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Best way to lower my GSX

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CLEANest98GSX

10+ Year Contributor
64
0
Jun 17, 2010
Maple Hts., Ohio
I have researched many different ways on what options I have when it comes to lowering my car but, I want to know which way is truly the best, most reliable way to do it. I live around many crappy streets so I know I don't want to go too low. So basically what should I do so that the car ends up being perfect? Please include pros and cons if any.
Thanks!
 
The best way to do it would be to get a set of quality coilovers. The 2g has plenty of options, the most cost effective being the ones from DG (Dennis Grant), which use Koni shocks - I believe they're just under $2k. These will give you exceptional handling as well. You'll probably also need to do something to correct camber to bring suspension geometry back near factory specs - most people use camber correction kits - bushings and bolts. To do it right, you'll likely also need to do something to correct roll center with the car being lower than stock, otherwise you'll almost certainly experience bump steer. Not sure what the 2g guys do for this, but once you do that you'll have a better handling car that is lower without the negative effects of having a lowered car.

That's the correct way to do it. Or, you could just go the cheap route and buy lowering springs. But be prepared for inferior handling. If you just want to have it low for looks and don't care about handling, get some Sportline springs. You'll run through shocks like crazy, but it'll look cool.

Once you do all of that, you can look into swaybars, poly suspension bushings, and chassis braces - again, if you're serious about handling and not just the look of being lowered.

As far as bump steer goes, the guys over at Robispec can modify the 2g front sub-frame to fix it. Andrew (Gixxerdrew) had this done to his spyder.

Here's his blog for more info

http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/blo...ont-subframe-dsm-handling-tips-episode-i.html
 
I really appreciate all the advice guys! However, I am not cutting factory springs :nono:. I should have mentioned before that I do not race or do major cornering ect. Just normal driving. So I am looking for the ride to look good and handle a little better than stock. I also do not want to experience any negative effects along the way you know.
Someone earlier posted a link for the tokikos that have the struts and springs included. That combo attracts me right now. However I really don't know how great of quality they are. So obviously i'm leaning towards a nice set of quality of lowering springs and struts/shocks. So any suggestions of the "perfect combo" would be great.
Oh, and what else I should replace if I go that toute would be helpful as well. Just keep in mind, I would like it to work with 18" wheels as well.
Thanks!
 
I really appreciate all the advice guys! However, I am not cutting factory springs :nono:. I should have mentioned before that I do not race or do major cornering ect. Just normal driving. So I am looking for the ride to look good and handle a little better than stock. I also do not want to experience any negative effects along the way you know.
Someone earlier posted a link for the tokikos that have the struts and springs included. That combo attracts me right now. However I really don't know how great of quality they are. So obviously i'm leaning towards a nice set of quality of lowering springs and struts/shocks. So any suggestions of the "perfect combo" would be great.
Oh, and what else I should replace if I go that toute would be helpful as well. Just keep in mind, I would like it to work with 18" wheels as well.
Thanks!
There is no perfect combo. I had Pro-kits and AGXs long ago, one of the most popular combos, and the Pro-kits killed my shocks prematurely. Lowering springs aren't good for OEM shocks or any other shocks outside of Koni really. Though not all have had bad experiences with shocks wearing prematurely. You'll be taking your chances. If you're going to do lowering springs, at least go with Konis. And you'll need camber kits for front and rear. You'll still be dealing with roll center issues though, but many tend to ignore that issue.
 
I beg to differ on that statement. My Pro-kits helped send my brand new AGX fronts out in less than 12 months. Not everyone has had this issue, but many have. You put stiff springs on OEMs or KYBs you're taking a risk. And people don't buy them because they're great, they buy them because they're cheaper than Konis and full coilovers. If more DSMers were serious about real grip/handling, there would be a bigger market for quality coilovers.

Well I guess I'm one of the few that had no problems at all. Mine held up for 2 years and the new owner is still using them with no problems at all. Worked amazing for me and I will probably throw them on my 1g if not get Megan Racing Coilovers. That was just my .02 cents though.
 
Well I guess I'm one of the few that had no problems at all. Mine held up for 2 years and the new owner is still using them with no problems at all. Worked amazing for me and I will probably throw them on my 1g if not get Megan Racing Coilovers. That was just my .02 cents though.
They're definitely a huge improvement over stock - at least they feel way more sporty due to the stiffer spring rate, I don't know that they actually improve grip that much. But they're not great when compared to Konis or quality coilovers (not the cheap coilovers). And as I said, not all have had the problem I had, but you'll find that more than a few have.

My Konis were a huge improvement over KYB AGX, and the Ground Control/Koni combo was about as big a jump from the AGX/Pro-kit as it was from stock to AGX/Pro-it. I'm looking forward to jumping up to a great coilover set and seeing even more improvement.
 
They're definitely a huge improvement over stock - at least they feel way more sporty due to the stiffer spring rate, I don't know that they actually improve grip that much. But they're not great when compared to Konis or quality coilovers (not the cheap coilovers). And as I said, not all have had the problem I had, but you'll find that more than a few have.

My Konis were a huge improvement over KYB AGX, and the Ground Control/Koni combo was about as big a jump from the AGX/Pro-kit as it was from stock to AGX/Pro-it. I'm looking forward to jumping up to a great coilover set and seeing even more improvement.

I know a few people that have gone from Koni's to AGX's with great ride improvements. As well as using them for the track, quite a few have nothing but good things to say about them. I've had all good reviews from my behalf. But I may try out the Koni's and see how I like them from a personal view since I have yet to own them.
 
I have 18" wheels and I lowered my car 1.5" in the front and 1.25" in the rear. In my opinion that drop was very appropriate. Like you, I wasn't really worried about handling, cornering, etc...I was more concerned with the look and stance of the car. So if you were curious how low to lower it, I would consider what I did.
 
I know a few people that have gone from Koni's to AGX's with great ride improvements. As well as using them for the track, quite a few have nothing but good things to say about them. I've had all good reviews from my behalf. But I may try out the Koni's and see how I like them from a personal view since I have yet to own them.
Really? Well, I guess some people prefer more of a harsh ride thinking it's "better", as ride quality could be subjective. I think maybe they were probably happier with the idea that they could get away with paying less for the shocks though. I was speaking more to the actual handling, which I seriously doubt those people saw improvements in going from a Koni to AGX - if so, I'd have to question what they thought that improvement was and what the rest of their setup consisted of. Most people who track their DSMs agree that Koni is easily a step up from AGX when it comes to mechanical grip.

I don't think I know of anyone competing in Time Trials, Club Racing, or heavily into HPDE that uses AGXs (let alone prefers them). I know they're used a little more in autocross though. When I mention the people I've talked to about this, I mean DSMers who actually race and come here to talk about it. You can jump over to our Road Racing forum and look it up, as the majority of the DSMers that have taken their car to the road course more than a few times have been in there discussing competition handling options. I'm not just throwing out the phrase "people I know" loosely. You can find suggestions in that forum from people like Greg Collier, Andrew Brilliant, Dennis Grant, etc. Very respected names in the DSM road racing/autocross world.

Ride quality can be subjective, mechanical grip isn't. When it comes down to it, Koni is a better quality/handling shock than the AGX, there's no denying that. But some people are happy enough with the AGX, as it's a decent cheap alternative to the Koni - and let's face it, DSMers are willing to compromise when it comes to handling, which is what has made the AGX such a popular choice over the years. There are a few DSMers who have tested these shocks on shock dynos, on the car, and on the track over the years (like Dennis Grant) - if you won't take my word for it, look up their findings.

I know some people are going to stick up for the AGX because it's cheaper and it looks sporty with its adjustments and stiffer ride qualities - and like I said, that's great coming from stock shocks. But let's be real about it, they are cheap shocks that are not really meant to be lowered or tracked, even though some do it with decent results. They might be a good solution to the average DSMer who will choose a cheap shock in order to pay more for a bigger turbo, but that's the extent of it. Many have found that it makes more sense to just pony up the extra $100-200 and get the better quality set of Konis from the get go. I know I wish I would have.
 
Really? Well, I guess some people prefer more of a harsh ride thinking it's "better", as ride quality could be subjective. I think maybe they were probably happier with the idea that they could get away with paying less for the shocks though. I was speaking more to the actual handling, which I seriously doubt those people saw improvements in going from a Koni to AGX - if so, I'd have to question what they thought that improvement was and what the rest of their setup consisted of. Most people who track their DSMs agree that Koni is easily a step up from AGX when it comes to mechanical grip.

I don't think I know of anyone competing in Time Trials, Club Racing, or heavily into HPDE that uses AGXs (let alone prefers them). I know they're used a little more in autocross though. When I mention the people I've talked to about this, I mean DSMers who actually race and come here to talk about it. You can jump over to our Road Racing forum and look it up, as the majority of the DSMers that have taken their car to the road course more than a few times have been in there discussing competition handling options. I'm not just throwing out the phrase "people I know" loosely. You can find suggestions in that forum from people like Greg Collier, Andrew Brilliant, Dennis Grant, etc. Very respected names in the DSM road racing/autocross world.

Ride quality can be subjective, mechanical grip isn't. When it comes down to it, Koni is a better quality/handling shock than the AGX, there's no denying that. But some people are happy enough with the AGX, as it's a decent cheap alternative to the Koni - and let's face it, DSMers are willing to compromise when it comes to handling, which is what has made the AGX such a popular choice over the years. There are a few DSMers who have tested these shocks on shock dynos, on the car, and on the track over the years (like Dennis Grant) - if you won't take my word for it, look up their findings.

I know some people are going to stick up for the AGX because it's cheaper and it looks sporty with its adjustments and stiffer ride qualities - and like I said, that's great coming from stock shocks. But let's be real about it, they are cheap shocks that are not really meant to be lowered or tracked, even though some do it with decent results. They might be a good solution to the average DSMer who will choose a cheap shock in order to pay more for a bigger turbo, but that's the extent of it. Many have found that it makes more sense to just pony up the extra $100-200 and get the better quality set of Konis from the get go. I know I wish I would have.

I understand exactly where you're coming from. I loved cruising backroads with my AGX, they seemed pretty stiff and did what I wanted them to do. Very few times did any "hiccups" occur. I guess it just goes for what people honestly want from their suspension setup. Some people like cheap, but for them, it's probably going to fit them best as well.
 
A long time ago, DG liked his super harsh suspension too, thinking stiffness = grip..

Why have so few people read the amazingly detailed and free resource Autocross to Win?
 
My agx's are perfect for what I use my car for. Which is street driving. For the price the are a great stock upgrade. If I were to ever need setup for road racing I wouldnt bother with any spring shock combo. I would just get some coilovers and be done with it.
 
My agx's are perfect for what I use my car for. Which is street driving. For the price the are a great stock upgrade. If I were to ever need setup for road racing I wouldnt bother with any spring shock combo. I would just get some coilovers and be done with it.

Then before you ever start road racing or autocrossing you should read Autocross to Win to save you from buying a $1500 coilover setup that you'll then want to replace.
 
My agx's are perfect for what I use my car for. Which is street driving. For the price the are a great stock upgrade. If I were to ever need setup for road racing I wouldnt bother with any spring shock combo. I would just get some coilovers and be done with it.
My Konis are even nicer on the street than my old blown AGXs, even with 500 lb springs and poly bushings. I think the perfect street setup for a 1g is a Koni/Ground Control, which also just happens to be better than most of the cheap coilover kits on the market for these cars, and head and shoulders above any lowering spring/shock combo. For those who are broke and/or just don't care much about good handling, lowering springs and AGX will do. But as I always say, do it once and do it right. If you don't have the money for it now, save up for the better stuff and avoid having to replace the cheap stuff later. It's like going with a SMIC because it's cheaper. It will probably work but chances are you're going to end up wanting something better later.
 
What exactly is the ground control that you speak of? Are they springs or what?
 
What exactly is the ground control that you speak of? Are they springs or what?
It's a perch/sleeve/spring kit that converts your stock-style struts to a coilover system (though not a true coilover). The perches and sleeves are mounted on the shock and allows for height adjustments and makes it easy to swap in different springs when you need to change spring rates. I run Konis with the Ground Control kit and stiffer springs than the default springs found in the GC kit - though you can choose your spring rate when you order. I also run RRE upper camber plates to have more adjustment.
Ground Control - Coilover Conversion kit, 89-94 Mitsubishi Eclipse/Talon
 
The Ground Control sounds like exactly what I want. I wanted Megan coilovers for the adjustments, but I think I may just copy your setup with the GC/Koni's. Sounds like a much better quality ride.

What rate of springs are recommended for a full weight 1g GSX for a good handling street car?
 
I have had two cars both with Eibach Pro's on them and just simple Monroe Sensatrack. Has great ride, handling, and looks. Been running on them for 4 years now. That is a cheap way to do it. I hear people say coilovers are the way to go but only if you spend good money on a set. Cheap sets I have heard suck. But I love my Eibach Pro's.
 
I have had two cars both with Eibach Pro's on them and just simple Monroe Sensatrack. Has great ride, handling, and looks. Been running on them for 4 years now. That is a cheap way to do it. I hear people say coilovers are the way to go but only if you spend good money on a set. Cheap sets I have heard suck. But I love my Eibach Pro's.
I just did the math on the price:

KYB AGX + Eibach Prokit for a 1g: $718 (from a supporting vendor here)
Konis + Ground Control: $1045 (Konis from supporting vendor here)

The $327 difference is well worth the ability to swap out springs later and adjust height, not to mention the superior shocks for better handling on the street and on the track. And this setup is superior to any of the true coilovers in the under $2k price range - hell, the only coilovers that are likely better are the ones that cost more than 2-3 times that of the GC/Koni setup.

The only problem is that the 1g rear shocks from Koni are now discontinued. The 2g rears look to fit but there hasn't been a clear consensus on whether or not it's a good choice. If it's determined it is, I'd say go with Koni 1g fronts and 2g rears and GC. Everyone that I talk to that has gone this route has been extremely happy with it.
 
The Ground Control sounds like exactly what I want. I wanted Megan coilovers for the adjustments, but I think I may just copy your setup with the GC/Koni's. Sounds like a much better quality ride.

What rate of springs are recommended for a full weight 1g GSX for a good handling street car?
I think you could get away with 400 lb springs in front and 300 in the rear for the street (though I'd see if anyone else can confirm that). The nice thing is you can always buy stiffer springs later from GC if you want. Do some searches in the Handling forum for ground control spring rates.
 
do you still have to get the "camber kits" for the fron and the rear if you go this route? and can you post some links of what cambers I should get?
Thanks man i really appreciate everyones's insights
 
do you still have to get the "camber kits" for the fron and the rear if you go this route? and can you post some links of what cambers I should get?
Thanks man i really appreciate everyones's insights
Anytime you lower the car more than an inch or so you will likely need camber kits. I use the RRE upper camber plates along with Eibach camber bolts for the front. In the rear I used Whiteline camber bushings on the upper arms. This is for a 1g though, your suspension is different on the 2g, but you'll find camber bushing kits everywhere for your car. Here are some from a supporting vendor:
RRE's Eclipse Camber Correction, Camber Plate and Bearing Plate Info

Our other supporting vendors carry them too.
 
I just did the math on the price:

KYB AGX + Eibach Prokit for a 1g: $718 (from a supporting vendor here)
Konis + Ground Control: $1045 (Konis from supporting vendor here)

The $327 difference is well worth the ability to swap out springs later and adjust height, not to mention the superior shocks for better handling on the street and on the track. And this setup is superior to any of the true coilovers in the under $2k price range - hell, the only coilovers that are likely better are the ones that cost more than 2-3 times that of the GC/Koni setup.

The only problem is that the 1g rear shocks from Koni are now discontinued. The 2g rears look to fit but there hasn't been a clear consensus on whether or not it's a good choice. If it's determined it is, I'd say go with Koni 1g fronts and 2g rears and GC. Everyone that I talk to that has gone this route has been extremely happy with it.

But if you're going to spend $1045 on a set of shocks with Ground Control, might as well buy you some coilovers and call it a day.
 
But if you're going to spend $1045 on a set of shocks with Ground Control, might as well buy you some coilovers and call it a day.
Why if it's not better than this setup? The Megans, Ksports, etc, aren't as good as the Koni. But I know everyone is enamored with the idea of having a true coilover, even if it's inferior. There's a reason why those coilovers are so damned cheap, less than half the price a high quality coilover setup like KW and others. Any coilover setup for our cars that are less than $2k is good for height adjustment and a stiffer ride, and that's about it, ask some people in the Road Racing forums that have tried them. If you're going to spend the money on cheap coilovers, might as well buy Konis/GC and get a better setup that will handle like those kits should.
 
I definately would go GC's, Never knew til now thanks to Ludachris,

That is neat how it "lowering springs" are setup with the purches, I never liked the "coilver setups" due to the Super Stiff springs that are in them. Also, with how you can select which shocks you run on the vehicle.

I vote GC's
 
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