Dual Walbros: Let Me Know What You Think

[diambo4life]

That's well put together.

 

[slowgsr]

the new design is much better..

Much cheaper option then the fullblown setup, which I currently use and works awesome. Just curious what size that 'Y' fitting is? Looks similar to -6an. Seems if you could adapt this to a -10 size it would be a better option for e85, or atleast -8. I know its your car and this will work fine for you, Im kinda just brainstorming.

Awesome job man, I love seeing stuff like this.

 

[Freudie1]

Seriously bad move with the plastic "Y".

Spend the "big" $35.00 for a nice aluminum/anodized/e-85 safe Y fitting and put it INSIDE the tank.

Also, what did you use to run the wires through the plate? I wound up fabbing up some pass throughs via #8 threaded rod and nuts with some slick little nylon collared washers from Grainger (and some neoprene washers of course). Ran one for +, one for -. Agree on the comments about 2 relays versus 1. Only reason I would consider running a pressure (i.e. Hobbs switch) controlled 2nd pump turn on would be if your fuel return line is being overrun, however honestly it would be better to just upgrade the return line at that point.

I'll take pictures of my current setup to illustrate the differences.

My car is FWD, but the idea is approximately the same as far as what is needed.

 

[Boosted98gsx]

Seriously bad move with the plastic "Y".

How so, and please explain in depth.

 

[Freudie1]

How so, and please explain in depth.

Sure, take a look at the following pics of my setup #1 and tell me which looks safer?

#2: Is that fuel rated plastic? Is it E85 resistant? How about the angle of the "Y" (it makes a difference in flow which is one of the main reasons we go through this...increase in flow).

#3: Its part of your fuel system. You REALLY want to cheap out on one of the most vital systems in the car? Not smart, especially when what I am showing in my pics was about $32.00 shipped.

#4: Why reuse stock/oem wire connectors when going through the trouble to rewire the pumps from the battery to the sender? Refer to my pics on how to fab up posts that are sealed and ready for 10 gauge wire directly through and to the pumps.

Pics: ImageShack -

 

[tscook3]

Sorry guys I haven't checked this for awhile.

diambo4life - Thanks bud

slowgsr - Thanks. Yeah it is a 3/8 fitting which is equivalent to a # 6. It will work great for me and definitely saved me some major money.

Freudie1 - The y fitting should be ok. Fuel rated plastic? Not sure. I've never heard of a plastic given a fuel rating. It is a very sturdy plastic, not flimsy by any means. Aren't gas jugs made out of plastic? Yes, gas is somewhat corrosive and it is a little different with the pressure of the fuel flowing through it over time but why not give it a try? Really, who wants to spend between 30- 40$ on a fitting? I don't. In the future, I might upgrade if I have to, but for now atleast it is outside of the tank where I can monitor it. As for the angle of the fitting, is it really going to make a difference on whether the y is outside the tank or inside the tank? I doubt it. If it does, it probably isn't very significant. It just brings the fuel together at a different point. I honestly think it is a little nicer set up the way it is know. About the e85 point- do a search on google- e85 is acutally not much more corrosive than regular gas, if at all. That myth has been "busted" :

E85 Ethanol Is So Corrosive. It Will Eat Your Gas Tank And Your Fuel Lines. Myth by Change2e85.com

or

E85 Conversion Kits Change2E85.com

They are obviously different in how they are made/ what they consist of, but they are actually very same in their acidity. As for the wiring- it wouldn't hurt to redo the wiring like you said but why waste your time on something that is probably not going to benefit you at all, or if it does you probably will not be able to notice. As with my setup and most others that rewire their pumps, they only retain a foot or two of stock wire. With my setup ( wires doubled up, grounded on the sending unit, power to the stock location), I believe it will be pretty efficient. The wiring on the walbro harnesses is 14 gauge, which isn't that small. To strengthen the ground point, I ran a ground from the battery in between one of the mounting studs for the sending unit and bolt. The power is already strengthened through the 40 amp relay and 10 gauge wire. That takes care of the power and now the ground is stronger. I really don't think it is worth the effort to do the extra work. If you want to- cool. Some people are anal and that's fine. I KNOW mine will work great. That's all that matters. Everyone is different and has their own opinion on the " right " way to do things - that's all.

 

[-red97rum-]

Sorry guys I haven't checked this for awhile.

diambo4life - Thanks bud

slowgsr - Thanks. Yeah it is a 3/8 fitting which is equivalent to a # 6. It will work great for me and definitely saved me some major money.

Freudie1 - The y fitting should be ok. Fuel rated plastic? Not sure. I've never heard of a plastic given a fuel rating. It is a very sturdy plastic, not flimsy by any means. Aren't gas jugs made out of plastic? Yes, gas is somewhat corrosive and it is a little different with the pressure of the fuel flowing through it over time but why not give it a try? Really, who wants to spend between 30- 40$ on a fitting? I don't. In the future, I might upgrade if I have to, but for now atleast it is outside of the tank where I can monitor it. As for the angle of the fitting, is it really going to make a difference on whether the y is outside the tank or inside the tank? I doubt it. If it does, it probably isn't very significant. It just brings the fuel together at a different point. I honestly think it is a little nicer set up the way it is know. About the e85 point- do a search on google- e85 is acutally not much more corrosive than regular gas, if at all. That myth has been "busted" :

E85 Ethanol Is So Corrosive. It Will Eat Your Gas Tank And Your Fuel Lines. Myth by Change2e85.com

or

E85 Conversion Kits Change2E85.com

They are obviously different in how they are made/ what they consist of, but they are actually very same in their acidity. As for the wiring- it wouldn't hurt to redo the wiring like you said but why waste your time on something that is probably not going to benefit you at all, or if it does you probably will not be able to notice. As with my setup and most others that rewire their pumps, they only retain a foot or two of stock wire. With my setup ( wires doubled up, grounded on the sending unit, power to the stock location), I believe it will be pretty efficient. The wiring on the walbro harnesses is 14 gauge, which isn't that small. To strengthen the ground point, I ran a ground from the battery in between one of the mounting studs for the sending unit and bolt. The power is already strengthened through the 40 amp relay and 10 gauge wire. That takes care of the power and now the ground is stronger. I really don't think it is worth the effort to do the extra work. If you want to- cool. Some people are anal and that's fine. I KNOW mine will work great. That's all that matters. Everyone is different and has their own opinion on the " right " way to do things - that's all.

This is an old post but I totally lost track of it a few months ago. Good job tscook, looks great! I'm going to use your setup as a guide when i make my own. Are those just -6 bulk head fittings going through the cover?

If you see this, how's that plastic Y fitting holding up thus far?

 

[tscook3]

Dustin-

Thanks. Sorry I haven't checked this thread for a while. Yes, those are just 90 deg #6 bulk head fittings in the sending unit.

All good so far with the y fitting!

 

[1fastlaser]

Glad to hear its working, acually picked up some Y fittings (plastic) through work. Have had no issues, and also pulled the pumps out after 2 months, and no sign of any fatigue.

 

[tscook3]

Glad to hear its working, acually picked up some Y fittings (plastic) through work. Have had no issues, and also pulled the pumps out after 2 months, and no sign of any fatigue.

That's good to hear. The car gets tuned in a little over a week so we will really see how these pumps do!

 

[MidnightTSI]

I really like this setup. The second version definitely looks well designed. How is it holding up? Did you get your car tuned yet? I have been pondering going with the full blown setup but in seeing this I have changed my mind.


I don't mean to thread jack, I just want your opinions on my setup.
I'm not sure if I should go with -6 or -8 for my setup from the dual walbro's. I am going to run the STM tank to rail kit with the russell pro classic hose.

On my current setup I am running a slowboy G-50 (52 Lb/min) and plan on running E-85 with 1450cc injectors. I know these are quite large but I plan on running a much larger turbo in the future. I hope to be around 400WHP with this setup with 25-28 PSI. In the future I plan on running a forced performance 3065 or comparable ball bearing turbo. My goal is to eventually break into the 10's in the quarter with this fuel setup and hit the 500WHP mark or more. I would like to upgrade my fuel system once and be done with it. With all this in mind should I go with -6 or -8? Thanks for the help guys.

 

[1gDSM4g63]

Ideally a -6 AN would be good enough. It's a 50 trim turbo which I believe only flows 55 lb/min, but I don't even think you need to go to dual fuel pumps if you're shooting for 400 hp.

 

[MidnightTSI]

Ideally a -6 AN would be good enough. It's a 50 trim turbo which I believe only flows 55 lb/min, but I don't even think you need to go to dual fuel pumps if you're shooting for 400 hp.

So for 400WHP with E85 I would be safe with 1 rewired walbro? I guess I really have no reason to upgrade until I go with a bigger turbo then. Thanks for the reply

 

[1gDSM4g63]

I really done know if you were to use e85 but as long as you have a Walbro 255 pump you could do it on pump gas.

 

[MidnightTSI]

I really done know if you were to use e85 but as long as you have a Walbro 255 pump you could do it on pump gas.

I am switching to e85 so I will probably need the dual pump setup correct?

 

[pneumo]

one Walbro will support around 450whp on E85.

 

[MidnightTSI]

one Walbro will support around 450whp on E85.

Thanks Pneumo. My turbo will not make a whole lot more than 400 whp so I should be safe.

 

[tscook3]

Yes, you should be fine with a single 255 for now. If you ever want to upgrade in the future, I wouldn't bother with a full blown setup. They are nice and all but a waste of money in my opinion when you can do it yourself and save a lot of money (unless you like the machined sending units a lot). You should also be fine using the stock return line.

The car is doing great with this setup! It is holding up like a champ. I had the car tuned a few weeks ago and it made 471whp @ 23lbs of boost on straight pump and a stock block with a lot more to go. We could have squeezed probably around 540 or 550 on sraight pump with this setup but we were just trying to keep it conservative on the stock block! This is on a 6262 dbb .82 exhaust side with 1200cc injectors.

 

[-red97rum-]

Nice numbers man! I made the switch to E85 and just ran a 12.015 @ 118.90. And that was on the 16G! I'm getting ready to put on the holset in the next couple weeks so I'm really thinking about going with the dual intank setup. Did you replace the entire fuel line from tank to rail? If not, what did you use to connect to the stock fuel line?

Thanks.

 

[matt98eclipse]

Yes, you should be fine with a single 255 for now. If you ever want to upgrade in the future, I wouldn't bother with a full blown setup. They are nice and all but a waste of money in my opinion when you can do it yourself and save a lot of money (unless you like the machined sending units a lot). You should also be fine using the stock return line.

The car is doing great with this setup! It is holding up like a champ. I had the car tuned a few weeks ago and it made 471whp @ 23lbs of boost on straight pump and a stock block with a lot more to go. We could have squeezed probably around 540 or 550 on sraight pump with this setup but we were just trying to keep it conservative on the stock block! This is on a 6262 dbb .82 exhaust side with 1200cc injectors.

Wow toby awsome numbers man! What did you find out your problem was with your car not stayin running?

 

[tscook3]

Nice numbers man! I made the switch to E85 and just ran a 12.015 @ 118.90. And that was on the 16G! I'm getting ready to put on the holset in the next couple weeks so I'm really thinking about going with the dual intank setup. Did you replace the entire fuel line from tank to rail? If not, what did you use to connect to the stock fuel line?

Thanks.

That's great! It's amazing what kind of times these 16gs and other smaller frame turbos can be capable of.

I am still using the stock fuel line! I just had to stretch it out a little bit to be able to accomodate the end of 3/8 " y fitting. Simple as that.

Wow toby awsome numbers man! What did you find out your problem was with your car not stayin running?

Hey Matt! How's it going man? Thanks, the problem was in the dsmlink. It was the deadtime setting for the injectors, I had it set way too low although I was only going by an example setting on dsmlinks wiki section which gave the value for my size injectors. It just needed uped.

You'll have to give me a text or call sometime. My phone has been down for a long time but I have been using my gfs until I feel like getting another one. 717-491-4917. Keep my old though. How's your car?

 

[matt98eclipse]

Hey Matt! How's it going man? Thanks, the problem was in the dsmlink. It was the deadtime setting for the injectors, I had it set way too low although I was only going by an example setting on dsmlinks wiki section which gave the value for my size injectors. It just needed uped.

You'll have to give me a text or call sometime. My phone has been down for a long time but I have been using my gfs until I feel like getting another one. 717-491-4917. Keep my old though. How's your car?

Hey bud yea i have tryed texting and calling your phone but it just went to your voicemail . Thats awsome you got your car figured out and glad to see you got some good numbers bro! My cars coming along pretty good. I got my issue figured out and took it around the block the other night for the first time in about a year in a half and man let me tell you it felt pretty dam good Ive just got alot of tuning that needs to be done.

 

[laserspeeddemon]

^^^ Many guys (myself included) have two pumps running at all times. If each one was on it's own relay and one relay failed, it could be catastrophic in a high pressure situation. If they share a relay and the relay fails, the car shuts off.

If your one single relay is large enough, there won't be any problems. I have a Denso 280LPH and a Bosch 044 running through a 40 amp relay and I have no issues. I'll probably bump it to a 60 amp this winter just for added piece of mind, but to my surprise, the 40-amp has been doing it's job just fine.

Ok I know this is SUUUUUUUPER old, but I was doing some digging to ensure I had a reliable eletrical system for my dual wally fuel pump system and came upon this thread.

Paul, why would you go more than a 40 amp realy? I found that the Walbro 255 pulls 11.5 amps max at 14 volts. So this would be 23 amps total. Even a 30 amp fuse should be able to handle this (though I went with a 40 amp). What was your thinking for going with a 60 amp fuse?

 

[99gst_racer]

Ok I know this is SUUUUUUUPER old, but I was doing some digging to ensure I had a reliable eletrical system for my dual wally fuel pump system and came upon this thread.

Paul, why would you go more than a 40 amp realy? I found that the Walbro 255 pulls 11.5 amps max at 14 volts. So this would be 23 amps total. Even a 30 amp fuse should be able to handle this (though I went with a 40 amp). What was your thinking for going with a 60 amp fuse?

When I posted that, I was assuming the 40-amp wasn't enough to cover my pumps. But as it turns out, my Bosch drew about 15 amps and my Denso about 20 amps, so I stuck with the 40-amp replay and it's been just fine. Although the relay has got prety hot in the past, and I'm not sure if that's normal or not.

 

[pneumo]

My old Supra pump would heat up the relay. It didn't get hot enough to melt anything, but it was hot enough to oxidize the contacts inside the relay. I'm running 2 relays now, one for each Walbro pump. I've never had trouble with relays when they're run at half of their rated capacity or less. Reliability suffers when the relay is pushed near the limit of capacity for extended periods of time.