Dejon Tool's New BOV... Discussion inside.

[Coup D E'Tat]

As a friend of Dave's I can assure you that he tests all of his equipment at the track. I'd have no doubt that this bov was any different.

Don't take offense to this, but why should anyone believe you?

I'm just saying, that numbers and proven results speak louder than Internet hearsay. If he tests his stuff and all of it checks out, that's fine, because as I said earlier, it won't bother me regardless. However, I do feel that he should post some factual information on it.

 

[mavisky]

Don't take offense to this, but why should anyone believe you?

I'm just saying, that numbers and proven results speak louder than Internet hearsay. If he tests his stuff and all of it checks out, that's fine, because as I said earlier, it won't bother me regardless. However, I do feel that he should post some factual information on it.

I'd hope that the 8 years I've put into the dsm community would make me a trustworthy, but I understand if you don't agree.

I guess I don't understand what you expect. I mean it's just a BOV. If it doesn't leak, and let's air out when it's supposed to then it's doing it's job. Were it a turbo or engine management system I could see where he could fill in more info. I mean it's not like someone is going to run this blow off valve and increase hp (assuming their old one wasn't leaking like a sieve). Dave is a one man shop and I'm honestly surprised he replied to those pm's and e-mails as fast as he did as he's usually too busy putting together his ic piping kits to spend much time on the internet.

Do you want diameter's? springrates? flow volumes? I'm just curious as to why you want so much info on a product as simple as this.

 

[Coup D E'Tat]

I'd hope that the 8 years I've put into the dsm community would make me a trustworthy, but I understand if you don't agree.

Not everyone knows that.

I guess I don't understand what you expect. I mean it's just a BOV. If it doesn't leak, and let's air out when it's supposed to then it's doing it's job.

But no one knows if/where it leaks at.

Do you want diameter's? springrates? flow volumes? I'm just curious as to why you want so much info on a product as simple as this.

Any of the above would be nice.

Why would I like to see it? Because a BOV is a critical part to a turbo system, and I wouldn't trust my turbo to an unknown item.

Again, don't take offense to any of it. I'm just another guy passing through looking for some information.

 

[DGajre777]

I don't see what the problem is. People who complain about low quality products, BUY authentic Greddy and HKS products. People who want a bargain price, buy the made in china/taiwan products from ebay. If quality and name brand is what you want, get the real thing.

 

[Street Surgeon]

The only products I've ever purchased from Dejon tool was their 2.5" 1G UICP, and their 1G intake pipe. I purchased these products from them at the same time having never dealt with this company before. When the parts arrived they were of low quality, the flange where the UICP met the throttlebody was paper thin, the powdercoated finish was terrible and splotchy, the intake pipe had surface rust/oxidation on the inside (not what I want being sucked through MY turbo) and was poorly constructed. I'll never buy another Dejon piece again, and the fact that they're copying a Greddy and schlepping those out makes me think even less of them.

 

[drivemusicnow]

You want an alternative to the 1g diverter valve?

www.boostsciences.com

The "reflex diverter valve" it is 130$.

No, it's not a bolt on, however using a 1 inch tube in and out actually works better anyway. It will hold more than 40 psi, and you can adjust it with the included shims.

They originally were made for the 1.8T crowd, however they are all universal products. 951 guys like them, and are all quality pieces... both the machining and the material.

Or I've got two extra non-crushed 1g diverter valves in perfect condition (one of them is polished) that I may be willing to seperate with.

 

[fwdeclipse]

I have one of the ebay knockoffs and it doesnt leak at 25psi.So it was well worth the 49$ I paid for it.

 

[knighteclipse1]

Don't take offense to this, but why should anyone believe you?

I'm just saying, that numbers and proven results speak louder than Internet hearsay. If he tests his stuff and all of it checks out, that's fine, because as I said earlier, it won't bother me regardless. However, I do feel that he should post some factual information on it.

Not to be arguing the point, but I am sure back when the 1G's first came out, alot of people didn't want to try an unproven product, I guess that makes it their loss. Back then when a V-8 couldn't make much more power then the 1G's I am sure that their were people out there that didn't believe people like us would be driving these cars some 15 years later and going strong at the dragstrips, but we are. Like I said before and has been said earlier in this thread, Dejon is reputable as well as tests their products that they sell. And if you notice by looking at the photo's above, it looks as though he has done some polishing of the exterior as well as putting the logo on it. If it were my company, I would be hard pressed to put my name on a product that I didn't have complete faith in. I understand if you have never delt with him you maybe alittle leary of it. But for my personal preference, I agree with Mavisky on this one.

 

[ITSME4G63]

Im pretty sure this bov is intended in mind to be used as a replacement in case your 1g would fail or a minor upgrade. I doubt they inended it to be a competitor to ones like the hks ssq or the tial. think of it like that. A really nice replacement bov with some performance advantages.

 

[MrPikolo]

What happened to DSMers actually willing to test things out? If I didn't already have a good BOV, I'd buy it just to test it out regarldess of what some people say. Dejon has been around since before I got into dsms. I think they may have been doing business since before tuners was up. The least I can do is trust his judgment.

And if it doesn't work, your only out 70 bucks. Which is nothing considering people have spent much more on ebay items that don't work as they should.

 

[Injected]

Just out of curiosity, where is the HKS BOV made?

I remember quite a while ago people in the U.S. were having kittens about products being made in Japan. Now that is basically the norm, almost nobody has a problem with Japanese made products. Now that China is becoming one hell of a Industrial super power, and a lot of U.S. companies are moving over there, more and more products are going to be made there. I can picture in 10 years we are going to be bitching that something is made in the U.S.

No offense, but there is no vilidity to this arguement. The problem isn't where it's made, but the fact that it is merely a clone. It's kind of like when the Russians built their submarines. They knew what it was supposed to look like and what it was supposed to do, but had no idea how it went about performing it's functions. When you use this kind of process to reverse engineer a product and create an inferior clone, then the product's ability to perform it's function is severly decreased. That is the problem. Historically many products have ended up in China and cloned using low labor rates for a price advantage at the cost of the quality of the product. This is fine for products that don't actually have working parts or need hard research and design between them. Products from Japan have extensive R&D from people who have formal engineering backgrounds, then they are produced to highly refined specifications and must meet strict quality control (QC) standards. For now, China clones are an inferior product. Why do you think that Turbochargers.com was so upset when they were accused of selling a clone turbo (which was false by the way and they are suing SlowboyRacing)?

 

[Joesmoke]

I dont post often, but Ive wanted to vent about dejons products for a while now.

I bought one of their UICP's and will also say that the TB flange and the BOV flange are paper thin. Not impressed at all.

For a company that does extensive track testing, they should know that parts like that are really minimum requirements for quality. Seemed like they did not want to make a quality product, just a cheaper one. Whats this BOV going to be like?

I would not buy another product from them, and would certainly not buy a BOV that they have put their name on. That name doesnt mean anything to me.

But, they have the right to sell any product they wish, and we have the right to choose what to buy.

 

[Stapl3]

I know that BOV from anywhere. They are 17 dollars each from a company in China, DT just went ahead and put a sticker on it.

It's the same thing as is on ebay. Do not be fooled, it's a crap knock off.

 

[omegis13]

I hate to burst anyone's bubble, but has anyone ever actually taken the time to think about how simple of a mechanical part a blow off valve is? There really isn't much to them to screw up, so I don't think trying to say that it is of "inferior quality is the best argument. The ONLY part I would really worry about in it is the seal that opens and closes the valve. However, if it truely is a clone, you should be able to replace that with a GReddy seal, which can be purchased at a reasonable price, if I remember correctly. The only feasible argument I can see to being against the purchasing of the knock off Greddy Type-S is that it takes away from GReddy's profits that they have earned through their original design. Me personally, I'm not a big fan of corporations or giving my money to them. And as for original design, do you really think that the similarity between the GReddy BOV and the stock 1g BOV is a coincidence? They look alike because they are based off of the same simple idea that has been used since the diverter valve was created: a seal that holds closed by introducing pressure above it when the throttle body is open, and opens by simultaneously introducing a vacuum above the seal and pressure below it when the throttle body closes. The only real variance from this design that GReddy added was a screw on the top to tighten the spring on the diaphragm. So if you really feel that GReddy deserves your money for their "ingenuity" then buy a GReddy BOV. If you don't, then don't. But for the love of god, please stop trying to assert that a product is "inferior" just because it is a copy created through reverse engineering. Be thankful that they at least copied a product that works.

Greg Heineken

 

[Injected]

So, all the products from Japan were ALWAYS designed by them and they never used American products to reverse engineer? They were ALWAYS QCed to the highest standards and were never crap? I think China at this moment is the Japan of the past. Yes the products that currently come out of there are probably 80-90% junk, but that doesn't mean in 10 years that they will still be junk. BTW, more and more of those manufacturing companies in China were once in the U.S.

You don't understand the argument. Let me try another route. Can you tell me what brand these BOV's are from? No. Why, because they are not produced by an actual company per se, they are knock-offs. They are made by people originally trying to pass them of as legitimate, but not so blatantly as to have any recourse. Many companies find that if their product is being cloned (take the Harry Potter book series for example, there were knock-offs produced such as new books in the series, and sold as JK Rowling's work, though her name didn't appear on it) in such a way that would not be tolerated for a second over here but is not enforced at all in China, though Chinese officials say their cracking down. However, it has been proven that the very police that are supposed to fight this intellectual property right infringement are more often than not sharing profits with the owners of the 'companies' that are producing them, or just look the other way since they get paid regardless of their performance (downside to socialism is that there is not incentive for growth and why the USSR failed). China has almost no legitimate businesses to speak of and they have had their own issues. China is corrupt and twisted. One producer even made a black-market knock-off of an American brand baby formula which turned out to be toxic and killed 1200 Chinese babies. You can go to China and buy a full set of Cleveland golf clubs (which one person reporting on this phenomena did) and brought it back to the states. The company that actually produces the real clubs says that the knock-offs probably could pass as the real thing to a person who did not know the differences. But when hit with the robotic testing arm, the knock-off was dramatically different. Though it looked, and seemingly functioned as a real Cleveland driver, on the range it performed very sub-par (golf joke). China does not have a legitimized economy in this regards and the only work that is legitimate is imported from foreign countries.

I have extensively studied the Chinese economy (I have a 4 year degree from the University of Houston in Business with a minor in International Studies) and it is false to assume China is similar to Japan in almost any way at any point in their recent history. It is a common Western misconception that they are that grows from the idea that since they are close and seem to have similar heritages, that they are similar, when in fact, they are polar opposites. They were actually built that way, since Japan was supposed to be a beacon of Democracy in the Asias built by the US to be China and the USSR's Cuba. Think of how close Cuba is to the US, during the cold war Castro was a Hero to the USSR. Ever heard of the Cuban Missile Crisis? That is why Japan is considered to be Westernized and in a socio-economic sense are Western.

Hell, I have seen first hand here in the good ol' U.S. crap parts being made (people not caring about their jobs, lack of pay/benefits, list goes on). So, I don't think it matters where the product is manufactured, you may still end up with junk.

Oh, no doubt there are better and worse parts made within all countries. In Japan, look at the difference in quality from brand to brand, but that is a consumer issue of what they are willing to pay for. The thing about China that makes it nothing like Japan was as we rebuilt it after 1946 is that it is merely cloning parts to sell parts in mass regardless of the quality of the product. The reason for the mass exodus of labor to China (and India in the services department) is the cheap labor, however companies who once thought of this as a revolutionary idea are now seeing low quality clones emerge (which are illegal according to intellectual property rights, but not according to China).

Just because something is cheaper than a brand named counterpart, doesn't mean it's of less quality. Like someone said, you're paying for the name.

Understand this, though both BOVs may be made with $30 in parts, GReddy must high engineers, pay their salary and get a building for them to work in and pay all costs associated with that. Then there is marketing and what not to ensure that their name means quality (or whatever they are trying to make their name out to be, some companies don't care if their name means quality like Wal-Mart), and that you can rely on their part to do it right, and if it doesn't, you can return it so that you are getting the R&D and everything that you paid for. The real problem is that people don't want to pay for the idea behind the product, they only want to pay for the materials and maybe the labor. Really it's this new age that economists call 'the consumer age' that generates this problem. Competition and demand dictate price as well, but if a company can't make a profit, they can't take a dive and operate in the red. We have intellectual property rights so that nobody can just buy an HKS, reverse engineer it and sell it for parts+labor. If we didn't, there would be no incentive to come up with a new idea as it would just be copied. That is why intellectual property rights go hand-in-hand with capitalism.

Do you understand now the difference between the two countries, why they aren't anything alike, and why those who want an inferior product, can choose to buy a knock-off part? The idea of buying a name brand part should instill pride and faith in the fact that you have a product that will do what it is supposed to do and do it well because it has actual engineering standards, production standards and quality control standards behind it.

 

[TSIMonsteR]

wow... nice write up.

 

[PieEyedPiper]

So, does anyone own one of these dejon bov's yet?
I have a few predictions.
1. they're identical to the ebay knock off's
2. they're gonna be a fine replacement bov since the ebay knock-offs are.
3. be prepared to eventually shell out for the Greddy membrane.
4. be satisfied with a working and proven bov.

 

[2GeNTSi]

Yeah I would be skeptical about the quality myself but...I'm just going to use the greddy type-s on our old vr-4, I just bought the 1g to greddy adapter for my car, sooo I don't really have to worry about the quality I guess.

 

[Nanan]

3. be prepared to eventually shell out for the Greddy membrane.

This is exactly why name brand products end up costing more then they should. I have seen this practice with several different groups doing knock-off products, sell inferior copy and say get part x from original designer as replacement. Ask the guys at DSMLink about that crap with people cloning their chips.

 

[chicagoavenger]

But why would you spend 70 bucks when the same thing is 45 on ebay. It just says Dejon on it? Makes me wanna buy a box of em and slap some name on it and charge 65 bucks.

 

[Injected]

But why would you spend 70 bucks when the same thing is 45 on ebay. It just says Dejon on it? Makes me wanna buy a box of em and slap some name on it and charge 65 bucks.

Security and convenience. Beyond that, if there is a problem, you can call Dave and get the good customer service that you will be hard pressed to find from the guys trying to make a buck off of eBay.