Building support for a small frame (14b/16g) class at the Shootout!

[SBstar]

Idea for a shootout class. Small frame turbo's.

There's a link to the thread I started on Buschur's. I mentioned it in the 14b thread but didn't want to change the topic on the thread. Is there any interest in this? Would people be willing to show up?

The stock appearing class was done away with for this year due to the fact there is such a small turnout every year. This class would basically be Stock appearing turbo, no other rules apply. Meaning slicks, drag radials, crazy fuel systems, smim's, external wastegates, you name it you can put it on the car.

This would give us small setup people a chance to run against each other, without the hassles of "stock appearing" and we would actually have a class other then Bracket racing to fit into. Most of us know we aren't going to be competitive in Q16, and we can't even fit into DSM Eliminator without a full interior. So pipe in if people are interested.

 

[hubz91talontsi]

Yeah i agree... a 14b car can't run against 37r cars. They offered nothing for stock appearing turbo cars this year.

 

[Auto RS T]

I figured Dave would just turn the Stock Appearing class into a small framed turbo class after his complaints about the class being so small in the past. Still gives us little turbo guys a chance to run each other which I think is a blast, without all the nitpicking.

I run Stock Appearing every year. Last year the round I was eliminated in was the best heads up race I have been in to date. If anybody saw that round, you know what I'm talking about. I'll support.

 

[carfanatic_88]

I run Stock Appearing every year. Last year the round I was eliminated in was the best heads up race I have been in to date. If anybody saw that round, you know what I'm talking about. I'll support.

Hey Man,
Defenatly the best heads up race i have ever had aswell. You had me out of the hole and i managed to catch ya at like the 1000 ft mark. Great race!!

I didnt meant to hijack,

I would be interested in running a class like this, I was goin to enter the eliminator class next year with my 16g setup, as there was no other heads up class i would compete in...

 

[Gooberlog]

Dave seemed to be totally against the idea of a stock appearing turbo class. Does anyone know who organizes the New Jersey DSM (mistubishi) shoot out event. Last year was held the same day as Buschar's shoot out.

 

[Nate Crisman]

Dave seemed to be totally against the idea of a stock appearing turbo class. Does anyone know who organizes the New Jersey DSM (mistubishi) shoot out event. Last year was held the same day as Buschar's shoot out.

I know both Keith (Bean) from TTR who are the main sponsor/organizer for the NJ Showdown at Etown, as well as Javier Ortega who is the import race guy who works at Etown.

If Buschur isn't interested in some sort of TD05H race, Ill see if I can get something going on here. Etown has about 14 staging lanes, I have a feeling we might be able to get our own...even if we have to self police the tech or something.

I'm all hopped up now, I think this could be really cool. Last time I ran a 14B car in 2004, I hit that 11.44 @ 118 pass racing at THAT race in the freakin quick 16 class. (Mitsu showdown at Etown) It was awesome to be qualified ahead of "racecars" with built motors, t3t4's and such.

 

[JEFFREYCASTGSX]

WTF! I was building my car to run in this class, and now this class is gone!

 

[SBstar]

Dave seemed to be totally against the idea of a stock appearing turbo class. Does anyone know who organizes the New Jersey DSM (mistubishi) shoot out event. Last year was held the same day as Buschar's shoot out.

Truth Looks like we'll be relying on Nate to see if we can get something going at E-town. Might make it worth the trip for me out there though, which means two big dsm get togethers, which isn't so bad.

 

[talontd92tsi]

I would be willing to bet if you had 10-15 people PRE PAY for this class David would probably give it a shot. Below that amount of people there is really no point in having the class. I remember he did this for the fwd class that doesn't exist anymore and he had one person prepay. I would be willing to prepay for this class even if my dsm doesn't make it to the shootout (again) . Sounds like an excellent idea to me.

EDIT: I posted the idea on Buschur's forum, let's see what happens.

 

[Gooberlog]

I know both Keith (Bean) from TTR who are the main sponsor/organizer for the NJ Showdown at Etown, as well as Javier Ortega who is the import race guy who works at Etown.

If Buschur isn't interested in some sort of TD05H race, Ill see if I can get something going on here. Etown has about 14 staging lanes, I have a feeling we might be able to get our own...even if we have to self police the tech or something.

I'm all hopped up now, I think this could be really cool. Last time I ran a 14B car in 2004, I hit that 11.44 @ 118 pass racing at THAT race in the freakin quick 16 class. (Mitsu showdown at Etown) It was awesome to be qualified ahead of "racecars" with built motors, t3t4's and such.

Nate, I went to E-town last year for the show down and it was awesome. Main reason being it was only a 3 hour drive compared to a 8-10 hour drive. Chances are, i'll be going to E-town this year again. I see Buschar advertising his shoot out a lot, but i don't know where to find info for the E-town shoot out?? The only place i would think to look (but haven't yet) would be English Town Raceway's website.

Nate, if you have a way to contact the guys that organize the event, suggest a stock appearing turbo class and if they have a way advertise it on tuners, i'm sure a lot of the budget minded racers like us would make it up there. If they hold a class for us, i'll get a trailer and haul my car up there to compete. BTW: 11..4 on a 14b back in 2004! WTF That would kill most of the cars up at a test and tune night too this day, let alone five years ago at a mitsu shoot out.

Truth Looks like we'll be relying on Nate to see if we can get something going at E-town. Might make it worth the trip for me out there though, which means two big dsm get togethers, which isn't so bad.

Well last year they had both of the shoot outs on the same day. So you would have to take your pick at which one you want to go to.

 

[99gst_racer]

The stock appearing class was done away with for this year due to the fact there is such a small turnout every year. This class would basically be Stock appearing turbo, no other rules apply. Meaning slicks, drag radials, crazy fuel systems, smim's, external wastegates, you name it you can put it on the car.

I love it, Shane! I like these rules much better, and I think it could potentially make that class much more interesting.

A few of my buddys have raced in the DSA class in the past and they had to spend some time removing some of their aftermarket parts to replace them with stock parts, and then re-tune and try to make the same power. Sometimes, it just seemed like a big hassle just to run a stock appearing turbo without being thrown in the DSE class.

I think this could open up some opportunity to see some pretty cool cars run in a class like that. I know I'd be interested in running in such a class someday when my 1G is finished.

 

[Nate Crisman]

Ill write up some sort of proposal and email it to both Bean and Javier and see what they say. Im also going to make note that we would be ok with a pre-entry fee if they are on the fence about it. I'd like to see about trying to be sure we atleast have an 8 car field so they can have a "head to head' race for eliminations and not a bunch of bye runs. Last year I think spectator turnout was huge when compared to racer turnout, so "putting on a show" is of some importance.

Im going to basically say we want to have a class with these and only these rules:
Must be:
4G63 engine or "looks the same" varient...4G64 ok.
TDo5H style compressor housing. (any manifold, o2 housing, wastegate)
any drivetrain config ok. Not sure if there are any colts, starions, or mighty max trucks that would try?
Nitrous ok, any fuel ok, any meth injection, water injection....whatever you want to run.

Only thing Im not sure of is Evolutions. Do we want to open this up to Evo8's so long as they retain a stock looking turbo? (are those guys going 10's yet on stock looking turbos?)

I think this sets up a situation where people can come out, run head to head with the same kind of cars with the same goals...announcer can talk about everyone trying for some sort of record. We can give them a bunch of "one liners" on paper too.

 

[spoonman]

This could really be a very interesting class. The limited flow from the 14b would force strong competitors to use innovative engineering and design to stay faster than the competition.


This is why I hate drag racing in the midwest, every single car in the pro class is the same old set up I have seen a hundred times. It is always just a choice of Ford or Chevy, same $hit every season.

 

[SBstar]

Ill write up some sort of proposal and email it to both Bean and Javier and see what they say. Im also going to make note that we would be ok with a pre-entry fee if they are on the fence about it. I'd like to see about trying to be sure we atleast have an 8 car field so they can have a "head to head' race for eliminations and not a bunch of bye runs. Last year I think spectator turnout was huge when compared to racer turnout, so "putting on a show" is of some importance.

Im going to basically say we want to have a class with these and only these rules:
Must be:
4G63 engine or "looks the same" varient...4G64 ok.
TDo5H style compressor housing. (any manifold, o2 housing, wastegate)
any drivetrain config ok. Not sure if there are any colts, starions, or mighty max trucks that would try?
Nitrous ok, any fuel ok, any meth injection, water injection....whatever you want to run.

Only thing Im not sure of is Evolutions. Do we want to open this up to Evo8's so long as they retain a stock looking turbo? (are those guys going 10's yet on stock looking turbos?)

I think this sets up a situation where people can come out, run head to head with the same kind of cars with the same goals...announcer can talk about everyone trying for some sort of record. We can give them a bunch of "one liners" on paper too.

Perfect, and if I'm not mistaken Buschur's shootout and the showdown at E-town are on different dates this year, making this available to anyone to go to both? I think Evo's would have to be out, the FP red's are stock appearing turbo's on an evo and evo's have gone into the mid 9's on them.

Even knowing that run for run I couldn't be competitive I'd still enter because it's a fun class my car will actually fit into!

 

[Gooberlog]

Nate,
I like what i see as well. Maybe to keep EVO's out we could say any mistubishi based model 1999 and earlier with a TDO5H based turbo. Anything goes heads up elimination class. The EVOs are a whole other breed of animal than the dsm. Weather it's a bolt on 1G, or a tin can 2g GSX with a big 16G, everyone could see the potential of the little snails we have on our cars and run good times with them. The only rules should be IMO are 4G6* engine powered, TDO5H turbo and no newer than 1999, anything else goes as long as it meets safety regs and tech inspection. This way anyone that runs a TDO5H based turbo can make it in to the class as long as they are using it in a 1g, 2G, colt, mirage, starion, mighty max, elantra, GVR4, etc.

 

[talontd92tsi]

You would have to keep the Evo's separate because of the HUGE difference in availability of turbos for them that "look" stock. A FP Red versus a 14b.. The Red's have gone 9's and the new FP Black turbo is "stock appearing" too and has made over 600 whp.

 

[nikkeebabee]

It should be a mitsubishi bolt on style turbo class... Alot of cars will fit this class and I think it would be a ton of fun...

If you open it up to evo's you might be in trouble as they are running pretty quick on stock style turbos...

 

[Nate Crisman]

I don't know about seperating evo's. I just looked at FP's website, the pics they show of the Black and Red evo turbo's show FP insignia's cast into the compressor housing and surge ports. 2 minutes to identify that as a "not stock" turbo.

But regardless, If we limit this down to only DSMs, I fear we don't get enough cars. Not to mention that 85% of the evo's that will show up for this are going to be 3200lb streetcars running on radial tires. Nothing to worry about when you bring a 2500lb awd 1g with a 16G & 100shot on slicks.

when I get in contact with Javier, I'll ask him if they are planning to run a stock appearing Evo class or anything that would likely catch the "evo equivelent" cars allowing us to run without them.
Last year the race was combined Mitsubishi Showdown with the Evo vs WRX event. If that's the case this year...great, they'll let DSM's run alone and put the mordern Evo's with the Subaru's.

2009 Mitsubishi / EVO vs. WRX Rules


EVO vs. WRX/STI Heads Up Class:
DOT approved Tires ONLY. Must run full exhaust. NHRA safety rules apply. No Fiberglass front ends. No Lexan. 16 Car field (8 Fastest EVO's and 8 FASTEST WRX's/STI's will compete Heads Up)

EVO vs. WRX/STI Stock Appearing Heads Up Class:
Full Street Trim, Registered, Insured, True DOT Radial Tire, Stock Appearing Turbo (Evo up to 20 G / WRX up to 20 G or VF family OK) No GT 35's or 50 Trims. After market intake or exhaust manifold OK. Front mounted intercooler and pipe upgrade ok. 16 Car field (8
Fastest EVO's and 8 FASTEST WRX's/STI's will compete Heads Up)

EVO vs. WRX/STI Bracket Class:
Dial your own ET. NHRA safety rules apply.

DSM Bracket Class:
Dial your own ET. NHRA safety rules apply.

DSM Stock Appearing Class Heads Up Class:
Full Street Trim, Registered, Insured, True DOT Radial Tire, Stock Appearing Turbo (Evo up to 20 G OK) No GT 35's or 50 Trims. After market intake or exhaust manifold OK. Front mounted intercooler and pipe upgrade ok. 8 Car field.

Street 16:
Slicks OK. Full exhaust. No fiberglass front ends or Lexan. 68 mm Turbo Max. Minimum weight 2800 lbs AWD, 2600lbs FWD. Heads Up. Full interior required (only back seats can be removed) 16 car field.

Then again, unless we get some sort of "unlimited stock turbo" class added, Ill be back in Street 16. (I'll have to bring about 300lb of bricks with me)

 

[Gooberlog]

I don't know about seperating evo's. I just looked at FP's website, the pics they show of the Black and Red evo turbo's show FP insignia's cast into the compressor housing and surge ports. 2 minutes to identify that as a "not stock" turbo.

But regardless, If we limit this down to only DSMs, I fear we don't get enough cars. Not to mention that 85% of the evo's that will show up for this are going to be 3200lb streetcars running on radial tires. Nothing to worry about when you bring a 2500lb awd 1g with a 16G & 100shot on slicks.

when I get in contact with Javier, I'll ask him if they are planning to run a stock appearing Evo class or anything that would likely catch the "evo equivelent" cars allowing us to run without them.
Last year the race was combined Mitsubishi Showdown with the Evo vs WRX event. If that's the case this year...great, they'll let DSM's run alone and put the mordern Evo's with the Subaru's.




Then again, unless we get some sort of "unlimited stock turbo" class added, Ill be back in Street 16. (I'll have to bring about 300lb of bricks with me)

I would try to set it up so that EVOs and Suburus don't run in this class. Not too many of the evo guys last year at the shootout took the approach of sleeper stock appearing cars, but for the ones that do, it's too easy to go fast. Cams, TBE, fuel pump, injectors, MBC, maybe upgraded FMIC, and ECU flash and they are running 11's on stock turbo all day long. For DSMs it takes, tuning, weight mods, all supporting mods, and some killer driving to hit 11s on a 14b. 16g makes it a bit easier but your not going to see 11's in a 16g DSM full weight w/o some tricks up your sleeve. DSMs have to go quick with weight mods and mods, evos just pay that price with the higher cost of their cars.

It should be a mitsubishi bolt on style turbo class... Alot of cars will fit this class and I think it would be a ton of fun...

If you open it up to evo's you might be in trouble as they are running pretty quick on stock style turbos...

Bolt on mitsu turbo would open it up to 20Gs and such and that's kinda getting away from the main thought of this class. The idea was a stock appearing turbo class which would limit to a 14b or 16g compressor housing for a stock appearing turbo. I have seen sleeper 16g turbos which i believe have 20g internals "wheels" in a 16g housing and flow upwards of 47 lbs/min but still appears stock. Granted a mitsu bolt on turbo class will fill up easier, but there would be a giant span of competition.

 

[Nate Crisman]

I do think the class has to be "stock looking" turbo, not just "bolt on". Unlimited other mods, no minimum weight, and any turbo that bolts to a stock type manifold opens the door for big turbo FP3065 and GT35R size stuff. At that point, Street 16 is more limiting than this "stock" class.

As for the evo's...I really don't think we have anything to fear either way from Evo8's and WRX's. Remember...Evo3 16G's are going to be in this class. If I stick one on, I would be planning to run in the low 10's. I just don't see any of the evo8 guys doing the super lightweight/slicks/little turbo combo, they almost always are either heavy street cars or racecars with bigger turbo.

 

[byebyev8]

Exactly what I was thinking, most evo's running the stock turbo dont get into the 11's unless there on e85 or meth injection. They seem to put out about 10-20 more whp than dsms with similar setups. I think including them will make the class alot more competitive. The fastest stock turbo evo is only a tenth faster than the fastest e316g that I've seen at 10.3.

 

[talontd92tsi]

The class entry fee for just the drag race is $35 same as every year. I will run a "DSM Stock Appearing Turbo" class for 1g and 2g DSM's with no other rule except NO NITROUS if you guys can get 20 people to pre-pay for the class before March 1st. I will pay the money for those entry fees back out between 1st, 2nd and 3rd place. IF there are not 20 pre-paid entries for the class by then the class is done forever and will not run this year either. IF you pre-pay and we don't get 20 people by then I will issue you a ticket to still get in and race in whatever other class your car fits into. I will NOT issue any refunds though. There will also be trophies for the class IF you guys can pull it off. Good luck, I hope you do.

Here is the offer. Only rule is no nitrous, so I know that kills that idea for some of you, but if we get 20 people to pre pay for their spot in line, we have a class. I will be prepaying asap (and my dsm has never actually made the shootout ). any other takers?

EDIT: I have already prepaid, doesn't matter to me, the DSM is racing this year at the SO regardless, now i just dont have to pay at the gate.

Prepaid entries for stock frame turbo class

1. Jeff Cole (talontd92tsi)

 

[99gst_racer]

Well, I sure hope to see the class run at the SO.
I'd love to prepay, but my 14b car isn't track ready nor will it be by then. But I sure hope the class doesn't go away because I'd really like to run in it next year (2011) or the year after.



Too bad I couldn't run my 2G in it. It does run a 16G...

 

[SBstar]

Prepaid entries for stock frame turbo class

1. Jeff Cole (talontd92tsi)
2. Shane Webster (sbstar)

I have to admit 20 entries is going to be tough to get too. I figured 10-15 would be a good number for a small class but oh well. As you said, I'm going and paying to race anyways, what's the difference.

 

[95talongirl]

This would be a great idea!!