Cooling intake temps

[soldave]

As you know, warm weather affects the power on our cars. Higher temperatures lead to more engine knock, and when the MAF detects overly high intake temperatures it tells the ECU to takes a degree or 2 of timing out, slowing you down (I am led to believe). And it doesn't get so much hotter or humid than in Okinawa. At the moment we've got temperatures of about 95F with about 80-90% humidity which is on the warm side! And I reckon it could be affecting my car's performance. Doing some logged testing on Saturday, I was starting the runs with an intake temperature of about 125F, dropping to around 109F at the end of the pass, as recorded by the MAF sensor. I have meth injection which will offer some cooling to the eventual air going into the engine, but that's going to be much higher after being compressed in the turbo.

So I'm looking to try and decrease my intake temps somehow. My engine bay looks like the following:

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Due to the nature of the pipework, I can't move the intake and it's not economically possible for me to get another intake at the moment. I have a very cridely made cold air feed going from the driver's side air grille at the front to the engine bay pas where the resonator box used to be. The only idea I currently have is to make a simple air box which will probably have to curl around my catch can (see below for a closer look). It won't be great though due to the positioning of the air filter.

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Wondered if anyone else had any other ideas for getting cold, or rather cooler, air to the air filter and getting my intake temps down a little. I also thought about the vent on the bonnet that is above the air filter, but not so sure how it can be used.

 

[gixrman]

You've got a interesting engine bay setup. Which is cuasing you to suck in alot of hot engine air. you need to isolate your air filter from that air and duct cool outside air to it, somehow. Is that vent in the top of your hood over the AF? if so box in your air filter to the hood. Do you have access to cardboard, fiberglass and resin and aluminum foil?

 

[the_mork]

Making some sort of heat shield or heat wrapping your exhaust manifold will help lower engine bay temps. Heat wrapping your intake tube and ic piping may help too. As for an intake heat shield, start by mocking something up with cardboard, then you can either use the cardboard to trace onto a different material or line it with aluminum tape.

 

[boosted86]

i had similar issues with my setup. i live in south Florida were ambient temps are 90+ on a daily bases. i tried making a box around my intake funnel and it helped a little( maf read 5* temp drop at operating temp) i then routed my intake pipe into my fender and operating temps dropped drastically; staying within 5* of ambient temps. unfortunately,for you and i, the ecu pulls 2* of timing if the Maf reads anything higher then 85*. so even if you have the best intake cooling system in the world your not going to be able stop the ecu from pulling timing ( you cant have operating temps lower than ambient temps)

i would deff try routing your piping into your fender, its not that hard and can be done with a quick stop to your local hardware store. search on this forum for custom CAI and you should be able to see what im talking about. good luck.

 

[soldave]

Thanks for the advice. I've heard very mixed things about the heat wrapping here in Okinawa but might try it. Can I heat wrap with the manifold still connected up to the engine?

And the vent is above the air filter, but currently covered with the metal mesh grille and then a metal vent below that (will try to post a pic over the weekend). My only worry opening that up would be that if it rains heavily then water would be getting into contact with the air filter.

 

[soldave]

Well I've decided to make a JDM Tyte (read botched up from hardware store) cold air feed going to my air filter from under the engine bay using some 10cm diameter ducting. It looks like it cose about $10 (and it did!) but it's doing the job actually when the car is running. Needs a bit more twisting around but I'm getting air temps of about 8C/15F above ambient when I'm driving around normally.

Punishment Racing have told me they don't recommend putting heat wrap on any of their manifolds.

 

[ezz-e]

Hood venting is one of the major ways of decreasing engine bay temps, i would go with that and the cold air intake.

 

[kenamond]

Well I've decided to make a JDM Tyte (read botched up from hardware store) cold air feed going to my air filter from under the engine bay using some 10cm diameter ducting. It looks like it cose about $10 (and it did!) but it's doing the job actually when the car is running. Needs a bit more twisting around but I'm getting air temps of about 8C/15F above ambient when I'm driving around normally.

Punishment Racing have told me they don't recommend putting heat wrap on any of their manifolds.

If you moved the filter element to the end of the snorkel, make sure your snorkel is air-tight or you may suck dust into the motor. If you just put the snorkel around the filter and ran it somewhere lower, you should be good.

You might want to put a heat shield (not wrap) above your ex. mani. The radiant heat from the mani might fry your alternator and blister your hood...that's what sometimes happens on our cars with those glowing-hot exhaust parts.

 

[TOONAH]

Hope you don't mind me putting in my 2 cents worth here. I designed and built a ram air intake system into my project 4G63. See my avatar? The two round black deals in the front bumper are 75mm velocity stack intakes. Seventy five mm's into the turbo, out of the turbo, three inch intercooler pipes, bored out 63mm TB. Any how I want my Turbo to suck in cold fresh air from outside. I also had my wizard, Jimmy, fabricate an air filter box which I installed a 9" mushroom type filter in. It fits snug as a bug next to the fuse box.
Check out the Dog Box race car. He uses some humongus velocity stack in the top of the hood! Straight into the Turbo. The thing looks like it could suck a bloody crow into it .
Look what I wanted to mention is a good cheeep way to keep the air intake cool is to keep the intake manifold cool. There are heat barrier intake manifold gaskets available. They are made out of 2mm thick very high temperature plastic.
Another trick I did on my project DSM (work in progress) was to remove the rubber seal on the top of the firewall and grind the seam down. I effectively created a one inch space all along under the back of the hood to let out the hot air. Who cares about rain. My project car is not allowed to be in rain! !
Oh! one last thing, have you thought about water/methanol injection?

 

[soldave]

Thanks for the advice. Unfortunately my car is driven in all weather and so I could really do with keeping the rubber seal at the top of the firewall. Saying that, I already have washers in the hood so it stands off about 1/2" at the back

 

[weldtuner]

Going with an aluminum radiator and some redline water wetter wouldn't be a bad idea either, also is the factory shrouding leading to the radiator still in place? if not you might want to make some way to direct air to the radiator to help the fan do its job. Looking at your pic, it looks like you could swap the catch can with intake and extend bov line to get filter closer to grill inlet.

 

[soldave]

Thought you might like to see my makeshift cold air intake, which I'm pretty proud of after spending less than a tenner on it! If you look up "JDM Tyte" in a picture dictionary, you will see pictures of this cold air feed!

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Excuse the cracks in the front lip on the last shot. Does seem to make things cooler when I'm on the move. This weekend I am going to make a test airbox out of card to see if I can take the temps down a little further.

 

[chris9149]

I dont know what everyone else will think, but in my mind that is dope. I need to do something like that for mine, granted my intake isn't all up in the engine bay like yours its just in the normal spot, but I would still love to scoop a little cooler air into there when crusing.

 

[soccerplayaz16]

throw some meth at it!

 

[95CarbonEclipse]

Going with an aluminum radiator and some redline water wetter wouldn't be a bad idea either, also is the factory shrouding leading to the radiator still in place? if not you might want to make some way to direct air to the radiator to help the fan do its job.

He's trying to get his intake air temps cooler... not his engine temp.

Soldave,

I like your piping set up and think that one way to improve upon the design would be to route the piping directly on to, and over, your air filter. I realize that right now that's physically impossible due to your strut tower being so close to your air filter. Maybe later on, if you decide to go with a MAF-T setup, you can eliminate the stock MAF and free up enough room to re-route the pipe work you've already done.

 

[talonalex92]

Why can't you just switch the catch can and intake spots? I'm confused there. You would extend the cbv return tube but I think your efforts would be more effective. Also, isolating the filter to your cai, would be killer. As in, only make the filter exposed to the duct you have, with, lets say a box or something. Maybe even a jdm tyte tubo for velocity...?

 

[talonalex92]

Why can't you just switch the catch can and intake spots? I'm confused there. You would extend the cbv return tube but I think your efforts would be more effective. Also, isolating the filter to your cai, would be killer. As in, only make the filter exposed to the duct you have, with, lets say a box or something. Maybe even a jdm tyte tubo for velocity...?

 

[Turbo Talon DL]

You might as well try to 'mimmic' the stock setup as far as the air intake goes if you want to keep it in the current configuration. When I saw your engine bay I thought about switching the catch can's location for the air filter, building an intake heat shield around it there, making it seal with the hood, and pulling cooler air from behind the headlight or something. Even building a small box around the filter with your dryer ducting supplying the cooler air could be done. If there really is a cutout for your air filter in the hood then you could make baffles to help against water intrusion along with a box around the filter with weather stripping attached to the ends of the sheetmetal that you would probably use to build it. When you get your air intake temps under control your gas mileage and power will increase as well as reduced knock count. I built one for my 1g and my temps stay within 10* ambient. Good luck

 

[buddaboost]

water/meth injection or intercooler sprayer. DEI has Some high temp wraps you can wrap all your intake piping and maf sensor. or you can reroute your air filter ther are many thing you can do.

 

[Sp1kE]

He has an evo does he not?

That IS Stock Configuration for them.

 

[blcknspo0ln]

I would remove the grill on your hood and make a fiberglass scoop there, it seems like the perfect location.

 

[buddaboost]

wether or not it is stock location or not you can put the maf and air filter were ever you want. It just takes some fab work and rerouting of pipes

 

[JusMX141]

Switch to a blow-thru MAS. Your intake air temps will no longer be detected before the intercooler, and you can route the intake pipe anywhere you want it without having to worry about a place to put the bulky MAS.

 

[soldave]

He's trying to get his intake air temps cooler... not his engine temp.

Soldave,

I like your piping set up and think that one way to improve upon the design would be to route the piping directly on to, and over, your air filter. I realize that right now that's physically impossible due to your strut tower being so close to your air filter. Maybe later on, if you decide to go with a MAF-T setup, you can eliminate the stock MAF and free up enough room to re-route the pipe work you've already done.

Thanks. I agree with what you're saying and it is a little annoying that the air filter is so close to the strut tower. But that is my current setup and I'll have to work with it. My friend has a spare intake pipe which would probably be perfect as it goes to where the catch can is, but it would need a flange cutting and welding for the BOV tor recirc into. Always a future option though.

Why can't you just switch the catch can and intake spots? I'm confused there. You would extend the cbv return tube but I think your efforts would be more effective. Also, isolating the filter to your cai, would be killer. As in, only make the filter exposed to the duct you have, with, lets say a box or something. Maybe even a jdm tyte tubo for velocity...?

Because I'd need a new intake pipe and would have to play around with my BOV piping so that it still recirculates. While it could be done at some point in the future, I'm looking for ways that would not involve me buying a new intake. The box is something I might look at though.

water/meth injection or intercooler sprayer. DEI has Some high temp wraps you can wrap all your intake piping and maf sensor. or you can reroute your air filter ther are many thing you can do.

Already using a 50/50 water meth mix coming through an M10 nozzle. And I have an intercooler sprayer. It's not the best but it sprays. And as I said earlier, Punishment Racing have told me they don't recommend putting heat wrap on any of their manifolds.

 

[buddaboost]

Im not talking about heat wrap on the manifold, they make diferent wraps at DEI for wraping you intake pipes. Design Engineering, Inc. - Products