Broken Exhaust Stud/Screw Removal [Merged 8-8] bolt fastener threads

[RoasT BeeF]

I have two bolts that are broken off inside the head that bolt the exhaust manifold up. Any ideas for getting them out without messing up the threads? I was going to try drilling them out but I cant even get my drill in there. I am also going to need to take the power steering pump off to get to one of them. Anybody done any of this?

Tech Article:
http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/art...-broken-exhaust-stud-removal.html#post1489888

 

[GTM]

Originally posted by 95_GST_AL
I second the easyouts. Got a caliper bolt out with this,
...

Wow, your's is the 3rd caliper bolt I've seen or read about in the last 6 months. I've gone for decades and not encountered this problem. Makes me wonder if they are engineering these too close to the safety margins.

BTW that yellow heat shield in your pict, how long did it last?

Cheers,
GTM

 

[GreddySpyder]

Originally posted by 90 AWD
Not sure actually. It says he tried to get it from the bottom but there was no room to get to it with vice grips. So, I'm jsut gonna assume that the top of the bolt was broken off flush.

You are right in that assumption, the top of the bolt broke off completely flush, the bottom of it is inside of the support beam. Where can I get these easy outs that everybody keeps talking about? Would Home Depot have them? I need to know what I'm looking for when I go in there because they never seem to know anything.

 

[90 AWD]

Sears, PepBoys or any autoparts store should have them. I like Sears and Craftsman personally. Like GTM said, dont cut corners on tools. Craftsman has a lifetime warranty if you break it you can take it back and get a new one. IF you have the other bolt handy take it with you. That way you get a bit thats small enough for.

 

[pudgo007]

I broke the same one out also I fixed it. take every thing out that is in the way of the manifold and VERY carfully drill a tap into it then use a easy out to get it out I garentee that it will not come out right so now go to a local car shop and get a 8mm x 1.25mm time capsole it is kinda like a hela coil. then drill out the hole a little bit to tap the capsole in and go get a 8mm x 1.25mm bolt and put it all back together it sucks but it will work. remember the head is aluminum so be very carefull.

 

[fivestardsm]

Originally posted by mitsugsx95
im gonna try and get it out one last time. Im gonna go to menards and get a bolt exrtacter and try and get it out, but if it doesnt, i think that its bolted donw tight enough to where it wont leak. I have the RRE 4 layer manifold gasket so that kind of helped with taking some of the gap out.

I have had the same problem, along with many, many other people. The way that I fix ALL my broken studs/bolts is a little tricky, but works great. You do how ever need to have a welder, perferably a small wire welder. I weld a small beed on the end of the stud/bolt a little at a time untill the end has enough weld that I can get a pair of vice grips on it then it comes out Very easy because of the heat. I personaly have done this hundereds of times while working on dsm's!!

Steve.

 

[babell2]

The first time I ever had my head off I Helicoiled all stud holes and I replace all studs every time the Exhaust manifold is off. In my book It's cheap insurance. With the turbo and manifold getting so hot it pulls all the heat treating out of the ends of those studs. If you don't believe me look under your hood after some spirited driving late at night and observe the glow!!

 

[GTM]

Originally posted by babell2
The first time I ever had my head off I Helicoiled all stud holes and I replace all studs every time the Exhaust manifold is off. In my book It's cheap insurance. With the turbo and manifold getting so hot it pulls all the heat treating out of the ends of those studs. If you don't believe me look under your hood after some spirited driving late at night and observe the glow!!

That's a bit extreme though effective. There is little doubt the quality of those studs is very poor. Go to your local Nissan dealer and get a set for a 610, 710, 810, Maxima, or Z car along with the nuts c. late 70's and 80's. The later engines may still have them but I left in the mid 80's. These are a silicon bronze and rarely break, don't rust or seize on the threads unless someone has abused them.

Cheers,
GTM

 

[wibblersnatch]

Does anyone know how to remove a broken bolt? For example, from a automatic transmission pan? Because I sorta overtorqued a bolt. The fliter kits directions said 12 ft lbs. But the thing broke.
Oh yeah, one more thing, did i measure wrong? it was my 1st time using a torque wrench, so I'm not sure if I did it right or not. I guess I need an explanation on how to use one.

Thanks for any help.

 

[Defiant]

Are you using a "clicker" or a needle? 12 (book says 14) ft-lbs is awfully low to measure with a torque wrench, it's more of a "feel" torque.
Get a drill, a set of EZ-Outs (any brand or kind of bolt extractor) and cross your fingers. If you're lucky (fat chance, you already broke a bolt) you might be able to get it out with a reversing drill and the new Craftsman broken bolt removers.... if you torqued it off because it had already crushed the gasket (which will need a new gasket as well), it may spin right back out; if it snapped because you bottomed it out with a plug of crud or from being too long a bolt, it gets much more nasty.

 

[turbolover2]

Yeah, you don't really need to torque that. Just make it snug, 12 ft/lbs isn't a lot at all. If you're lucky, the bolt didn't break flush and you can grab it with vise-grips, but that probably didn't happen. You can try to tap it out using a small punch and a small hammer (try to spin it out). But you'll most likely have to do what Defiant said. Good luck.

 

[teg21]

yeah both good anwsers get a tap and die (sp?) kit

 

[Kevin90GSX]

and if you dont want to do it yourself have a machine shop do it for you. I know my buddy broke a couple bolts in a turbine housing and the place charged like 20 bucks a bolt.

 

[Green93TalonTSi]

Ok, any of you guys have any hints on getting an exhaust manifold stud out the head ? I had a bad exhaust leak in the corner and went to tighten it up, and it broke in half, half in my socket and the other half is still stuck in the head. I finally got my 2g mani ported and polished, and bought all new mani studs and nuts. NOw how in the hell am i gonna get that thing out, so i need you guys to help, and hints, tricks, tips, would be GREATLY appreciated.




Greg

 

[GTM]

Originally posted by Green93TalonTSi
...

NOw how in the hell am i gonna get that thing out, so i need u guys help, and hints, tricks, tips, would be GREATLY appreciated.

You didn't mention which corner and if there was anything protruding, if so how much?

If you have not already done so best if you take the manifold back off.

A good pair of 3" Vice-Gip can do the job if you have 3/8" or more protruding. You will use the side not the nose. Grip the stud, adjust screw till you can lock, release, tighten screw and squeez again, do this 3-4 times until you can see the teeth have dug in and made dents in the stud. If you have it so close to the head then cut a tin can or other sheet metal to protect the aluminum from getting scarred as you try to rotate back and rorth a little each time with more towards the unscrew (CCW) direction. If the pliers come off try to set again. If this fails then buy a stud extractor that can grip what remains of the stud. If there is nothing there then you will have to drill and use a _GOOD_ quality easy-out. You then should center punch the stud and using a small drill to establish the pilot, then use the size recommended by the easy-out specification.

Using poor quality tools will only run the risk of even more expensive repairs. If you are not up to the job, don't mess with it. Take to a professional shop. Maybe they will let you remove the manifold there so all they do is the stud removal. If you don't damage the gasket you can reuse.

Any questions or other comments?

Cheers,
GTM

 

[Green93TalonTSi]

Sorry bout that, its the corner near the side motor mount. and I havent taken the mani off, as I dont wanna do thise 2 x's, so i just waited till I got the mani back. I honestly dont know if there is anything sticking out of the head. The threaded end that goes into the head, is what is stuck in there and the other half is sitting on my work bench, it broke right where the threads start on the end that goes in the head ( if that makes sense ). I am deffinately up to par on doing this myself, with the help of my friend. IS there any other bolts, washers needed before I start doing this this weekend ? I have all 9 studs and nuts, anyhting else needed to put the 2g Mani on ? Thanx for those tips man, preciate it.



Greg

 

[GTM]

Originally posted by Green93TalonTSi

...
I dont wanna do thise 2 x's, so i just waited till I got the mani back. I honestly dont know if there is anything sticking out of the head. The threaded end that goes into the head, is what is stuck in there and the other half is sitting on my work bench, it broke right where the threads start on the end that goes in the head ( if that makes sense ). I am deffinately up to par on doing this myself, with the help of my friend. IS there any other bolts, washers needed before I start doing this this weekend ? I have all 9 studs and nuts, anyhting else needed to put the 2g Mani on ? Thanx for those tips man, preciate it.

Hi Greg:

I understand you don't want to pull it 2 times but you should have done the repair and replacement while the manifold was out getting it's work and the stud were right there in your face.

I would tackle the broken one first, I would pull the manifold back off so you can drill straight down the broken stud. By having it off you can get a better idea of right angles to the machined face rather than looking at the curves of the manifold which may trick your eyes. You cannot get MAD, cannot get impatient, allow an hour or more for for this stud. If it only takes 10 min hurrah for your. You may need to file the broken stud flat so you can find the center and use a sharp punch to make a dimple. Again don't use cheap drills for you don't need that to break in the stud. Take one of the new studs and measure the thread length against the drill bit, put a piece of masking tape on the drill so you don't go too far. Once you get the pilot hole then use another drill bit larger of which the tip flat spot is smaller than the hole you drilled, less force to required then use the easy-out drill size. Penetrating oil like WD-40 can help with drilling and actual removal.

If the extractor doesn't work you can then select a drill bit which will just pass through the nut. You then carefully drill the stud which will leave a sleeve if your original pilot hole was centered. Using various picks including a sharp ice-pick you will gently tap on the outside edge of the sleeve in several places to collapse the sleeve to the point you can get a pair of needle nose pliers on a piece and unscrew the remains. If that fails you then will have to use all those picks to pry one side in so it will collapse at the max diameter. If you nicked some threads use a tap just to clean up, don't cut new threads.

If it really gets bad you can go to an oversized stud, these can be a stepped so the nut remains the same but larger in the head or just oversize both ends. The latter may require drilling the manifold larger so it centers on all the other studs.

You may have clearnace problems with the drill motor and the radiator. You may have to rent, borrow, or buy a special drill motor just because there is no room to work.
...

For the remaining studs put 2-3 nuts on them, lock them tight together but not bottomed on the end of the threads. The first wrench closest to the head is a box end which gets trapped but this is the tool which will then be used to remove the stud so choose which side is best for the stud so it doesn't foul on other parts. Once it's broken loose you can then use a 1/4" drive ratchet to speed up the job. You already had one stud break, it would be so much better if the mani is off. If things don't feel good when you try with the jam nuts again try rocking it back an forward. Some cars can be nightmares, others are a joy when you can spin the nuts up with just one finger.

Keep us posted on how it's going. Remember if it's not going well you can always cry uncle and bolt the mani back up and drive to some machine shop where they have a lot of experience. If they charge you $30 it might just be worth it rather than pulling the head.

I don't know the latest state of the art electronic broken parts extraction tools. Some of these use very high freq radio waves which are tuned to the metal part to be removed based on the type of metal alloy. Then with a tiny probe it just eats away at the metal but doesn't harm the surround part. These are found in the aerospace industry because some gorilla broke a screw on a million dollar part.

It won't be cheap but still better than pulling the head. They are not common so don't expect your local machine shop to have one since they may cost 1/4 mil and up. I had to have a 6" double row wheel bearing removed from an axle which had rusted so bad that it just wasn't coming off and the spindles wern't available. It was $60 30 years ago but I'm assuming the tool costs have come down and smaller than a house trailer now. It may take a dozen phone calls to locate who has one close to you.

Keep us posted so we know how it's going.

Cheers,
GTM

 

[GSXlaunch]

http://f2.pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/leche1103/vwp?.dir=/1991+GSX&.dnm=Broken+Mani+Stud.jpg&.view=t

Well, I was moving along and everything was goind good...until this bastard stud decided to break. For some reason my drill only makes indentions and wont cut through. Assuming no other bolts strip or break how long can I go with out having a serious exhaust leak? THis SUCKS! I am tired of these set backs. Please help...wanted to get this thing started this weekend. It has been down for a while now (head work)...thanks

 

[GSXlaunch]

Anyone? I need to get this stud out....or how long can I go with out that one stud??

 

[Coldandafraid]

http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=89339

 

[Mike1992]

get a better bit, sounds like your using a wood bit, get a good easy out set and you should be good to go

 

[jrivard00]

Easy way of doing it is use a dremel with a engraving bit to make a center mark for the drill bit. THen use a small metal cutting drill bit with lots of oil on it so it doesn't burn out and get dull on you. Go nice and easy and remember to lubricate......then use an EZ out on the stud.

 

[GTM]

Originally posted by Mike1992
get a better bit, sounds like your using a wood bit, get a good easy out set and you should be good to go

Exactly so, get the best drill bit you can buy... if it costs you $5 and it does the job it's cheap.

The problem is these studs have seen extreme heat and will case harden from those constant temp changes. I hate to say it but they (Mitsu) could have paid a few more cents and bought a different alloy that doesn't behave this way.

The problem with running it with a leak is damage to the head which can require they machine the exhaust face for you can't expect the cast iron manifold to bend to a surface which is not flat.

Yes the Dremel tool will help making the initial dimple but will burn up any drill for it's too fast. The motor isn't powerful enough to bring the drill bit close to stalling speed which will give you the best cut. That doesn't mean you can put all your body weight leaning on the drill. If you know how to sharpen drill bits you can change to a steeper angle for hard metals. It's only about 5 degrees but makes a world of difference.

Look at the drill face and if cutting edge has rounded then all you are doing is trying to wear your way through. If you can't sharpen then buy another drill bit.

Some day I'll write a post on how to sharpen drill bits by hand which will be far superior to those $60 machines.

Take a look at that other thread from yesterday listed above which will hopefully explain what is necessary.

Cheers,
GTM

 

[terminaltsi]

is there any of the stud still sticking out? i've used some vise grips clamped on tight and then just unscrewed the bastard. it's worked for me several times. give it a try.

 

[beefstew4]

PLEASE HELP
Im sure you all have heard it before, taking exhaust manifold of, break bolts 1-9 off in head. Cant get them out with vice grips. Yada yada yada. Well heres a good one for you all.
Like i said took off manifold got all but ONE bolt off with out a hitch. Thing is this one stud broke off in the head. I tried to drill it out, and my impatience and stupidity i ended up drilling a goofy looking hole with two different bit sizes. I was careful not to drill to deep, but as for the shape of the hole, jeez man its not pretty. I think that the manifold will seal up okay though as long as i can manage to get another stud in there somehow.
Now here to my question. Im working on maybe a max budget of 10 bucks here, i spent over a 1000 bucks on brakes, new manifold, steel brake lines, wheel bearings and a bunch of other parts, so funds is not an option. Im looking for whatever ghetto fied option i have here. Tell me jb weld and im there. Machine shop-not an option. Helicoil-not an option. Cheap and effective is what i need.
i can just about tap the sucker if i drill the hole out bigger, but the hole is already bigger than the studs that were in it. I was thinking of filling the hole with either heavy solder or jb weld and tapping that, but im not sure if that is maybe too gheto fied.
Any ideas will help with my delima, and anyone with experience and advice will be good before i do something stupid. Thanks everyone.
oh by the way its a 94 turbo and im upgrading to a new 2g manifold so any tips on porting would help also, dremel? or no dremel?

 

[92GSXman]

Borrow or buy a heli coil kit. Probably run you about 50 bucks but it's well worth it. What you do is you drill the hold out bigger with the supplied bit, then you tap it and thread in a small threaded collar. Then your new stud will screw into that and be as strong as ever. The directions will explain it better.