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2G Ceramic Wheel Bearing Interest Thread

Posted by jakelandry, Jan 11, 2020

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  1. jakelandry

    jakelandry Proven Member

    816
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    Joined Oct 13, 2009
    Minden, Louisiana
    Hey everyone, I am making this post solely to see if there would be any interest in a group buy for ceramic wheel bearings for FRONT 2G hubs only (with the possibility of rears following shortly after). I am not a supporting vendor on the site yet so we cant discuss pricing or details unfortunately, but if enough interest is generated, I will pursue becoming a supporting vendor and sharing all details. Thank you.
     

    3K  0

    1995 Mitsubishi Eclipse GSX
    11.410 @ 125.490 · 2G DSM
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  2. Canadian_CD9A

    Canadian_CD9A Proven Member

    474
    173
    Joined Feb 10, 2012
    Winnipeg, MB, Canada
    Curt Brown already does a set for the DSM, but extremely costly. Would you be able to come in cheaper than his cost?
     
  3. jakelandry

    jakelandry Proven Member

    816
    96
    Joined Oct 13, 2009
    Minden, Louisiana
    I am not allowed to discuss pricing but yes I would, potentially by a lot, and I would also offer some additional benefits. If the mods allow my post to stay I would be more than happy to answer any questions.
     

    3K  0

    1995 Mitsubishi Eclipse GSX
    11.410 @ 125.490 · 2G DSM
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  4. GSXbooster

    GSXbooster Supporting Member

    104
    74
    Joined Jun 3, 2003
    Centennial, Colorado
    I'm intrigued and would be interested. This is something I was planning on doing at some point anyway.
     

    Road Race Build 2K  8

    1995 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    awd · manual · 2G DSM
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  5. ec17pse

    ec17pse Freelancer

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    London, Europe
    You changing the grade of the balls? Or keeping to the standard grade.
     

    Road Race Build 9K  10  55

    1997 Mitsubishi Eclipse GST
    175 whp · 180.1 lb/ft · 2G DSM
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  6. mountain_man

    mountain_man Supporting Member

    90
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    Joined Apr 18, 2007
    Merritt Island, Florida
    Interested in both a front and rear set, as well as learning more about some of the "features" you're thinking about, if that's appropriate. To @ec17pse question above, are you thinking about improving the ball bearing design itself or maybe just the housing? Would these be more serviceable / easily replaceable?
     

    Road Race Build 2K  0

    1995 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    manual · 2G DSM
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  7. ec17pse

    ec17pse Freelancer

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    London, Europe
    When i looked into the design it was tricky to do much to it. Not impossible but its not cheap to do either
     

    Road Race Build 9K  10  55

    1997 Mitsubishi Eclipse GST
    175 whp · 180.1 lb/ft · 2G DSM
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  8. motomattx

    motomattx Proven Member

    2,027
    729
    Joined Dec 9, 2010
    wampum, Pennsylvania
    Maybe somehow make it grease-able externally is what he is thinking?
     

    Drag Race Build 3K  24

    1995 Mitsubishi Eclipse GST
    fwd · manual · 2G DSM
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  9. ec17pse

    ec17pse Freelancer

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    London, Europe
    No need to, grease does not remove itself as its sealed
     

    Road Race Build 9K  10  55

    1997 Mitsubishi Eclipse GST
    175 whp · 180.1 lb/ft · 2G DSM
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  10. motomattx

    motomattx Proven Member

    2,027
    729
    Joined Dec 9, 2010
    wampum, Pennsylvania
    Sort of, it does go away though, I have replaced many a burnt up bearing for lack of lubrication in alot of different brands of cars during my time as a tech, sadly even in the year 2020 there is no perfect seal still.
     

    Drag Race Build 3K  24

    1995 Mitsubishi Eclipse GST
    fwd · manual · 2G DSM
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  11. ec17pse

    ec17pse Freelancer

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    London, Europe
    Grease has a life span anyway so if its ran out the bearing needs to be changed. When i regreased mine (was only 3000 miles old) i nearly added a zerk or how ever you spell it fitting for greasing but decided against it
     

    Road Race Build 9K  10  55

    1997 Mitsubishi Eclipse GST
    175 whp · 180.1 lb/ft · 2G DSM
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  12. jakelandry

    jakelandry Proven Member

    816
    96
    Joined Oct 13, 2009
    Minden, Louisiana
    I guess rather than discussing this as a group buy, I can discuss what I will be doing to MY bearings and would be willing to extend to others since I have the equipment and resources to do the work.

    For the design, we are kind of at the mercy of the existing hub which will require us to make “hybrid” bearings with 52100 races and ceramic rolling elements. The bearing outer race, which will have to be reused, is machined into the flange so we don’t have much freedom in modifications. I am avoiding any form of machining because it immediately drives the price up. The only benefit I can see to doing machining to begin with would be if we were to heat treat the races which would require machining afterward for dimensional integrity. I am still considering taking a set and heat treating them without final machining after to test on my own car but as of now do not intend to extend this to the public.

    As far as features and benefits, these would be made using grade 5 silicon nitride balls from a reputable North American vendor and either oem bearing races or an aftermarket of adequate quality. The steel races would be cryo treated which helps prevent sub-surface material inconsistencies from incomplete grain formation which is significantly more common that it sounds. I will also offer an option to press in customer supplied arp wheel studs at a very reasonable rate since I would already have the bearings town down completely and I could build a jig to do them quickly.

    The good news about ceramic bearing lubrication is they do not need anywhere near the grease volume that steel bearings require. They are significantly less prone to spalling, clearance fluctuations from temperature, and friction which are all combatted with lubrication in steel bearings. You can, in theory, run them dry in a completely clean environment as the ceramic balls keep the races polished rather than abrading them with friction like steel balls do.
     

    3K  0

    1995 Mitsubishi Eclipse GSX
    11.410 @ 125.490 · 2G DSM
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  13. ec17pse

    ec17pse Freelancer

    3,586
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    Joined Nov 1, 2008
    London, Europe
    The oem housings are already hardened as you cannot use ball bearings on anything un hardened so all bearings will have a hardened surface.

    I looked into making a housing for taper bearings (i did a small write up on it here some where) the problem is cost of the housing and custom bearings would be a good $600 ish if i remember correctly.

    You could get the races micro polished which would be a nice finish but not sure how to suggest that or who to see about doing it! Lol
     

    Road Race Build 9K  10  55

    1997 Mitsubishi Eclipse GST
    175 whp · 180.1 lb/ft · 2G DSM
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