Dual intank fuel pumps

[BluemeanieTSi]

i started trying to figure out how to put dual pumps in the stock housing but that wasn't happening without major hacking. since it was my only housing i had i started looking for alternatives so i decided to build my own.

the housing cost me about 10 bux and 2 days to make, i still need to wire it.

here's what i started with but this ended up not working well due to return line placement.

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the housing isn't all that thick it was the thickest metal i could find at the local tractor supply company. i just cut a circle to match the upper piece and welded a support rod to it, then welded the inner ring piece for the gasket, test fit to make sure it sealed ok then started on the feed lines. they are 3/8th brake line i bought 3/8th brake unions and ordered 3/8th flare to 6 an fittings from summit. the housing cost me around 10 bux and the fittings cost around 15 total for that part.

(ignore the twisted screens the pumps weren't secured yet for this pic)

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after about a days work (i'm not much for planning things out) i realized i had no room for wiring or a return line. soooooo i started over

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the two 45 degree 6an hose ends clear the back seat with no modification following the factory feed lines. the "y" block is a BG (barry grant) fuel block i got from jegs for around 30 bux and it is 3/8th NPT, it comes with a pressure tap source that needs to be plugged (i see no need to put a gauge back there) the lines are 6 an then 3/8 to 6an 45 degree fittings for inlefts with a 3/8th to 8 an and 8 an line from then on.

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i kept the float for street car use, and i kept the gauge light crap just so i didnt' have to cut it apart. the return line is 3/8th and the vent is 1/4 brake line, i'll be using the factory feed hard line as a larger return line so i dont' have to run another line under tha car i'll use the existing one which i think is 5/16ths

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everything is soldered with plumbing solder and leak tested. here's a good shot of the flare to an fittings from summit.

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here's what i have so far, all the lines (not cut to length) and the filter i will be using (caution this filter is over a foot long) everything is 8an from the y block up including the rail. i will be using a magnafuel fuel pressure regulator as i was not impressed with the aeromotive one i had been using in the past.

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questions, comments, personal experiences......for reference i'm planning on an fp3065 for the setup at the moment.

 

[tstkl]

So as of right now, I have a large majority of the parts I need for either install, single or dual fuel pumps. I just want to know if it is entirely neccissary for the dual fuel pump set up. I will most likely be picking up a GT35R with a T4 .58 A/R exhaust housing (I have the money, Its just a matter of picking exactly which turbo I want) so if I want to, I can always go bigger without having to change out the exhaust manifold and o2 housing and such. My question is, at the peak performance of that turbo, on a built block with a ported head, oversized valves,... the works, will one supra fuel pump suffice? I have my doubts, which is why Im leaning towards the dual fuel pump set up, but I also don't want to have to spend the extra 250 or so on the pump and fittings needed to install the second one if its not going to be needed. Right now my fuel system consists of:
aeromotive 10 -an fuel presure regulator
fuel injector clinic 10 -an fuel rail
fuel injector clinic 1000cc injectors
fuel injector clinic 10 -an fuel filter (its not theirs, but its the one they sell, they don't list the 10 -an, but you can special request it)
my return line is 6 -an and my feed line is 8 -an up to the filter where it changes to 10 -an. The dual fuel pumps will have 6 -an lines going to a y block with an 8 -an outlet. A single pump set up will simply have an 8 -an line from the pump to the filter.

as of right now I am planning on going with JE 9:1 CR pistons and forced performance 2x cams, with 1mm oversized valves (if Im not mistaken, the fp 3/4 cams are designed for stroker engines, and I will be keeping a 2.0 set up). I have a dejon tools smim with stock throttle body, but I might change to a JM fab smim with a q45 throttle body later. I believe this is everything that will effect fuel demands, but if you need any other info on the set up of the car, just ask.

 

[94Jettameowpsst]

Why are you choosing dual supra pumps over a single aeromotive 1000? Reliability? Sorry i cant help with wether or not it will run out of fuel because i ran the 1000 on my 35r'd 1g a while back. Never really had any reliability or drivability issues.

 

[tstkl]

Im not sumping the tank or getting a fuel cell. I perfer the in tank design of the supra fuel pump, and I will most likely be buying the parts needed for a dual fuel pump set up tomorrow. The only reason I started this tread is because I was talking to someone with a T3 GT35R who has one single supra fuel pump and has not experienced any fuel delievery problems yet. I believe he hasn't taken it past 27psi though, and since I am wondering about the highest flow capacities of this compressor wheel, I don't know how much his exact situation applys to me.

 

[94Jettameowpsst]

Idk, i wish i could find my dyno sheet (was 2 summers ago and my first 10 second car) but i made 586awhp at 32-34psi. Im pretty sure the turbo still had a little bit left but i actually hooked up the one time i launched it and ripped the front and rear tranny mounts off the block.
Ran pretty much the same fuel setup as you except i had a fuel cell and had aemems

Now that i look at http://roadraceengineering.com/fuelpumpflowrates.htm you may be able to squeeze by with one pump since you can probably make a little over 600hp with it but since you have the full t4 with a .58 hotside and such high compression, just with the numbers, id go with the dual setup then.
You should post pics before you install it too
Sorry i cant be much help

 

[snox135]

Just keep in mind those number are not pumping through the stock lines, but tstkl has removed those restrictions.

 

[GVR4592]

Just get a single Bosch 044.

 

[Street Surgeon]

If you've already got a supra fuel pump in tank, just throw a Walbro 392 (inline 255 version) in series and you're ready to go, tons of fuel good to mid 700s plus, much more than that GT35R can flow and still cheap, effective, reliable. If you really want to get crazy FP sells a kit with this pump that has an fittings on either end for a bit more.

Comes highly recommended by those in the know.

 

[staticbrainwash]

https://secure.buschurracing.com/ca...d=852&osCsid=3b7e02c8d4c33c5d9a066f4cb0b2e0e3

Is also an option if you hadn't seen that yet. I'm not really sure how it flows compared to a supra, but just another option.

 

[oztofrdm]

DO NOT run two pumps in parallel. All its going to do is kill one of the pumps because the one is going to pumping hard and filling up the line with fuel and then the other one is going to just be pumping and not getting fuel thru the Y burning the pump up till its dead.

Have a walbro or supra in tank, have a 6an going to a bosch or walbro inline then 8an to the filter and rail. The one intank works as a feeder for the bigger inline pump and makes the inline work less harder to create the same amount of pressure. It just gives less stress on the pumps

 

[TRBOBLU]

Ive been working with a company called Full Blown for the last month to develop a dual fuel pump assembly like they make for the EVO http://forums.evolutionm.net/showthread.php?t=247269&highlight=dual+intank+pump
I bought and sent LJ at Full Blown an AWD 2g gas tank and sent him my sending unit. The goal was to make a direct drop in setup with all the factory stuff working perfectly. Its a pretty cool alternative for those that dont want to mount an external pump but want some extra fuel flow(and its nice that finally someone designed a totally NEW part for DSM's). The return line over run problem that 2g's have(when running two pumps intank all the time) should be eliminated with this setup. One pump runs constantly like it would from the factory, and at a preset boost level(adjustable) the second pump kicks on to provide added fuel. This is not a for sale ad so please no one take it the wrong way. I just want to make sure all the 2g's guys know that there is a cool new part out. Mine should be shipping out tomorrow so Ill let everyone how it works out.Here are the pics.

http://i124.photobucket.com/albums/p16/fullblown2k/Picture114Medium.jpg

http://i124.photobucket.com/albums/p16/fullblown2k/Picture111Medium.jpg

http://i124.photobucket.com/albums/p16/fullblown2k/Picture109Medium.jpg

You can contact LJ for more information and pricing.

Full Blown Motorsports
8041 Nicollet Ave S
Bloomington MN, 55420
952-830-1399
www.Fullblownmotors.com
Contact: L J
AIM: Fullblownmotors
Email: [email protected]
Paypal: [email protected]

 

[DSMunknown]

What is this, free advertising? Probably would be a better fit in this thread.

 

[TRBOBLU]

Its not free advertising at all. Im excited to get mine and I want to make sure everyone knows they exist. He makes parts mainly for the EVO so unless I said something no one would even know its out for their car. Sorry for informing the dsm community.

 

[knighteclipse1]

I think its very interesting, you should do a tech article on this subject.

 

[TRBOBLU]

Ive yet to recieve the product yet. So I cant really do a tech article or review yet because I dont have it in my hand. Its shipping out tomorrow but I wanted everyone to know about it before I got it in the mail.

 

[Flash]

Thanks for the info!
Of course it is free advertising, and I like it. I have now learned about a new product coming to the market through TRBOBLU's free advertising.

 

[mygsx2120]

I also appreciate the new information. I have been pondering the idea of setting up my car to run on ethanol and dual fuel pumps are needed, I believe. This might get me one step closer to having things figured out.

 

[fullblown]

Thanks to Eric this is possible. Im busy as heck with other products that I sometimes dont have time to start or finish a new one. Eric has been very helpful in this project. E85 would be perfect for this. The Evo guys are making 700+ hp with the spray of meth.

 

[TRBOBLU]

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[DSMunknown]

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Those filters look really padded. (Looks like their made of cotton or something. ) Other than that it looks like a good piece.

 

[TRBOBLU]

Those were just for mock up. He had some pumps laying around and put them on so I could get an idea of what its gonna look like when he installs the new 255's. The filters must just be old or something.

 

[TRBOBLU]

If all goes well I will have the assembly by the weekend and Ill do a full write up with pics and a review of the product. I have no faith in shipping companies but hopefully they come through(fingers crossed).

 

[TRBOBLU]

Here is the link to the fuel pump assembly tech write up.
http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/showthread.php?t=260010
The quality of this piece is top notch.

 

[DSMunknown]

Can anyone tell me any reason why this would not work?

The idea is to have the Supra intank pump function at idle, low boost and cruise situations while priming the external pump at startup. At mid/high boost the standalone would signal the external pump to activate.

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Sorry I missed this post. Isn't this a similar arrangement to what I posted in post #23? Perhaps you have already contacted Jotech about any questions you may have had, but if not then you can refer to this link to do so. As you can clearly see, it has been done before - it's not impossible, one just needs a little time and know-how to pull it off.


BTW sorry for the late post - another thread was recently merged with this one, and I replied. The thread was un-merged, and this post was out of context, so here it is (again).

 

[alexg1323]

sorry if i missed this earilier in the thread but explain to me how you are syphoning the fuel from the driver side of the gas tank with your set up?

 

[PSI NRG]

Probably would have been way easier if you were to go with a shearer fab. dual fuel pump he has them all fabed ready to install, its pretty much bolt on, for any one wantin dual pumps with out doing their own work. But good work on the doing it yourself +1 Good luck with the project!