never be able to complete your goal by yourself. If you have a ton of money, you could always drop your car off at some shop, and when it's done, have someone drive it into the 9's for you. Now THERE'S a load of fun! Set some realistic goals. Have you ever even driven a 12 second car? 13's even???

Regards,

 

[BrnOutKing]

From First hand knowledge - (Brent Rau's shop is only 5 miles from my house)

Brent Spend $22,000 on Trannies last year.

How do I know because I was #@%#@%#@%#@%#@%ing one day about how I spent like 11,000 on trannies last year on my 322whp GS-T

Brent was like hey I only get 2-3 pass's per tranny if I'm lucky.

He said at least you got a month or two worth of daily driving.

Anyways... You can have a 500+hp street car.

and if you want to save money.... don't launch...

Our trannies will hold up if you start from a roll..

And as you know if you want it streetable.... you are going to be playing with it on the street..... and as I know...

Most of the 500+whp cars that I hang out with prefer to start from a 40-50mph roll anyways..... why? Because they have huge turbo's and have traction issues and feel safer starting from a roll+ it also saves on Tire wear. (ie: less wheel spin)

I'm thinking when this guys said 9 sec steet car he was thinking I want the set up of a 9 sec car....not that it will run 9 sec...

Hell my car the last 7 trips to the 1/4 track has run high 14's to low 15's..... But with traps of 110mph.

Hell I saw a Supra Run a mid 13 with with a 126mph trap speed.
consistently.

I know it's because he can't hook up..... my issue is I won't launch my car. (ie: see comment about tranny expenses combined with my launching skills don't go well together)

But from a roll... it's a whole new ball game.

Do I wish I could launch YES am I sorry I don't NO.
and neither is my Walet.

Do I have just as much Fun from a Roll as I would from a Stop.

I have more Fun... why? because I don't worry as much about what's going to happen once I let up that Clutch!

And with 500+whp you'll probably won't have too much trouble running down the car that launched.

Just my thoughts and opinions. As I've been thinking about shooting for more HP for the street then what I've got.

another point to think about fast your turbo spools won't matter if your in traffic. (you can't get under boost anyways)

I know when I'm just tooling around I'm usually at around 0psi.


-Brian
just looking to have a car with more HP then what I've got. and wishing I could afford it.

 

[Turboniam]

Originally posted by 2-0turbo
This is contrary to what my girlfriends, cousins, dental assistant told her! ????? : )

ROTF

 

[mclaren55]

Meh, I love standing starts. Basically whatever the guy I am racing wants to do, I will. I have 500+WHP, and thats without the nitrous. I am still on a stock tranny, no rebuilds. 80+ 1/4 miles, 35 dyno pulls. As long as you know how to shift, and launch, you'll be alright.

 

[~97TalonTSi~]

Originally posted by boostineklipz
want a 9 sec car as a daily driver...here ya go lingenfelter twin turbo 427 vette

runs 9.2@ 152 mph and gets 24 mpg on the higway

http://www.lingenfelter.com/images/427TT9.2.mov

A 9 sec big block chevy under boost that gets 24 mpg?? That's pretty much impossible IMO.

 

[NosLaser]

...A 9 sec big block chevy under boost that gets 24 mpg?? That's pretty much impossible IMO....

Yeah, he forgot to mention it's also on PUMP gas with air conditioning, power steering, pulls over 1G on the skidpad, has a 240mph top speed, and comes with a warranty too. How do you like your vTeC now?

Regards,

 

[rdrkt]

Originally posted by NosLaser
Yeah, he forgot to mention it's also on PUMP gas with air conditioning, power steering, pulls over 1G on the skidpad, has a 240mph top speed, and comes with a warranty too.

Lingefelter is nice but don’t you think comparing a 150k TT 427 vette to a 1g Eagle Talon that might have a total 30k+ into including the purchase price a little silly?

You can have a car with no compromises its just going to cost you plain and simple. Speed is money how fast do you want to spend.

 

[90GSX]

Originally posted by niterydr

how many on this board have (asking how to run 9's, 10's, 11's, 12's) have actually ridden in a 108mph trap dsm?

*raises hand* ... 117mph trap, but I bogged the launch, so ET was an absurd 12.8xx.

 

[NosLaser]

...Lingefelter is nice but don’t you think comparing a 150k TT 427 vette to a 1g Eagle Talon that might have a total 30k+ into including the purchase price a little silly?...

Umm..where did I compare it to a Talon? Did I even bring up this car in this thread? I was simply making a statement to the poster who said the car is B.S. and who still thinks vTeC oWnZ jOoZ.

Regards,

 

[DSMotorsport]

how many on this board have (asking how to run 9's, 10's, 11's, 12's) have actually ridden in a 108mph trap dsm? Most of those are 13-12 second cars and they are brutal on the street, i should know, my friend has a galant that is that quick.

Well...Iv had quite a few DSM's in various stated of tune on the street as everyday cars..from my 14.0 gvr4 to the shop car last year (11.5 @ 120 on street, as it rolled in +racegas), From my EXPERIENCE with a 10 sec car....and 11 sec car....they are both alot of car for the street. you give up ALOT to run 11's.

I don't think most guys know how fast a 12 sec car feels. 110+mph traps is big power, and it's good "meaty" power with 16g-20g that feels good on the street everyday driving. It's pretty boring to have to rev and beat the crap out of your engine to boost around. 12sec car is serous power for truly streetable car. Not to mention that's within reasonable budget. my 10 sec AWD has more than $15,000 into it after trading/selling part for part over the years as i outgrew them....i honestly coudn't even add it up if I tried. And Im barely going 10's.

The "theoretical" 9 sec car would be running the nitrous around town, just to make the turbo spool. (note...NOONE runs 9's on a fp red..noone even runs 10's on a red save for possibly 2-3 cars) Your sheet intake and 75mm TB will love the stop and go with stumbling and stalling. Not to mention the 2600/puck or 3200lb clutch your going to need to hold down 500+ft-lb will wreck you. None of the 9 sec cars weigh within 600lb of a stock 1g. repeat 600lb....I see these cars on the scale at street8 events. 3 low 10 sec cars didn't get to keep thier first qualifying passes at Etown because of being underwieght for street8awd 2 poweradder (2750lb min WITH driver)

Any DSM that's going even high 10's is a RACECAR disguised as a streetable car. Anyone going 10's with a Cat? Barely anyone going 10's with a full 3" exhaust even, let alone a cat.

 

[sunflashx]

Originally posted by DSMotorsport
Any DSM that's going even high 10's is a RACECAR disguised as a streetable car. Anyone going 10's with a Cat? Barely anyone going 10's with a full 3" exhaust even, let alone a cat.

Greg Clayton. Still has AC, no weight reduction, full exhaust, non-atm dumped wastegate. Knocking real hard on the door to the 10's if I remember right. No n2o.

Is it possible? Yes.
Is it likely to happen for most people? No.

 

[rdrkt]

Originally posted by sunflashx
Greg Clayton. Still has AC, no weight reduction, full exhaust, non-atm dumped wastegate. Knocking real hard on the door to the 10's if I remember right. No n2o.

So is the definition of a street car is that it has AC and no weight reduction? You are missing Nate’s point. Street legal and streetable are two totally different things as are streetable and daily driver. Its still going to have all sorts of idle issues that any car running 272s and a VPC is going to have. Not to mention that its running forged internals.

I can guarantee you that any car that is races making that much power has been out of commission for a few weeks at a time. I'm also sure that he would be the first person to tell you that its not his daily driver just his weekend/fun car. Although his car is a great example of a what can be done when you know exactly what you are doing.

Originally posted by sunflashx
Is it possible? Yes.
Is it likely to happen for most people? No.

Amen

 

[BatmanGSX]

Owning a 9 second car would be a constant pain in the ass.

 

[4WARND]

" Any DSM that's going even high 10's is a RACECAR disguised as a streetable car. "

Well put Nate ! As Nate and others pointed out already, a 9 second daily driver, forget it, it ain't gonna happen. It takes a * lot * of work to get into the 10's consistently and a 9 second pass is a world away from that. Any DSM that is running 11's or faster is going to break parts, it's the nature of the beast. I have been running 11's for the past two seasons with " minimal " breakage, but I have still not run a 10. My car is streetable ( and I do drive it on the street ) but daily, no way

 

[90GSX]

Mike: Congrats on the new ET. I saw your 11.49 pass at the shootout, but hadn't heard that you'd bettered that. Glad to see the new setup is working for you.

In case you didn't recognize my name, I'm Bill Walls friend, with the blue/black 1G,

I have a few questions for you, if you don't mind, I'll PM you.

 

[4WARND]

" In case you didn't recognize my name, I'm Bill Walls friend, with the blue/black 1G, "

Eric,
yes I remember you, feel free to e-mail me. As for Bill, how is that " hill billy " doing ? Tell him I said hi !

 

[HighPsi91]

I have been racing my DSM for many years. Nate and Mike speak the truth!!!!!!! As fun as it is to go to the track and run mid 10's every weekend, it comes at a price. I miss having a car I could just jump in and go out for a fun drive. I miss going out to the local cruise spots. Could I go cruising around if I wanted to... sure but its expensive and uncomfortable. I think the most fun I had with my car was when it only ran mid 12's. It still had a stereo, AC, pwr steering, etc. You could just go out and have fun with it. Now there is so much invested in the car everytime I get the urge to go take it for a spin I have to ask myself whether its "worth it". You guys need to realise that a race car is a race car. Having a low 11sec and 10sec dsm requires a trailer and then of course something to tow the trailer with as well. Sure i could drive my car to the track..... but it sucks when it breaks, and it sucks burning $6+ gallon gas up just to get there and back. Plus on a hot day its just plain hot and uncomfortable. To all you guys with the ambition to build a 10 or 9 sec car... even a low 11sec car..... all I got to say is take a good serious look at what it takes and evaluate whether you are ready to make the commitment and sacrifice thats required. For most guys you really need to get a clue.

 

[90GSX]

Originally posted by 4WARND
" In case you didn't recognize my name, I'm Bill Walls friend, with the blue/black 1G, "

Eric,
yes I remember you, feel free to e-mail me. As for Bill, how is that " hill billy " doing ? Tell him I said hi !

I'll tell him. Check your email.

 

[Turboniam]

Originally posted by HighPsi91
For most guys you really need to get a clue.

Well said... I have a friend of mine with a "race" car DSM... he misses out on all kinds of fun because the car is exactly that, a race car.

Most people who have turned their street cars into race cars have all said the same thing... "hot rodding was more fun when the car only ran 12s and I could drive it on the street etc."

 

[BatmanGSX]

Originally posted by Turboniam


Well said... I have a friend of mine with a "race" car DSM... he misses out on all kinds of fun because the car is exactly that, a race car.

Most people who have turned their street cars into race cars have all said the same thing... "hot rodding was more fun when the car only ran 12s and I could drive it on the street etc."

This is very true. Everytime I ride in my friends 16G'd 1G I just want to cry. He gets to have fun with that all the time whereas I get to work on my car all the time. I am seriously considering getting another DSM putting a 16G on it and just having all kinds of fun with it on the street.

My current car is way too far gone for that. I just can't bare to part with it so I have no choice but to finish it up. Although if I could go back in time I would have put a 16G, exhaust and 550s in and called it a day.

You guys who want a race car, consider that I am kicking myself for ever trying to turn my DSM into one. I would much rather have my freind's street car.

 

[Turboniam]

My friend with the race car actually bought a "street" car DSM with a blown motor.

He plans to eventually get that one running and just have basic mods to play with on the street... but all his time keeps getting sucked up by his race car and my car which breaks often!