wont start w/o jumper wire on relay

[spic21]

i have a 90 talon tsi. i been trying to get it back in shape so i replaced some parts and drained old gas to start. it will start all day long if i jump top two contact of starter relay. if not i get a clicking sound from under hood sound like near the starter. i replaced the relay but same thing. what the hell. please help ive been working on it for a few days now and im going crazy. it worked good for few min when i first turned it over but now nothing but clicking w/o that dang jumper wire.

 

[mtfisher]

im having a similar problem myself, I have a 97 Eagle Talon ESI non-turbo 5-speed with the 420a engine. The car has run great but suddenly my starter quit working. When i try to start it the start makes one click nothing else more. so i replaced my starter with a brand new starter and it is doing the exact same thing. So I took off the starter and jumpered it directly to the battery and the starter worked fine. I put a meter on the starter and when the key is in the off position I am getting 12V to the starter. When I turn the key to the start position I am only getting 8V to the starter. I can not figure out why I have a voltage drop??? Does anyone have any idea whats going on?

 

[ntdsmr87]

did u check ## alt relay?


also check the voltage on the terminal where the starter relay plugs in check the voltage on them......there should b something on google to show what the values r

if those r good follow those wires down there is a short somewhere

 

[mtfisher]

the alt relay is good which sucks cause now i have to find the short which sucks. could this be a starter relay problem? or is it most likely a short?

 

[steve]

im having a similar problem myself, I have a 97 Eagle Talon ESI non-turbo 5-speed with the 420a engine.

Please don't hijack spic21's thread. You get better answers posting in the 420A forums.

 

[spic21]

Close enough. If I recall correctly was what I was thinking at the time.

I use lots terms and references that I expect people to look up if they don't know what they are, before they ask me. Why? Because they might find a couple more things in the process and it shows how motivated they are.

motivition not a problem. i have 12 pages open here. constantly reading. if not im in the car. this has been one hell project. i just posted this in another post i have open but heres what im workin with
forge rods and pistons think 8/1 compression
3 angle value job
arp bolts
bigger springs
272(I think. They were the biggest at one time) intake and exhaust cams HKS
cometic head gasket. think they said good for 33lbs boost
small 16g turbo
greddy blow value
apex afc 2
Walbro 255 Fuel Pump
660 injector(or something like that) (not installed because i cant tune it yet)
2g exhaust maniflod
3in downpipe with 3in thermal exhaust
Prothane Motor & Transmission Mounts
its also gauged out inside from oil to exhaust temp
and I have a palm pilot with d-link on it (I think)

well i know if the alternator is pulling current the starter will stall probably cause ## clicking sound check the alternator relay thats probaly it......

will do i test first thing in morning. thank u

 

[steve]

Thanks for the list.

Can you simply sum up the specific problem you trying to solve. If it's still you needing the starter relay jumpered to start the car, there is nothing in the 90 FSM on the Theft Alarm that I can find.

Your looking for something that is grounding pin 1 of the starter relay C-35X. Only the Clutch Safety switch and the Theft Alarm Relay C-25 do that or a short in the harness. Disconnecting the CSS connector at the petal disables it from grounding the starter relay and pulling the theft alarm relay disables it.

 

[debbie]

motivition not a problem. i have 12 pages open here. constantly reading. if not im in the car. this has been one hell project. i just posted this in another post i have open but heres what im workin with
forge rods and pistons think 8/1 compression
3 angle value job
arp bolts
bigger springs
272(I think. They were the biggest at one time) intake and exhaust cams HKS
cometic head gasket. think they said good for 33lbs boost
small 16g turbo
greddy blow value
apex afc 2
Walbro 255 Fuel Pump
660 injector(or something like that) (not installed because i cant tune it yet)
2g exhaust maniflod
3in downpipe with 3in thermal exhaust
Prothane Motor & Transmission Mounts
its also gauged out inside from oil to exhaust temp
and I have a palm pilot with d-link on it (I think)



will do i test first thing in morning. thank u

Did you wire in those electrical gauges and apexi AFC your self?
May be you disturbed something behind the dash.

 

[spic21]

did u check ## alt relay?


also check the voltage on the terminal where the starter relay plugs in check the voltage on them......there should b something on google to show what the values r

if those r good follow those wires down there is a short somewhere

well i know if the alternator is pulling current the starter will stall probably cause ## clicking sound check the alternator relay thats probaly it......

wow thanks for all the responds.
ive gone throw my manaul and thry dont have a test for alt relay. anyone know how to test this. it only has 3 contacts. how do u have a relay with only 3 contacts?

starter relay has good voltage but the thrft alarm/starter relay is not geeting power that all(the one under the consol. i checked the key switch reminder and the inginion switch and there bout good. then i test the wire going for key reminder to theft/starter relay and it is good.

wow i didnt even see this page. i did do afc myself about 4 years ago. and i did think that this was a posibility but a check all contion and they look good and afc is work properly. and it has worked for long time so wouldnt think that was it but i will check that again to make sure it looks ok. i am pullin power from the ing swith for gauge light but that contion seem to be fine also it is t tapped and it gettin voltage thourgh the tap to both sides

Thanks for the list.

Can you simply sum up the specific problem you trying to solve. If it's still you needing the starter relay jumpered to start the car, there is nothing in the 90 FSM on the Theft Alarm that I can find.

Your looking for something that is grounding pin 1 of the starter relay C-35X. Only the Clutch Safety switch and the Theft Alarm Relay C-25 do that or a short in the harness. Disconnecting the CSS connector at the petal disables it from grounding the starter relay and pulling the theft alarm relay disables it.

i have tried puliin the css switch and it does same thing but i have not pulled both and tried i will do that now. if this doesnt work im almost giving up on it. if this jumper wire will work and not affect my car in a neg way i guess screw it. dont even want that stupid theft on there anyway. ill buy a good alarm and call it a day.

 

[ntdsmr87]

no problem

well if ## taping voltage from the source to the component i think it would b ok the volt reg wud jus keep the alt on longer idk this is wierd there has to b a short or the alt is energized on ## initial start up causing the starter to stall.........there has to b a short along the alt relay wires .....a relay has both pos and neg leads but the third wire im pretty sure is a ground which controls the switch or relay so whatever the ground wire is for the relay u needa find the switch or whatever component is controlling the relay.....i dont have the wire segment diagram so i cant tell u for sure....post a wire diagram of the alt relay segment if u can

 

[tooslow1]

im having the same problem ever figure out what the problem was?

 

[BLINKY619]

have you tried whats been mentioned already?