The strangest oil leak ever, PLEASE HELP

[sonicnofadz]

Ok, for about two months now (yes I said two months) I've been leaking oil HEAVILY from around the timing belt/oil filter housing area, and I cannot pinpoint the leak at ALL. The leak started right after I removed my balance shafts and installed a brand new front case and oil pan. At first I thought I might have just goofed up the oil pan install (maybe I didnt add enough rtv?) but I removed the oilpan and installed a brand new paper-based felpro oilpan gasket and nothing changed. Then I thought maybe it was my oil return flange (for the turbo) I tightened it up and inspected it for cracks, nothing. Then I thought, well maybe something is leaking inside the timing belt case. So I took off the timing belt cover to find my timing belt chewed to pieces (timing belt was a month old, argh) and bought a new one and replaced it. There was SOME oil in that area but it looked like it was just flung from my front driverside wheel (there is a small gap between the front case and the timing belt cover where oil could have been flung in from the spinning axle), since oil is EVERYwhere around that area. I also re-torqued all the front case bolts and tensioner pulleys just to be safe. Now I AM CLUELESS. Driving the car for about 2 hours will result in losing a quart of oil (it is getting REAL messy down there). Keep in mind I have replaced ALL gaskets and seals associated with the front case and oil filter housing. It actually looks like the leak might be coming where the oil filter housing bolts to the block (there is a brand new gasket there as well). Does anyone know where I can buy a new oil filter housing gasket? Does anyone have any idea at all where this oil could be coming from?

 

[92redman]

You may have cracked the front case or oil filter adapter housing when you reinstalled them. IF you somehow missed any of the smallest pieces of gasket material or anything else that could have gotten on there, when you torque the bolts down it will crack and leak oil.

Ask me how I know.

....
Because it happened to me.

 

[sonicnofadz]

Hmmmm....if thats the case, will there be visible cracks on the outside of the housing? Because I've looked at it before and have not noticed anything wrong with it? I am going to take it off this weekend
(after leaking out 5 more quarts through the week ) and see wtf is going on. If it DID crack, I can pull another one off a car for like 4 bucks at my junkyard, I can only hope it will be this simple. This problem has been pissing me off for way too long. Argh....I sure hope my front case isn't cracked, the install was a real PITA...and it isn't cheap either. Anyways, thanks for the reply. Does anyone know where I can just buy the oil filter housing gasket? The new one I installed (the one that might be leaking) came with my 6 bolt front case kit but I don't where to buy a new one that comes by itself and not a whole kit.

 

[92redman]

I couldn't see the crack when it was on the car, it was such a small crack. I had to get in the light just right to see it.

Edit: Why don't you take the front cover off and the wheel and shields and run the car and see if you can see where the leak is coming from?

 

[sonicnofadz]

Ahhh just wonderful....I was beginning to suspect that maybe there was something wrong with the gasket itself, but maybe I did miss a little piece of old gasket and I overtightened the bolts and cracked something...god dammit can't my car just stop breaking! I've been fixing the damn thing since I bought it over a year ago Thanks for the info, I had NO idea that the front case/oil filter block was so easy to crack. Maybe this stupid leak will finally be put to an end.

 

[civic619]

Hi,

I wanted to find out if you were able to fix your oil leak issues? I am pretty much on the same boat are yourself. It is very frustrating when you have done everything you can and the leak still persists, although in my case, its capfuls of oil per day.

 

[sonicnofadz]

Hi,

I wanted to find out if you were able to fix your oil leak issues? I am pretty much on the same boat are yourself. It is very frustrating when you have done everything you can and the leak still persists, although in my case, its capfuls of oil per day.

No I am still leaking oil like crazy. Basically, I have been too lazy to fix it. I HAVE noticed however that MORE oil leaks when not at idle (i.e. most of the leaking occurs during driving engine speeds). This makes sense since oil pressure is greater when the crank speed is higher (since the oil pump is driven by the timing belt). Therefore during spring break when I'm not flooded with school work, I'm going to take off my plastic timing belt cover and leave the throttle body a little open to keep the engine at a constant 3000 rpms and try to observe WHERE the oil is leaking. I'm almost certain that its coming from a bad front case gasket, but I'm not positive. Once this damn thing is solved I will post an update.

NOTE: I did take off my oil filter block and inspected it for cracks or if I missed any pieces of old gasket. I didnt find ANY evidence of cracks at all, and replaced the gasket with another new one. This did NOT fix any of the leaking at all...argh.

 

[AWDJDMTALON]

Did you RTV the bolt in the center of the front cover? If not IT WILL LEAK OIL!

 

[sonicnofadz]

Did you RTV the bolt in the center of the front cover? If not IT WILL LEAK OIL!

Hrmmmm......I don't remember putting any RTV on the center bolt. I thought I saw some of the oil building up around a bolt on the front case but dismissed it as a possibility! DAMN! If this is the problem then I'm going to kick myself in the face. I've probably already have been through 50 quarts of oil trying to find this damn leak.
I will take off my timing belt case and try the RTV. If this works, I will owe you BIG time!

 

[civic619]

Keep us up to date. Im going to work on my car tomorrow and see if I can pin point my leak. So far, I have changed the main crank seal, oil sprocket seal, oil pan gasket and valve cover gasket. Yet my t belt shows signs of oil contamination, and my oil filter housing and that general area seems drenched. I probably leak about 3 capfulls of oil per day.

Its very annoying and frightful thinking that my tbelt has oil.

 

[tmizer]

Had the same problem on a rebuild. Turned out the timing gear on the stub shaft was not sealing. The shaft is tapered and the corresponding taper in the timing belt gear needs to be on there good. Problem is that you really can't torque that down alot...it's in the teens as I recall. I think I ended up putting a thin film of Hylomar on the shaft, the shaft threads, and using a Earl's Dowty seal under the nut...not certain... but after a couple minutes of idling, you can see the oil whipping off the nut/shaft and across the end of the pulley - I F - the timing belt cover is off.

Center bolt RTV'ing is a no-brainer.
Oil pan gasket? I think they leak a little, and I've used them, but I've also used just the grey RTV. Just apply per CD/manual, and especially torque to the VERY light values listed! Personally, I feel the grey RTV "process" seals incredibly well and tight.
Seals, apply a small amount of grease to the shaft side when installing. Never insert a shaft into a dry hole.....

BTW, there should be alot of SEARCH results on this very not so "strangest oil leak ever" subject.............................

 

[civic619]

Had the same problem on a rebuild. Turned out the timing gear on the stub shaft was not sealing. The shaft is tapered and the corresponding taper in the timing belt gear needs to be on there good. Problem is that you really can't torque that down alot...it's in the teens as I recall. I think I ended up putting a thin film of Hylomar on the shaft, the shaft threads, and using a Earl's Dowty seal under the nut...not certain... but after a couple minutes of idling, you can see the oil whipping off the nut/shaft and across the end of the pulley - I F - the timing belt cover is off.

Center bolt RTV'ing is a no-brainer.
Oil pan gasket? I think they leak a little, and I've used them, but I've also used just the grey RTV. Just apply per CD/manual, and especially torque to the VERY light values listed! Personally, I feel the grey RTV "process" seals incredibly well and tight.
Seals, apply a small amount of grease to the shaft side when installing. Never insert a shaft into a dry hole.....

BTW, there should be alot of SEARCH results on this very not so "strangest oil leak ever" subject.............................

Which timing gear are you speaking of? Are you talking about the oil pump sprocket?

 

[AWDJDMTALON]

I used Hondabond on my oilpan/front cover &center bolt w/no gaskets and after 18000 miles i have no leaks.

civic619. have you tryed replacing the brass washers to the oil cooler lines/press sender. I had a leak there too. That took care of it.

 

[tmizer]

Civic619, I'm referring to the oil pump sprocket. If you're in the left wheel well, as we DSM'ers are prone to be located in and looking at the crank pulley, it's to the right of that.

 

[RickyIac]

First thing, if your timing belt is chewed up then you didnt properly align something underneath the timing covers and its ripping through your belt
2nd, i had the same problem on my 1st gen, I had a small hairline crack by the bottom bolt hole for the hydraulic tensioner that was causing my car to leak oil. I couldnt see the crank myself until i realized that the oil was coming from that spot. Put oil in the car and start it, let it run and look underneath, if the oil drip is coming from under the timing cover you probably cracked your front case or didnt set the seals right. If you still cant find it. Take everything off including the timing belt, clean up the front of the motor and get an impact gun or an air ratchet and spin the oil pump sprocket, the nut is a 14mm on 1g's, make sure you spin it in the direction that the timing belt is spinning it, u should start to see oil dripping from somewhere if your oil leak is in fact coming from the font case, thats how i found my leak.
3rd-Make sure you change all seals and all gaskets again and use ultra copper rtv, make sure you let it cure for 20 minutes before compress it. AND LASTLY, And VERY IMPORTANTLY- Do NOT USE A GASKET FOR THE OIL PAN, that will most likely cause an oil leak, pull the pan and scrape off any old gasket material or RTV and then use ultra copper RTV around the pan. Again, let the rtv sit and cure for about 20 minutes after you put it on the oil pan before you reinstall the pan. The oil pan gaskets for some reason dont seal right and cause oil leaks most of the time on Dsms, or at least i know they do on 1G'S i dont know about 2g's, but i know that 1g's didnt even come out of the factory with oil pan gaskets, or at least i think thats right. But either way your better off with just Ultra Copper RTV then the oil pan gasket.

Let me know if this helps

 

[sonicnofadz]

Sorry for not replying in so long. I have at last found my oil leak, (located it using the UV dye you can buy at autozone for $5.00 and a black light). It was coming from the front case, but not where I thought it was coming from. It was leaking from the front balance shaft seal. So I RTV'd it up and bam, no more leak. Except I blew a fist sized hole through the engine block the next day at the race track (go figure). Oh well I am using a different engine now and it doesn't really leak oil so its all good =)

 

[AWDJDMTALON]

Bummer about the motor. I break axles like it is the new thing to do when I go. Glad to hear you found the leak. Never even thought about the plug for the balance shaft elim.