Bearing fit issue

[kt239]

Just got my motor back and am having a problem installing my center thrust bearing. The bearing itself is the right bearing but it will not fit on the crank cap at all. The bearing is not wide enough for the cap and if it was it wouldn't fit the journal. Has anyone ran I to this issue? If so how was it resolved?

 

[kt239]

Also a note the bearing will fit on the end of the cap (transmission side) but it interferes with the crank rotation. To the best of my knowledge this should fit in the center with the other one. Any help is much appreciated.

Here's are pics...

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[BIGBLAZE79]

Post a picture if you can. I'm having a hard time figuring out what you mean.

 

[kt239]

Just updated the previous post with some... Pic is of problem area

 

[BIGBLAZE79]

So you can put all the bearing halves on the block side fine, but the bearing half that goes on the middle journal of the crank girtle won't fit? I'm pretty sure you have the wrong bearings then. I ordered 2G bearings and recieved 1G bearings. They all went on but the crank wouldn't spin when i tightened the girdle down. If I remember right the middle thrust bearing is the difference for 1G and 2G.

I would verify the crank is a 2G crank and get some new 2G bearings.

 

[kt239]

Yes that is the scenario but the crank is for sure a 2g 7 bolt crank and I'm pretty positive their the right bearings it's almost like it's the wrong cap. I never took a close look at everything cause I disassembled it and took it to the machine shop because the original crank had scoring on the journals and the one rod bearing was mia. I'm going to take pictures of the exact issue im describing to paint a perfect image here cause I honestly think it's the wrong cap.. Give me 5 min to whip a post up here....

 

[kt239]

Here is the center bearing on the block side without fit problems...

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Now on the cap side here is the same bearing not able to fit...

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But if I put that exact bearing on the end of the cap that goes toward the transmission it fits (the only one it does fit)

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But if I leave it there the notch in the crank will interfere and hit the side of the bearing ceasing smooth rotation...

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And to the best of my knowledge that bearing should be on the same journal as the opposing bearing with the sides. Unless there's something different with these motors?? And if it does go there (which I'm sure it does) that would mean the cap is the wrong one but how?? And if it goes on the end for whatever reason the crank needs machined for it to clear. So my confusion is at it's peak here :/

 

[BIGBLAZE79]

The thrust bearing should be the same width on both halves. Put them together and see if one is different. If one is wider than the other then your bag of bearings is messed up. Take them back. Do you still have the old bearings that came out of the motor?

 

[kt239]

Nope they are the same which leads me to think that this cap is the issue but how could that be? I mean if it was replaced by a previous owner why wouldn't it match up?? Are there differences in these caps from one year to another? I'm thinking the cap needs machined and it will need align honed..... Again. And as far as the old bearing go, yes I still have them but there are scored beyond belief. I knew this car had issues but not to this degree

 

[BIGBLAZE79]

Measure the old ones compared to the new ones. If they are the same then some how maybe the machine shop swapped the crank girdle with some other type of engine. I just don't know of any other engine that has a crank girdle like ours so that seems highly unlikely. I don't see how the girdle would be wider than the bearing, I could see thinner if it was machined down. WTF

 

[kt239]

I just did that actually and they are within reason. Nothing close to the degree of difference in what it would have to be . I do remember during the disassemble there was what looked like a thrust bearing on the side this one fits on. As a matter of fact here is a pic of it in all three pieces it came off in...

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[BIGBLAZE79]

wtf that is not good, that should not happen. Try and see what numbers are cast or stamped into the crank girdle and try to figure out if it is the correct one. There is a mismatch of parts I think.

 

[kt239]

Thanks for helping me be secure in my thoughts on this. What is your view on getting it machined to work correct? Or should I get a new one and hope it's right then re-align hone? Also how do I check those numbers? I was thinking this whole time the owner before last tinkered with the motor cause I know the girl I got it off of never did (good friend). But I now know for sure.

 

[donniekak]

What is the vin on the block? It looks like it's a 98-99 split thrust block The 95-97 look like the bearings you have now. The 98-99 have a thrust bearing in 3 pieces like the ones in your last pic.

 

[kt239]

I will check that when I get home now that you mention that. But this day has landed me here...

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Lol, but for real thanks for that input that may be the issue here.

 

[kt239]

I just rotated my block around and was unable to find and vin number. Is it stamped in sone hidden location? Also if I just get that machined everything should be fine right? I just want to make my Monday plan here.

 

[donniekak]

I just rotated my block around and was unable to find and vin number. Is it stamped in sone hidden location? Also if I just get that machined everything should be fine right? I just want to make my Monday plan here.

If the split bearings came out of that block, they need to be the type that you install. The vin is just above where the top of the transmission bellhousing will be.

 

[kt239]

There is no vin on this block at all I know I'm not going crazy here so here is a pic of that location...

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Here are the markings I do have though. On this side there is 3k, what looks like an up arrow with a 2 above it and what looks like RO and underneath DO7 maybe DO1?

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On this side I have the 4g63 stamp, 7J17 or 7JI7 with a 2 underneath it and another arrow with a 2 above it.

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On this side all there is is this N7.

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And the markings on the cap/griddle are G6N, 7J08 or 7JO8 and another 2 with an arrow next to it.

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So if this cap/griddle does belong to this block then the other thrust bearing half would have to go on the end. But that does not make sense at all does it? Because with how wide the cap/griddle is at that point there's no way a thrust bearing will fit weather it be 3 pieces or 1. So my question remains as to if I will be alright machining the cap/griddle to fit the bearing? Unless it's alright to have the thrust bearing halves in separate locations? And if that's the case the crank will need to be machined to fit it there.

 

[donniekak]

There is no vin on this block at all I know I'm not going crazy here so here is a pic of that location...

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Here are the markings I do have though. On this side there is 3k, what looks like an up arrow with a 2 above it and what looks like RO and underneath DO7 maybe DO1?

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On this side I have the 4g63 stamp, 7J17 or 7JI7 with a 2 underneath it and another arrow with a 2 above it.

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On this side all there is is this N7.

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And the markings on the cap/griddle are G6N, 7J08 or 7JO8 and another 2 with an arrow next to it.

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So if this cap/griddle does belong to this block then the other thrust bearing half would have to go on the end. But that does not make sense at all does it? Because with how wide the cap/griddle is at that point there's no way a thrust bearing will fit weather it be 3 pieces or 1. So my question remains as to if I will be alright machining the cap/griddle to fit the bearing? Unless it's alright to have the thrust bearing halves in separate locations? And if that's the case the crank will need to be machined to fit it there.

You have the wrong thrust bearings for that block. You need the thrust washers that are in pieces, like the ones that came out. The place where the vin should be is blank, must be a jdm, or replacement block.

 

[kt239]

So if I get the other type then everything will work? Just order the 1997+ bearings with the thrust washers and no machining of anything will be needed?

 

[jimbob_843]

I think that you have the wrong girdle. The bearing seats should be the same width. And the split style thrust im pretty sure goes on both block and girdle. I may be wrong but i believe it does.

 

[kt239]

Well I just ordered the other bearings in hopes for it being a cheaper solution then machining the cap. Will update when I receive them in hopes that if anyone else runs into this type of situation they will find this thread. I've never seen a split thrust block though I've heard there are some but I wasn't aware a dsm might have one. Crossing my fingers (rather tightly I might add).

 

[g4ebguy90]

I thought he had the wrong girdle to it, don't even look like it lines up right. I also find it very weird there is no number by the 4g63.

 

[squeak104]

Your girdle doesn't match your block. The block is a non split thrust bearing (95-early 97), but the girdle is for split thrust bearing (Late 97-99). You will need an earlier girdle and have it align honed again for the crank. Then your bearing set will then match block to girdle. Someone was either being cheap before and mixing and matching parts or a previous machine shop mixed up girdles before.

 

[kt239]

The griddle does indeed line up perfectly with the 2 and the arrow facing toward the front of the block. If you try it in the other direction it will not go the whole way on because on the casting. Is it supposed to be able to go both ways? Either way it was align honed with the griddle in that orientation so that's the way I'd be keeping it.