The Central Hub for DSM Community and Information

For 1990-1999 Mitsubishi Eclipse, Eagle Talon, Plymouth Laser, and Galant VR-4 Owners. This is where the DSM platform history is documented and archived. Log in to help us in our mission, and to remove most ads from the browsing experience.

11's still elude me PART 2

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, and others.

Phil1320

20+ Year Contributor
2,256
41
Dec 9, 2002
Rocky Hill, Connecticut
Guys---BULLET trailered me up to NED in Epping New Hampshire on Sunday to give it one more shot at 11 seconds before the season closed. Special thanks to him for taking the day and helping me sort the car.

The track was great, but believe it or not, I was still spinning all 4 out of the hole like crazy!

DENIED AGAIN! Seems like some kind of nightmare or somehting. But, we figured out some things. Again played with tire pressures and made some rear end alignment changes. I'm running 225/50/16 Nitto Drags that have plenty left on them but are at least 5 years old. At LVD on Friday with the crappy conditions I ran a best of 1.79 60' and all the rest were 1.9's or worse! I did not hit a 1.7X at NED but did make some consistent passes until an accident and an oil down put 4 hours between my 3rd and 4th passes and that was it. Anyway, here goes:

#1 1.85 [email protected] new best MPH

#2 1.86 [email protected]

#3 1.89 [email protected], exactly the same MPH as run #2

#4 2.01 [email protected]

#5 1.92 [email protected]


As you can see in runs #4 & #5, the afternoon runs were nowhere as good.

I cannot believe that I came this close without hitting an 11 again.......it's almost humerous at this point.

I have never been one to like to predict, but, it is plain to see based on my Friday runs at a crappy track, and my Sunday runs at a great track, with a normal 1.70 60', the car would run in the 11's every time. My best 60' ever is a 1.65, nothing too great, but if I could just have that, I'd be Golden. Many are asking why I'm spinning so much. Much stiffer suspension now with the JIC coilovers and every bushing you can think of has been done including rear toe eliminator, Suspension Tech rear sway and all. Also, the huge torque gain the car has over the last set-up 3 years ago.


Anyway, the solution that Bullet, myself, and others have come up with is to drop from a 16" wheel down to a 15" and either get a much better drag radial such as the Hoosier or Mickey Thompson, or just go straight to the full slick. I need TRACTION and the 11 second quest is over, in a nutshell.

I'd like to take this time to finally at least give myself a pat on the back. People that know me would tell you that I'm very hard on myself so this is big for me. Friday was the first time in 3 years that I launched the car. I figured with all the changes that the learning curve might be tough. I actually adjusted very quickly and started to get back in the groove, as showcased by my first three runs on Sunday, and multiple passes on Friday.

The funny thing of it all is that I thought I'd be battling some bogging issues with the lightweight flywheel/driveshaft, I never though I'd be battling the exact opposite!

Last, I will keep at it. Sometimes I do feel resignation, but all it takes is some GREAT friends and some passes down the strip to bring it back full circle.


Thanks to any and all that have supported my efforts in the past, present, and that will on into the future.


Take care,

Phil Beers:thumb:
 
Seems like you should be able to get those 60 foots down a little bit, and that will get you to 11's easily.
 
Thats strange, how much lbs/ft torque do you have ( dyno wise i guess. ) Is this a stroker engine?
115mph traps are good enough to get a high 11, my car has gone 11.9 at 115mph with a 5500k 2step and nlts and a all out shifting effort... Maybe your clutch engagement is too low or something and its dropping the clutch out too fast on your launch ( sort of dumping the clutch ) and thats why your not hooking. Because Ill spin thru first on my max tune if I dont slip the clutch good but yet my best 60ft is 1.7... But most of the time I hook and this is on street tires... You not hooking on drag radials is strange, because your trap speeds dont suggest that you have insane power or anything.... Whats your vehicle weight, if you could drop 200lbs real quick and do another 12.1 effort pass that would get you into the 11s considering dropping every 100lbs is like dropping 1/10th of a second...

p.s. 3 years without launching .... more power to you !!! I cant go 3 weeks without launching LOL
 
Seems like you should be able to get those 60 foots down a little bit, and that will get you to 11's easily.

I'll get them down sooner or later.......and yes I would think 11's would be easy at that point.

Phil
 
Did you try lowering your launch RPM a little?

Good runs either way though, you'll get it next year.

I was down between 4400-4700....I tried more of a slow slip launch than the faster slip I normally have done in the past....still spinning alot!

Thanks for the props!

Phil
 
Thats strange, how much lbs/ft torque do you have ( dyno wise i guess. ) Is this a stroker engine?
115mph traps are good enough to get a high 11, my car has gone 11.9 at 115mph with a 5500k 2step and nlts and a all out shifting effort... Maybe your clutch engagement is too low or something and its dropping the clutch out too fast on your launch ( sort of dumping the clutch ) and thats why your not hooking. Because Ill spin thru first on my max tune if I dont slip the clutch good but yet my best 60ft is 1.7... But most of the time I hook and this is on street tires... You not hooking on drag radials is strange, because your trap speeds dont suggest that you have insane power or anything.... Whats your vehicle weight, if you could drop 200lbs real quick and do another 12.1 effort pass that would get you into the 11s considering dropping every 100lbs is like dropping 1/10th of a second...

p.s. 3 years without launching .... more power to you !!! I cant go 3 weeks without launching LOL

The car made 295 AWHP and 337 AWTQ. But, the whole suspension has been changed with the JIC coilovers and every conceivable bushing you can replace in the DSM. The car barely squats at all. Total weight with me should be about 2605 lbs. Before all these changes, my average 60' time was about 1.71 with a best of 1.65. I've watched some of my passes and when shifting to second gear the car is blazing the tires on some runs. I just need traction.

Anyway, we will see...

Phil
 
I too think those 60's are holding you back. Have never heard great things about the Nitto DR's & I'm sure being 5 years old isn't helping things either. I'd pick up some BFG DR's or one of the other options out there, to get those 60's down where they should be.
 
Those tires are at best half as sticky as they used to be depending on how they've been stored for the past 5 years. Unless they were in a climate controlled garage stacked and bagged, they're hurting for traction.
 
I completely agree with needing new tires, just due to age. My opion is that I like a little squat in the rear but that is just me, and I know my car doesn't compare with yours at all. The passes I made were on old (at least 4 years,came with the car) 225/50/16 NT450's with nasty tread wear from camber being way negative. I'm not sure what to tell you other than trying to lower your launch RPM a little and see if it helps at all.
 
Those tires are at best half as sticky as they used to be depending on how they've been stored for the past 5 years. Unless they were in a climate controlled garage stacked and bagged, they're hurting for traction.

Agreed, Kyle. That's where we were going with our thought process. Also, we're believing that 15's (inch wheels ;)) are the number. The big decision is the tire. Drag radials, slicks or maybe cheater slicks. 24.5 is the number, the tire choice is the problem.

Again, great runs, Phil. Funny to be 3 years out and right back in after a couple of runs. I guess it comes back to you :D .

Thanks for the kind words, man. You know we had fun trying :thumb:

MB
 
Damn Phil, so close.

Alteast you know the car HAS 11's in it, just YOU need to get it there:) It will come, Theres a last test and tune next weekend at LVD... I may go for my last shot at 11's for the year on pumpgas.
 
I too think those 60's are holding you back. Have never heard great things about the Nitto DR's & I'm sure being 5 years old isn't helping things either. I'd pick up some BFG DR's or one of the other options out there, to get those 60's down where they should be.


Thats the first thing BULLETT said about the tires' age.......I barely ever used 'em so I never woulda thought. I know the Nittos really do suck even new. I wonder if the BF's would be enough though........

Phil
 
Those tires are at best half as sticky as they used to be depending on how they've been stored for the past 5 years. Unless they were in a climate controlled garage stacked and bagged, they're hurting for traction.

I'm sure....and while they were taken care of, they've always been on the car, not stacked or climate controlled!!!!

Phil
 
Agreed, Kyle. That's where we were going with our thought process. Also, we're believing that 15's (inch wheels ;)) are the number. The big decision is the tire. Drag radials, slicks or maybe cheater slicks. 24.5 is the number, the tire choice is the problem.

Again, great runs, Phil. Funny to be 3 years out and right back in after a couple of runs. I guess it comes back to you :D .

Thanks for the kind words, man. You know we had fun trying :thumb:

MB

No problem...and yes, we did have some fun!!! Epping kicks ass!

The wheels are ordered, same ones as the guy that ran 10.7 in the other red Talon. $356 shipped...can't beat that. So, that's done. NOW, WTF to do for tires??? Like I said above, I wonder if the BF Drag Radials would be enough.....I've seen them up close and know how much softer they are than the Nitto 555R's by a long shot. They are about $120 a pop in the 225-50-15 size. The M/T ET Slicks in 24.5 are about $167 a shot. It would just really suck to get the BF's on there and be rippin em loose. But, the combo of 15" with more sidewall and better compound may do the trick........I need some help on deciding Mark.....what's your final thought on it? BF Drags or MT Slicks?? Anyone else that has input as well, feel free.


We'll get it........


Phil

Thanks again....I'm glad it came back to me or we would have been way off! Ha!
 
If you want to use an effective tire on a low HP car, You should actually look into the "other side" of the tire kingdom....

Nokian Hakkapelliitta RSi's. Yes, thats right....Ice Racing tires. I pulled a heck of alot of 1.5-1.6 60's on these tires over the years, and they stood up to 30K+ miles, well over 100 track passes, plus all the street burnouts, and 2+ years. They still had half tread.

http://www.nokiantires.com/en/tire_hakkarsi.aspx?season=winter

Super sticky-- just put them down to 15-18psi and have fun!

They are around the same price as the slick, but they are multipurpose. :thumb:



I seriously am not screwing around.



Otherwise, invest in a set of 15" Hoosier Quick Time Pro slicks -- 24.5x8.5x15
 

Attachments

You must be registered for see attachments list
Phil I have been watching you for about seven years now. Great job and awesome effort with stcking with the 14b for now.

Personally after seeing the video and knowing how little you drive the car, take the traction out of the equation. Just go with 24.5" slicks and be done with it. But, depending on how far you want to go in the future, maybe get the 26" tires now and drive around them. I do think the 26" tires at this point will hurt you going for the 11's.

Don't rule out the M&H Racemasters. We run 4 24.5x8.5x15 racemasters on our 2G. They are a really good tire. They are just not as pricey as the Mickey Thompson's or the Hoosiers.

Slicks and call it done.

Steven
 
Just go with 24.5" slicks and be done with it. But, depending on how far you want to go in the future, maybe get the 26" tires now and drive around them. I do think the 26" tires at this point will hurt you going for the 11's.



Slicks and call it done.
You know what Phil, ^^^^ Here's what I'm thinking. You can always add air if too much traction becomes a problem, but it's a lot harder to add traction to a drag radial. After a bit of thought, IMO slicks.

MB
 
Damn Phil, so close.

Alteast you know the car HAS 11's in it, just YOU need to get it there:) It will come, Theres a last test and tune next weekend at LVD... I may go for my last shot at 11's for the year on pumpgas.

Hell yeah.....and it's not like it's a shot in the dark to say that now.....


Well, good luck hittin that 11 SECOND pass this weekend! I assure you I'll be jealous!! kidding....but, I hope you get it! Talk to you soon,

Phil
 
If you want to use an effective tire on a low HP car, You should actually look into the "other side" of the tire kingdom....

Nokian Hakkapelliitta RSi's. Yes, thats right....Ice Racing tires. I pulled a heck of alot of 1.5-1.6 60's on these tires over the years, and they stood up to 30K+ miles, well over 100 track passes, plus all the street burnouts, and 2+ years. They still had half tread.

http://www.nokiantires.com/en/tire_hakkarsi.aspx?season=winter

Super sticky-- just put them down to 15-18psi and have fun!

They are around the same price as the slick, but they are multipurpose. :thumb:



I seriously am not screwing around.



Otherwise, invest in a set of 15" Hoosier Quick Time Pro slicks -- 24.5x8.5x15

I have seen this before Tim and it sounds like they might work really well, unfortunately, I don't drive a DSM in the winter and all my other cars run 17" wheels from the factory, so, being a one purpose tire, I would have to go with the slick I think. Thanks for the insight though, I appreciate anyone that wants to give their thoughts on what it takes for me to do what I want to do. So, Hoosier Quick Time Pro > MT ET Slicks?

Thanks.

Phil
 
Phil I have been watching you for about seven years now. Great job and awesome effort with stcking with the 14b for now.

Personally after seeing the video and knowing how little you drive the car, take the traction out of the equation. Just go with 24.5" slicks and be done with it. But, depending on how far you want to go in the future, maybe get the 26" tires now and drive around them. I do think the 26" tires at this point will hurt you going for the 11's.

Don't rule out the M&H Racemasters. We run 4 24.5x8.5x15 racemasters on our 2G. They are a really good tire. They are just not as pricey as the Mickey Thompson's or the Hoosiers.

Slicks and call it done.

Steven

Wow, thanks alot Steven! Nice to hear! I think myself, and BULLETT, are now taking on your same thinking process= slicks and be done with it. As far as the future, I will take the opposite approach that most take which is going BIG all at once. In other words, my next Turbo will be the EVO 3 16G. So, I could get great use out of the 24.5's for a while. The 26 is definitely too big in my opinion. Also, keep in mind that this slick thing is NEW to me.......so the Racemaster I don't know about, I will go do some research. Also, what kind of power do you make on your 2G and approx. weight just for comparisons sake?


Take care,

Phil

Thanks very much for the input
 
You know what Phil, ^^^^ Here's what I'm thinking. You can always add air if too much traction becomes a problem, but it's a lot harder to add traction to a drag radial. After a bit of thought, IMO slicks.

MB

DONE! The guys up above seem to agree as well. NOW: Which ones? We know 24.5.

Steven suggested the Racemaster which I have to check into. Then we've got quick time pro's and the Mickey Thompson's. So, apparently, the Racemaster is more cost efficient, so I'd like to check into those as well. Didn't think I'd have to spend almost $170 a tire and the others are about that.......the search is on......


Phil
 
Just checked em out......now that I think, that might be what the red Talon at NED was running...

Unfortunately, no pricing was available on the site.......where else can I get M & H slicks???

Phil
 
Add Value - Be Respectful - No Trolling - No Misinformation - Participate Often!
Support Vendors who Support the DSM Community

Build Thread Updates

Latest Classifieds

  • For sale 2g 2G DSM Link V3
    2G DSM Link V3 $600 + shipping and paypal fees* no cable included * cables are 75 on the...
    • jersygsx
    • Updated:
    • Expires
  • Wanted 2g Shot in the dark (2g Pass strut cut out)
    Need 2g strut tower to save time.
    • frosh29
    • Updated:
    • Expires
  • For sale 2g 2G Mishimoto Radiator & Fan Shroud
    2G Mishimoto Radiator & Fan Shroud $200 + shipping and paypal feesYou must be registered to...
    • jersygsx
    • Updated:
    • Expires
  • For sale VIRGIN 4G63 6-BOLT TURBO HEAD
    Came off a virgin stock AWD Auto 1G DMS (91), also have matching block and crank which are also...
    • The_Partout_Spot
    • Updated:
    • Expires
  • For sale 1G DSM 4G63 6-BOLT TIMING COVER
    Used, see condition in photos. Buyer covers shipping / fees.
    • The_Partout_Spot
    • Updated:
    • Expires
Back
Top