Coil On Plug [Merged 5-7]

[talonted_one]

Ok with everything said....Who will make another FAQ on how to do this with a DIS-2?

 

[HybridAWD]

Originally posted by talonted_one
Ok with everything said....Who will make another FAQ on how to do this with a DIS-2?

You wont need a Vfaq on how to hook it up with the DIS-2, it will hook up exactly the same as if you were running the stock coils

 

[APEXiD33a]

whats better the AEM or dis-2 ignition? the aem looks smaller and lighter and seems to put out the same amount of volts.

 

[HybridAWD]

Wait i think my last statement was taken the wrong way.


I said to get the AEM and control each coil individually.....

AEM mean the EMS

Im not sure if the AEM CD2I will even work on our cars, but it might, if it does, it looks a lot better. but then again it's also more expensive. :thumbdown

 

[Mike 99GSX]

I have the AEM CDI with Buschur's COP installed on my car with an EMS. So I can tell you that it works. The car is still at Buschur's so I don't have any more info yet.

 

[i550]

Originally posted by APEXiD33a
whats better the AEM or dis-2 ignition? the aem looks smaller and lighter and seems to put out the same amount of volts.

From what I can tell the AEM doesn't have all of the features the MSD has.

 

[Mike 99GSX]

The AEM CDI does not have any 2 step feature. If you are running an EMS though, this is not an issue.

 

[brads]

Originally posted by HybridAWD
Now ask yourself how many coils you are putting on using the COP setup. If you answered 4 you most likely passed the 1st grade.

OK say our stock ignition output is 40,00volts. Now keep in mind on how many coils you have on the stock ignition. Since one coil fires 2 cyl. that would make so to say 20,000volts per cyl.
Now add the COP you made, still with the stock 40,000 volts your sending it to2 coils, this would break it up to 20,000 volts per coil.
[/B]

Wrong, it doesn't split the coil voltage evenly. I guess that means you flunked out somewhere after 1st grade The beauty of dual output coil wasted spark is that the plug that needs the most voltage to bridge the gap(the plug that is in the cylinder on the compression stroke), gets the most voltage). So it would be more like a 35-5 split, using your example. Plus, just because a coil can make 40000 Volts, doesn't mean you will see that when its running. You will only see as much voltage as it takes to bridge the gap at the plug, which is usually a lot less than 40kV.

And if you put 2 coils in place of the one, that doesn't automatically half the output from 40kV to 20kV. It's much more complex than that.

Originally posted by HybridAWD
The chrysler coils go from 12 volts up to 40,000 volts.
The coils need a really good voltage to "fire" reason being that the MSD DIS-2 works very well.

The different strategies for firing the coils(inductive on the stock, vs. CDI on the MSD), makes them so different that just discussing the voltage into the coil is a meaningless comparison.

Originally posted by HybridAWD
Whereas running 4 individual coils, that puts more of a "strain" on them to try and create a stronger spark. The stock ignition system in our cars like 2 coils, but freaks out trying to put out enough power for 4.

The number of coils doesn't put a strain on the ignition. It is the characteristics of the coil itself that determine how much of a "strain" it puts on the stock ignition, and how much energy and maximum voltage is put out of the coil. The fact that the DSM ECU has a very simplistic dwell control, with no feedback, and the power transistor can only supply a limited amount of current, means that you have to be very careful in matching coils, if you are looking for an improvement with the stock ignition. In this respect the CDI ignitions are a bit easier to work with, as the dwell and coil charging issues aren't there.

Originally posted by HybridAWD
For anyone who i just confused more, just buy a DIS-2

Buy a CDI when you need it. AEMs C2DI seems pretty good, with higher output voltages, etc. BUT, it really helps power only if you are having problem creating a spark, which is most likely to happen at higher boost levels(25+ PSI).

Brad

 

[HybridAWD]

reason im no engineer thanks for summing that up for everyone.

 

[92awdgsx]

i currantly am running the extreme motorsports 4 coil setup. the coils are from a c5 corvette. they seem to work very well.

 

[HybridAWD]

Originally posted by 92awdgsx
i currantly am running the extreme motorsports 4 coil setup. the coils are from a c5 corvette. they seem to work very well.

Any pictures?
what are your boost levels?
Any other info would be good for everyone

 

[92awdgsx]

its not a coil on plug ignition but it can be made to work with some mods. i have them mounted on the firewall right now. i'll try to get some pictures for you. but the coils are compatable with the dsm electrical system and they give you a hell of a alot more spark. i'm only running 16psi right now cause i'm maxing my 14b. i took the stock coils and igniter off and wired them into the existing wiring harness for the coils. i got the setup from extrememotorsports.com. i was told they are from a c5 corvette after i had already got them. they were very expensive from them, but you can get them alot cheaper than what they sell the setup for.

 

[brads]

Originally posted by 92awdgsx
its not a coil on plug ignition but it can be made to work with some mods. i have them mounted on the firewall right now. i'll try to get some pictures for you. but the coils are compatable with the dsm electrical system and they give you a hell of a alot more spark. i'm only running 16psi right now cause i'm maxing my 14b.

At 16 PSI, you weren't even close to maxing out your stock ignition, so how do you know you got a "hell of a alot more spark" from the extreme coils?

 

[BAD-TSi]

What about this?

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/e...item=2475910407&category=6755&sspagename=WDVW

 

[gixrman]

Last time I checked coil on plug system was a no go for DSM's because we use a waste spark system? Correct me if i'm wrong.

 

[boostedinaz]

It can be done but not many have figured out how to do it. Check this out and see if it is for you. I would say that 90% of us dont need it other than the bling factor, but if you got the money go for it.

http://www.buschurracing.com/cgi-bin/ez-catalog/cat_display.cgi?4X376545

Michael

 

[Defiant]

The stock DSM ignition is more than enough. Yes, it's a waste spark, just like a motorcycle. COP isn't done because the payoffs don't justify the fiddling. And of course, because of this, some have chosen to do it anyway. And they call me Defiant.

 

[dave99gst]

http://dsmparts.com/customer/product.php?productid=330&cat=112&page=1

 

[midnght]

It has been done, yes. It works, yes.

The payoffs are not worth the money for most of the people on this site. If someone is going "all out" then why not, but like Michael said, it is a BLING THING for most of the people that do it. The stock ignition is better than what most people give it credit for.

 

[gixrman]

Thats what I was thinking. Yes it looks good and neat (tidie) and I remember reading the headache's that were involved in the DIY project. Just wondering if the ends justify the means. Saw vendor advertizing it. Mine keeps chewing up wires every 10K.........pondering

 

[boostedinaz]

Thats what I was thinking. Yes it looks good and neat (tidie) and I remember reading the headache's that were involved in the DIY project. Just wondering if the ends justify the means. Saw vendor advertizing it. Mine keeps chewing up wires every 10K.........pondering

So instead of fixing a small problem, probably a rubbing somewere, you are going to spend 500.00 to get no farther ahead performance wise. Wish I had that kind of cash to toss around.


Michael

 

[Defiant]

The wire cover makes things pretty tidy, too.

 

[TT_NS]

What do u guys think of the Coil on Plug setup? Also is it compadible with the MSD DIS2 ignition system and would it be worth it to have them both.

 

[Defiant]

I think you're going to find out the same stuff about it as we did last time it was discussed.

DSM ignitions are excellent. Making them "better" seldom does.

If you're just "wanting to do it", then there's no helping you.

 

[badbu68]

You would have to be making MASSIVE horsepower in order for those to be better than your stock setup.