simple knock,idc,and timing questions

[1993gsxtalon]

Ok so i did some little 2nd gear pulls tonight with maybe 13psi and a clutch thats pretty much toast(for real). Here is some numbers i got.
Knock sum -3
Injector duty cycle-103
Timing? (diff page on logger)

So my question is whats a safe knock,injector duty cycle, and timing advance for these mods( no threads show any info for my setup, if so please direct me)?

fmic
all free mods
bov
downpipe
2.5 exhaust no cat
logger
tubular mani
14b
stock fuel system
mbc-set at prob 15-16psi
"ported head"
ported o2 ho

 

[97gstjosh]

First of just put your mods in your public profile. itll save you some hassle later down the road. Your IDC is way to high 103% it needs to be like 70-75%. That is a good IDC. Knock all depends on what your comfortable with. Im sure ppl will argue that but thats what it cmes down to. I have my car right now set for my check engine light to come on when I hit 4 counts. It barely ever hits that. Also what was your advance timing?

 

[GVR4592]

First of just put your mods in your public profile. itll save you some hassle later down the road. Your IDC is way to high 103% it needs to be like 70-75%. That is a good IDC. Knock all depends on what your comfortable with. Im sure ppl will argue that but thats what it cmes down to. I have my car right now set for my check engine light to come on when I hit 4 counts. It barely ever hits that. Also what was your advance timing?

4 counts or 4 degrees of knock retard? If you have Dsmlink, then it's 4 degrees of knock retard, that's a lot of knock retard. Enough to toast your engine, you should at least keep it down below 2 degrees, I shoot for 1 degree or less.

 

[GVR4592]

Ok so i did some little 2nd gear pulls tonight with maybe 13psi and a clutch thats pretty much toast(for real). Here is some numbers i got.
Knock sum -3
Injector duty cycle-103
Timing? (diff page on logger)

So my question is whats a safe knock,injector duty cycle, and timing advance for these mods( no threads show any info for my setup, if so please direct me)?

Turn the boost down until your IDC isn't so high. Then upgrade your fuel system.

 

[1993gsxtalon]

Thanks guys on the fast replys.
I figured all i can do is turn the boost down until the idc is below 95%?
knock under 4
But im still confused on the timing curve?
What can i get to upgrade the fuel system for now cause i dont have the cash for injectors,pump,dsm link..(maybe walbro 190 and thats it), but i will later uprade to the above

 

[16gpoweredgsx]

You probably have some boost leaks and/or exhausts leaks causing you to run rich. That duty cycle is way high for stock setup. I would start with a boost leak test, b/c you say your hitting 13 psi and your boost controller is set to 15, 16 psi. If you don't have a boost leak tester then turn the boost down to stock (11 psi), and make a pull and if you still maxing your duty cycle you got some bad leaks.

 

[GVR4592]

You probably have some boost leaks and/or exhausts leaks causing you to run rich. That duty cycle is way high for stock setup. I would start with a boost leak test, b/c you say your hitting 13 psi and your boost controller is set to 15, 16 psi. If you don't have a boost leak tester then turn the boost down to stock (11 psi), and make a pull and if you still maxing your duty cycle you got some bad leaks.

Boost leaks won't cause IDC to go up. His setup isn't really stock either, he has a lot of mods that would require more fuel than a stock setup would.

 

[GVR4592]

Thanks guys on the fast replys.
I figured all i can do is turn the boost down until the idc is below 95%?
knock under 4
But im still confused on the timing curve?
What can i get to upgrade the fuel system for now cause i dont have the cash for injectors,pump,dsm link..(maybe walbro 190 and thats it), but i will later uprade to the above

Fill out your vehicle profile. Do you have a boost gauge or are you guessing?

What about the timing curve confuses you?

You can rewire the fuel pump, but it won't decrease IDC. The only way to lower it is with bigger injectors or leaning out the A/F ratio.

 

[97gstjosh]

4 counts of knock not 4 degrees. I should have specified.
You need bigger injectors. What turbo are you going to go with or are you staying with the 14b. After you decide that then you can figure on what injectors and size fuel pump and all the fuel mods. Update your mod list and then we can help more and tell us future plans.

 

[97gstjosh]

You dont need DSMLink just Get The Amazingly retarded S-AFC Then upgrade later. Its always best when you get what you really want first but look on ebay and get one cheap

 

[GVR4592]

4 counts of knock not 4 degrees. I should have specified.
You need bigger injectors. What turbo are you going to go with or are you staying with the 14b. After you decide that then you can figure on what injectors and size fuel pump and all the fuel mods. Update your mod list and then we can help more and tell us future plans.

How are you reading knock counts with dsmlink?

 

[tom04841]

Boost leaks won't cause IDC to go up.

I was always under the impression that it did since the ecu sees more air flow than what the motor is actually ingesting. I know on my 1g, my boost leak made me run lean at idle and my idc were 98% at wot at 16 psi. Once the leak was fixed (BOV gasket) idc went down to 85% and low trims went back to 99%

 

[GVR4592]

The maf sensor can only know how much air has passed through, it doesn't know if that air is getting vented to the atmosphere(boost leak), or if it's making it's way into the engine. The ecu calculates airflow by the signal from the maf sensor, again the ecu doesn't know that air is being vented to the atmosphere, it only knows what the maf is telling it.

 

[tom04841]

The maf sensor can only know how much air has passed through, it doesn't know if that air is getting vented to the atmosphere(boost leak), or if it's making it's way into the engine. The ecu calculates airflow by the signal from the maf sensor, again the ecu doesn't know that air is being vented to the atmosphere, it only knows what the maf is telling it.

So wouldn't that cause the car to run rich and high idc's if you had a boost leak?

 

[allwheelTSI]

So wouldn't that cause the car to run rich and high idc's if you had a boost leak?

No, the engine will just miss the air and run rich, it's not gonna add any additional fuel because of a boost leak.

 

[1993gsxtalon]

Im going to stay with the 14b for a while but eventually upgrade to a 16g.
yes i have a boost guage the reason i said 13psi vs 15-16 psi is b/c its not actually at 15-16 yet.(mbc just installed.
Im almost positive i have no boost leaks but i do have a small exhaust mani leak.
I only want around 280awhp and i cant afford to do a full fuel system and dsm link when im already so close to my goal.
My question about timing advance is that what numbers should i look for or behaivor in the curve?

Help is greatly appreciated

 

[97gstjosh]

Well if your going 16g I assume EvoIII or No? If so you def. want 680cc injectors and a 190 rewired pump thats what im using. To hit 280whp thats a must and just get an S-AFC. It will be a little difficult to tune the injectors but it can be done. My tuner told me my check engine light would turn on when I get 4 counts of knock. Did he mean 4 degrees?

 

[1993gsxtalon]

680cc that sounds a little big.. And can you not hit 280 with a 14b.

I also forgot to mention that i have a evo fmic with hard ic piping if that helps any?

 

[97gstjosh]

If your talking an EvoIII 16g 680cc are not big at all. Remember you want to get bigger so your IDCs are lower. It can be done, I believe it has someone correct me if im wrong but you need one hell of a tune and serious supporting mods. If your going to go 16g why try for 280 on the 14b? if you can do that with it why not just stay with it?

 

[1993gsxtalon]

But why are my idc's so high in the first place.Arent some people running 16psi on an entirely syock fuel system, when im getting 114% at 12-13psi?

Bottom line how can i lower my idc's

 

[steve]

Boost leaks won't cause IDC to go up.

I have to disagree. That air is counted.

The turbo works harder than it would to maintain the same boost pressure which requires more air through the MAF to make up for the lost and that ups the IDC since the ECU doesn't know and must add fuel for all of it. Yes it also means the car is running richer since the fuel isn't lost along with the air.

 

[1993gsxtalon]

So boost leak test time?

 

[tom04841]

I have to disagree. That air is counted.

The turbo works harder that it would to maintain the same boost pressure which requires more air through the MAF to make up for the lost and that ups the IDC since the ECU doesn't know and must add fuel for all of it. Yes it also means the car is running richer since the fuel isn't lost along with the air.

Thank you for backing me up. I was starting to think I was losing my mind.

 

[97gstjosh]

Yes I would say boost leak time

 

[1993gsxtalon]

Well i should pick up a rubber coupler tom. and test it x-mas.
I am positive i have a small leak around my idle screw but am i going to see something big or will a little leak cause something like that.