Setup Critique Please

[hdoerr]

The reason for this question is that I have searched for several months now and think that I have come up with a very robust, reliable, and relatively strong setup. My results are based primarily on information that I have gathered over the past two years and dsm-onster's (Wiseman) posts regarding flow potential. I have most of the parts for this setup, some of which are already on the car, but most are either in storage or soon to be ordered. I am not asking HP projections or 1/4 mile times but rather if this setup is reliable and strong. The entire setup is based on the fact that I am using a S16G and to ensure that I don't apply parts that are pointless. Here it is...

1990 Eagle Talon TSI AWD Full trim

S16G Turbo (Ported) Controlled by an MBC

2G Exhaust Mani and O2 Housing (Ported)

2.5" > 3" Downpipe + Dejon 3" cat-back with resonator and Magnaflow dual tip muffler

Supra side mount hooked up with 2.5" Upper and Lower ICP (exhaust wrap covered for insulation from under hood temps)

2G MAF + Hard intake pipe (Also wrapped)

Stock Intake Mani, fuel rail, fuel lines, and FPR. I have a AFPR if need be but I want to try and run this setup without one...why you ask? Because I think the 1G FPR can handle this pump.

850cc injectors controlled by a stage 3 Keydiver chip (all the bells and whistles) and fed by 238LHR pump from Ebay (go ahead, let'em rip)

FP1 intake cam paired with a FP2 exhaust cam as well as revised lifters and ARP head studs for security.

All timing, cooling, and sealing maintenance to be done when setup comes together. The car is not being driven, just started occasionally. I plan on maxing out the 1G BOV and run 20 PSI on 93 pump. A 3.2 Fidanza and steel flywheel will transmit the juice to base rebuilt trans which in turn sends it to a stock x-fer case and 3 bolt rear end. Not that it matters but I bought the car with Megan Racing coil over’s and 3000GT N/A brake upgrade but I figured I would throw that in. By the way the car rides on Hancook tires mounted on stock '90 Talon rims.

Please refrain from suggesting the Evo316G, I know it's a better turbo.

 

[HIGHPSI4]

Sounds good. I feel you will get better results with an AFPR. Good luck.

 

[hdoerr]

Thank you. I really don't have a more valid reason for not installing the AFPR other than what I stated above. If I am correct then I save a little cash, nothing more.

 

[gob4sho89]

What fuel pump are you going to use? Maybe post a link to it?

 

[Ceddy]

I run a lot of ebay parts on my car and have never had a problem.

But I would never use a knock off fuel pump, they are not made to last long term(10,000s of miles) like a OEM one. You don't want something burning up in your gas tank, or starving you motor of gas and running very lean.

If money is a concern look at a used Evo or Supra pump.


Also the stock O2 housings are kind of small. There are cheap tubular ones on ebay.

I have a Small 16G on my car now, it is a very fun turbo.

 

[hdoerr]

Here is the link to the fuel pump As far as the O2 goes the S16G will not out flow a ported a 2G version. We also use Ebay parts i.e. turbo, clutch, and so forth but I hear your objection.

 

[toofast82]

i think your setup sounds like it should be very fun for the street. Just curious why you are using such big injectors? Are you planning on running E85 or something? I would definitely say your car should be mid 12s capable all day with a good tune and of course a driver! I know you dont want to hear a prediction, sorry! I think it should make great streetable power with great spool! good luck!

 

[hdoerr]

Well the reason I chose the 850's is the same as when someone asks about injector size with DSM link. They are told to go huge because it leaves room for improvement and because the price difference between 550's and 850's is only $30. 850's are about as big as you can go before dead time and idle quality becomes an issue.

 

[toofast82]

makes sense! I actually used to run pte 1000cc with a keydive/safc with no problems evey day

 

[gob4sho89]

I have fic 1150's. I set the dead time according to the chart and my car idles perfect...

I have fic 1150's. I set the dead time according to the chart and my car idles perfect...well, it idles the same as when it had stock injectors...

 

[hdoerr]

Secondary to all of that, Jeff at keydiver was able to match the ECU and injectors much closer due to the fact that he had their specific flow numbers. I suppose that I am also attempting to go stealth to some degree but wrapped UICP and the kind is a dead giveaway.

 

[Slippi84]

You can run much bigger injectors and still idle and drive part throttle just fine. I don't know why you think that pump without a afpr will work though to be honest. It's not a 238LPH pump it's a 255LPH pump that flows 235LPH 13.5v at 40psi. It's a knock off 255HP walbro pump which is cool I guess but a walbro 255HP is gonna need a apr with 1:1 rising rate or you will always be half ass tuning the car. You will get speratic changes in FP because the return is too small to keep the flow moving back to the tank.

Only other thing I would say is that XSpower fmic are so cheap these days it's almost not worth going with supra smic's anymore but if your goal is 12's it will get you there.

 

[hdoerr]

You can run much bigger injectors and still idle and drive part throttle just fine. I don't know why you think that pump without a afpr will work though to be honest. It's not a 238LPH pump it's a 255LPH pump that flows 235LPH 13.5v at 40psi. It's a knock off 255HP walbro pump which is cool I guess but a walbro 255HP is gonna need a apr with 1:1 rising rate or you will always be half ass tuning the car. You will get speratic changes in FP because the return is too small to keep the flow moving back to the tank.

Only other thing I would say is that XSpower fmic are so cheap these days it's almost not worth going with supra smic's anymore but if your goal is 12's it will get you there.

First off, thank you for your feedback I agree about the injectors however the fuel pump and AFPR issue I do not (I may end up standing corrected). The target AFR on the chip is 11 to 1 and with my stock 14b still on the car (set at 20psi) I saw little to zero knock up to around 6200 - 6500 RPM...reminder; stock IC & pipes, stock O2 & DP as well as exhaust. The car feels strong and smooth plus once the S16G is in there and I am not blowing anything but hot air at 20psi then I estimate that I will see zero knock throughout.

P.S. I am attempting to make the car as tuning free as possible. Call me lazy but I just want to get in warm it up and go, no check this and check that other than oil and PS fluid Oh yeah the Supra Sidemount was a gift from a member on this board. I know this will come accross as smart ass but free beats $.01

 

[webconnect]

I think it will make a cute grocery getter

 

[->PrOjEcTGS<-]

What kind of timing did he put on that chip? Seems like a comparable setup to what I've done. Except I have a 190lph, 650's and a FMIC. If he kept the timing conservative you should be able to get away with mid 20's on pump gas. I currently run anywhere from 22-26 psi on pump 91. Then again I run a max timing of 18* by redline. It's a very very fun setup on colder days. Instant torque. Also I would suggest an AFC just to make minor adjustments if you have no other way of tuning besides the chip. I make the changes to my own chip so I don't have to worry about that though.

Welcome to the 12's.

 

[hdoerr]

The timing is programmed for 16* at wot. I am very impressed with your ability to run such high boost on 91 without water/meth injection. Have you ever dynoed the car and thank you for welcoming me to the 12's

 

[hdoerr]

Oops I shot my mouth off before I looked at your profile which clearly states that you are running water/alki injection. Oh and in regards to the whole AFC thing, I stated above that I really don't want to deal with fine tuning and simply get in and go.

 

[->PrOjEcTGS<-]

I'm not running Water/Meth. That's on my wishlist so that I can run more timing.

 

[Slippi84]

The timing is programmed for 16* at wot. I am very impressed with your ability to run such high boost on 91 without water/meth injection. Have you ever dynoed the car and thank you for welcoming me to the 12's:thumb:

Don't get head of yourself. It's good to have goals but you have to walk before you can run and while your setuyp is 12's capable it's not that easy.

 

[hdoerr]

I'm not running Water/Meth. That's on my wishlist so that I can run more timing.

Wow, I wonder how to spell A D D...shit I get way ahead of myself...sorry Slippi. I will wait to count my chicken.