600hp cheap head build

[jpmxrider489]

So I got a set 272/272 regrinds. But I found out that I have to use shims. So would I need to get 3g lifters and different springs or can I just get the shims? The stock head can go a far way. I only plan on reving to 8500 if that on my hx40. I heard that manly springs are pretty good and can go without there retainers. So whats you guys think?

 

[LiquidX]

The shims are needed to put the lifters to proper height with regrinds.

Depending on which Manley springs you get (spring pressure) is 1 factor to your reving.

Get the retainers as well as they should come with them.

Don't forget like the seals to replace and gaskets/timing components if the head is coming off.

 

[kidtsi]

i have a 7 bolt head fully built beehive dual springs, ferrera valves, bronze valve guides etc, cheap and 200 miles hell you can rev up to 9500 on this.

 

[jpmxrider489]

I was trying to avoid taking the head off. Which is why I ask if its a need to replace the lifters, springs and retainers. People replace cams all the time with the head on the car and even without retiming the car. But I can replace the lifters with the head on and springs. So Ive read that no need for springs if your running 272s. With that said, will I be good just to replace the lifters with shims since they go under the lifter anyway?

 

[kidtsi]

Well i know you dont need for 264s but all 272s suppose to be run with upgraded valve train, ill let some else chime in.

 

[LiquidX]

The "272" is just a classification, not all 272 cams are the same otherwise there wouldn't be different choices. HKS 272 =/= Kelford 272. The Kelford 272 is like most other 280s, increased duration and ramp rate.

 

[jpmxrider489]

I got delta. So The lifters can come out with the head in the car? I just want to make this as simple as possible.

 

[boosting_pwr]

The lifters can be removed while the head is on. You are going to have a harder time getting them out while the cams are still on.

 

[jimbob_843]

The lifters are really only held in by the camshaft. Remove the camshaft and they will slide right out or with little effort.

 

[kidtsi]

The "272" is just a classification, not all 272 cams are the same otherwise there wouldn't be different choices. HKS 272 =/= Kelford 272. The Kelford 272 is like most other 280s, increased duration and ramp rate.

Taking about regrind they are probably HKS exact regrinds which requiere upgraded springs, im sure the is people that is gonna say "it worked for me" just like the "my ebay turbo is doing good for 20k miles and still going".

 

[jpmxrider489]

There delta 272s. Ill probably just upgrade to 3g lifters with shims and call it done. Is that going to work?

 

[big_d]

Let us know how those stock valves float at 8.5k

 

[kidtsi]

Let us know how those stock valves float at 8.5k

They even float at that level with stock cams dont they? my sugestion is atleast get evo valve sprigs or say bye bye to your valves at 8k+.

This week people had been asking for suggestion and if they hear what they dont wanna hear, they get mad.

 

[camfast]

I have a budget 1g cylinder head with evo 8 springs/retainers and HKS 272 cams. This should be able to support 600 hp without any issues. It would be the same for a 2g head.

 

[jpmxrider489]

So you think i should get different springs? Im thinking manly on stock retainers. But the head has to come off to do springs? I dont understand, people do cam both stock springs all the time.

 

[BogusSVO]

No you can swap springs on the head on the car, but it is a PITA, and in all likelyhood take longer than just pulling the head and doing a spring swap.

Just make sure you install the valve springs to the proper specs.

 

[cabot2g]

It is possible to do the change on the car but I think your asking for trouble... cheap and 600hp just does not go together.

First off, check the spring specs for the cams. To turn the R's you want your going to need springs that can keep the valves closed at the given RPM's. You have to watch out for spring bind or stacking. In addition, springs are rated in force at a given compression height. On high HP high RPM applications, I do not like to assume the written specs. There are tools to measure spring force and you then shim the springs to adjust the force needed.

In my opinion (which is just what I would do), I would build the head. Either remove the one on the car or find a cheap used head and build it. Replace the guides, new stainless valves, titanium retainers, etc... I have tried and seen the results of short cuts in that past, nothing good ever came from it in the end. (Ruined heads, blocks, entire engines-catastrophic failure)

Now with that said you can do what you want but remember high HP is not cheap!

 

[jpmxrider489]

So would manly springs be a good buy as well as 3g lifters? I don't see the need to upgrade the whole head.

 

[BogusSVO]

So would manly springs be a good buy as well as 3g lifters? I don't see the need to upgrade the whole head.

Have the specs? or a link to them?

 

[clipto]

Just get some real cams, go with the gsc s2 cams with $200 brian crower springs and retainers and 3g lifters if you want. I hate regrinds and shims and over time you will have to add more shims, it just turns into a headache.

 

[BogusSVO]

Just get some real cams, go with the gsc s2 cams with $200 brian crower springs and retainers and 3g lifters if you want. I hate regrinds and shims and over time you will have to add more shims, it just turns into a headache.

If you are talking about the spring and Ti Retainer package with the BC1100 springs.

They will not work for long, the GS2 are more agressive than the Kelford 272 from everything I hear.

Beehives will be needed for both those cams.

 

[jpmxrider489]

EXTREME PSI : Your #1 Source for In Stock Performance Parts

Heres the springs that I was talking about. And found some 3g lifters on here.

 

[clipto]

If you are talking about the spring and Ti Retainer package with the BC1100 springs.

They will not work for long, the GS2 are more agressive than the Kelford 272 from everything I hear.

Beehives will be needed for both those cams.

Oh I did some research I thought they where beehive, well I guess you should get kiggly or gsc springs and retainers. I have been running the bc springs and retainers no issue so far, but better safe then sorry.

 

[jpmxrider489]

Could I just get the lifters and shims for now? I Will do the rest when i do the whole motor.

 

[bryanwheat]

You will not be able to take advantage of the cams with stock springs. Why even upgrade now if you don't have everything you need. The springs are rather easy to swap with the head on the car if you have the right compressor. Something like this will work good.

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