Varying Clutch Engagement [Merged 1-9] bleeding air floor stuck grinding

[BoostInsideTSi]

Okay, folks, for some unknown reason, we're now getting three threads a week started about clutch malfunctions.
The usual cause is that the system hasn't been properly bled.

Have at it.

I put in a used, but in good condition master cylinder, to replace the one I had before with a broken rubber seal. I did not bleed any components, I simply took out the old one, and bolted the new one up. Then I proceeded to fill the reservoir with dot 3 brake fluid. Bubbles rose to the top of the reservoir, then I topped it off after the fluid ran down into the system. I looked at the clutch pedal and noticed it was still sitting on the floor. I tried pulling it up off the floor, but it only went up a few inches. Probably some adjusting that needs to be done with the rod is causing that. Anyway when I pull it up there is quite a bit of resistance, where when I let go the pedal just pulls right back to the floor. I've heard there is a vacuum going on, where with air in the system, it is just pulling that sucker right back. I tried pumping the crap out of the pedal with a friend opening the bleeder valve and I just shoot clutch fluid everywhere.. I Stop after about 50 pumps and put more fluid and keep going, but notice no improvement. Does anyone know what I need to do? Can anyone verify it is the air in the system causing my problem? Thank you,
Mike

 

[94Jettameowpsst]

My front ear was busted off and i had 2 bolts holding my tranny in. The engagement point will lower not raise up. On top of that it was nearly impossible to pull out without making the entire car shake like it was having a seizure. How does your car feel when you downshift and let the clutch out slow?

 

[v8s_are_slow]

My front ear was busted off and i had 2 bolts holding my tranny in. The engagement point will lower not raise up. On top of that it was nearly impossible to pull out without making the entire car shake like it was having a seizure. How does your car feel when you downshift and let the clutch out slow?

if the ear is catching the block, and the transmission stays flush, it'll feel as though the engagement point just raised up. once it let's go and the tranny moves out, it'll move to the floor again. mine would also shake as well....but not ALL the time. only when the transmission was moving and it wasn't all the time. the ear broke at somewhat of an angle so at times it'd catch the block and not wanna let it go.

if the ear is broken though (you don't wanna know the joy of fixing this), you DON'T need to drive it. the transmission will be at an angle and the shaft that the throwout bearing rides on will be at an angle as well. it'll mushroom the end of it and possibly destroy your tranny AND the clutch.

 

[94Jettameowpsst]

Already had the motor pulled, that piece on the block bead blasted, and the ear tig welded back on. Im still kinda wherry about launching it

 

[v8s_are_slow]

Already had the motor pulled, that piece on the block bead blasted, and the ear tig welded back on. Im still kinda wherry about launching it

tig welded cast?!?!? who welded it? should've had it arc welded by someone who knows how to do it. there's a special rod for cast and cast has to be preheated to a certain temp otherwise it'll crack again. hope it holds up for ya though in the meantime but at least now ya know what to look for if ya have that problem again and if ya didn't have the dowel pins in the 1st time, hope you've got em in now.

 

[cbellsondsm]

When my dad was stepping on the clutch i was watching from under the hood. The clutch was really low when he stepped on it. So i don't think the ear(if it was cracked) would be holding on to the rest of the block because the clutch was having the problem it always has. As far as the pins go i am pretty sure they are in. I never took the trans out. I'm pretty sure the block isn't cracked anywhere.

 

[v8s_are_slow]

I just can't see that varying height of a clutch pedal would be do to a warn out clutch assembly lever. (When it's down it's down) It seems more like a slave or master cylinder problem dealing with the pressure or hydraulics of your system. What type of clutch fluid are you using? Have you completely bled out the system using all new fluid? Sometimes systems condensate and you end up with water in the mixture.

If you end up changing the clutch pedal assembly the kit runs about $75.00. It is, or was for me, a major effort in changing the assembly. But it was well worth it...

Alright well check the pedal assembly then. I've had every problem known to man as far as a dsm clutch assembly is concerned. I've also had mine work "sometimes" as well. Push the pedal to the floor. Release it and then get down and try and pull it up with your hand. If it comes up anymore it's bad. I also took mine out and had it welded and then I put it back in. It was still bad, so to make it easier, I went to a salvage yard and got another pedal assembly for cheap. Problem solved.

 

[cbellsondsm]

I thought the pedal was supposed to stop right before it hits the switch to allow the cruise control to turn on. If that is not the case then my pedal assembly is shot. It moves up like a inch after i push the pedal to the floor release it then grab it with my hand and lift it up.

Well since it seems like my pedal assembly is shot what would be my best way to fixing it. I know it is a big job i have talked to AMS about it before and they said they would rather swap a engine then change a clutch pedal assembly. What do you weld when you get it out? Why didn't welding the pedal assembly fix yours the first time?

Thanks

 

[v8s_are_slow]

I welded mine but guess there was something else wrong with it but too hard to figure out with it out of the car being that i can't apply the same force. It's when you release the clutch pedal (take your foot off the pedal) that you'd grab it and try and pull it up more. Not talking about having your foot on the pedal (if that's what you mean). If I ever have to do another clutch assembly, I'll go get one from a salvage yard or get a brand new one before I try fixing it again. Cause of course if it's not fixed, you have to yank it right back out and it's too much work.

Pulling the seat out is the easiest thing to do. Have to pull the steering column out, etc. It's not that hard after the 1st time you do one. But the 1st time you do it, you'll probably be cussing up a storm. It's just hard to reach some of the nuts and bolts up in there. But yeah, AMS is about right...at least the 1st time you do one but once you know how to do it, it's a cake walk. And for me, I was just happy to know how to do one more thing on my own car instead of having someone else work on it...which I don't do.

 

[1fast97gsx]

Your cltuch disk failed on you. Mine used to do the EXACT same thing. One day it popped and the clutch only did something 1/5 times. Turns out a spring totally ripped out of the hub and all of the others were VERY loose. Replaced the disk and all was well and engagement is smooth and consistant again.

 

[cbellsondsm]

Well i think the whole verying clutch hieght thing is my slave cylinder. I was figuring that since the clutch is fine once the car warms up it must be heat related. When the car was cold and the clutch was low as usual i crawled under it with a torch and heated up the slave cylinder. To my surprise the clutch actually started to get better after the slave cylinder was warm. So i am guessing i should replace the slave cylinder. Maybe rebuilding the slave cylinder wasnt the best idea. Should have just bought a new one the first time.

 

[No_Skillz]

My clutch is stiff down to a certain point, where there is significant resistance. Normally, I drive without going past this point, since my engagement is higher up. However, if I force past this point to the floor and let back up, my clutch will be alot lighter and feels smoother. There is no change in engagement point or length. After a few hours of not driving, the pressure returns to being stiff.

I don't have any leaks in my hydraulic system since I've kept an eye on my fluid level for the past month or two and there is no change. I have an ACT2100, fidanza flywheel, and a stainless steel line with reservoir eliminated. I am completely stumped as to what this can be. Any input appreciated.

 

[oldman]

Don't let me say the "C" word.

 

[No_Skillz]

Don't let me say the "C" word.

I don't want to believe you.

 

[oldman]

I was only kidding, why did you talk to me about this last time?

 

[No_Skillz]

Because I realized it would randomly get hard and soft, but I didn't know why. I was trying a couple things to see if I could figure out if I was doing anything to cause it. However, it seems I was wrong in my original description about it turning soft if I pushed it all the way down, since I've been doing that driving to work for the past couple days and it still hasn't turned soft. I'm totally stumped on this one. Think we should try another bleed next time?

 

[jtmcinder]

Hey, Oldman, it's a 2G. It's classic pump-up. He needs to adjust the upper stop.

- Jtoby

 

[No_Skillz]

I thought pump on only applied when the stock reservoir was present? I stated I have reservoir elim SS line.

 

[jtmcinder]

Pump-up is caused by the return hole being covered in the master cyl. It has nothing to do with the reservoir. You move up the top stop on the pedal, uncovering the hole, and the problem is gone. Five minutes and you're golden.

- Jtoby

 

[oldman]

Thanks Jtoby, we will get that taken care of today when he comes over.

 

[Red97Eclipseboy]

Hey! I just want to say you guys should make this a sticky! This thread saves my butt. I was about to embark on a new clutch; although, now I pay rent and don't have money like when I lived at the p's. I did what you guys said, and damn! It's perfect! Thank you so much!
Reggie

 

[92awddsm]

I agree, its the typical 2g pedal pump up. Scroll down to 2g pedal pump up and read about it.

http://www.roadraceengineering.com/clutchandflywheeltech.htm

 

[rhohan72]

the clutch doesn't seem to want to engage enough to get it in gear.

I bought an act2100, replaced the fork, pivot ball (shimmed the ball with a 1/16th washer as recommended on multiple threads), new slave, new master, new lines, clutch is fully adjusted under the dash. I have bled the system multiple times.

As far as I know, we put the clutch together correctly. I bought all new flywheel to engine and pp to flywheel bolts, and torqued them to spec. I am lost... i am not sure what else to do.

 

[DiamondStarAwd]

Do you have a extended slave cylinder rod?

I know that I had to adjust my clutch under the dash a few times to where I thought was unneccesary and it turned out to work. Might try adjusting the other way.

 

[Dream On]

Did you use FP's flywheel bolt kit? If so, did you use the studs for bolting the pressure plate onto the flywheel? If you answered yes to both, then remove transmission, and use the stock bolts. If not, then I would look into the step on your flywheel, and your clutch pedal assembly. I would do the assembly first actually.

http://dsmtuners.com/forums/showthread.php?t=156805

http://dsmtuners.com/forums/showthread.php?t=96981

 

[rhohan72]

i used the stock flywheel with the act clutch, so i used the stock bolts. I did try a new slave rod.

I just my chick check the pedal by pressing it down, then trying to pull it back up. it apparently moves about an inch... worn pedal assembly?