SAFC and Howell ECU??

[Slippi84]

Ok i'm thinking about purchasing one of the howell 97 ecu's that advances timing and adapts to changes in the car and all that good stuff but I will be spraying my car with about a 200 shot of nitrous progressively to save the axles and other drivetrain parts. I need a way to both increase redline as I will be making power past 7200 and I want the car to feel more alive when not spraying as I don't plan on spraying all the time. The thing is I would rather add fuel instead of pulling timing when spraying so I figured a safc 2 with 2 diffrent settings one for boosting one for normal driving would be perfect but wanted to see if there are any problems running a safc with the AF/x ecu?

 

[XMasta19]

Wet shot I'm assuming?

 

[Slippi84]

Wet shot I'm assuming?

Yup I think a 200 shot of dry nitrous would be a very bad idea.

 

[XMasta19]

yeah well nowadays you never know

 

[Gamble97]

Why would the dry shot be a bad idea?
To the OP why not just save up and get dsmlink. It's more than you'll ever need.

 

[Slippi84]

Why would the dry shot be a bad idea?
To the OP why not just save up and get dsmlink. It's more than you'll ever need.

I know I used to own dsmlink for my tsi problem is I"m NA

To answer your dry shot bad idea question because your relying on your stock probably old fuel system to supply enough fuel to run your normal load AND the extra nitrous that your injection into it. Same effect as running too much boost on a stock fuel setup. Thus is why you would only really want to run wet over a 50 shot because that way all the fuel you need is being injected threw the fuel solenoid the thing you have to watch out though is without a dedicated fuel setup your still relying on your fuel pump but atleast the injectors fpr and stock lines after your fuel T are elimated from the equation.

 

[XMasta19]

+1

dsmlink = 4g63...this forum = 420a


Also, dry shot just utilizes your fuel system by modifying fuel pressure to increase duty cylcle of injectors, while a wet shot actually injects extra fuel along with the nitrous.

 

[Gamble97]

Makes sense, thanks guys, I only ask because I have a dry shot for my dsm that I plan on putting on.

 

[Slippi84]

Makes sense, thanks guys, I only ask because I have a dry shot for my dsm that I plan on putting on.

If I were you I would be very careful with a dry shot on a turbo car. I would say get a wet kit conversion as dry shots on a turbo car are a lot diffrent then a NA car. When you spray not only will you have the extra nitrous to add more O2 but your gonna have more O2 just do to the cooling affect and boost creep created from nitrous from your turbo. So a 50 dry shot might do the same thing a 75 shot would do on a NA car on your turbo car. Can I ask why you spraying a turbo car. Unless your trying to get better boost response when draging or have maxed out yoru turbo which I doubt it's really better to just tune better and upp boost the spray.

 

[bullettdsm]

I figured a safc 2 with 2 diffrent settings one for boosting one for normal driving would be perfect but wanted to see if there are any problems running a safc with the AF/x ecu?

I'll leave the thought of the advanced timing mixed with the shot up to you. But I ran the Howell unit and the safc with no problems. It netted me very little on the dyno, but I used it mainly for leaning out the low end. I got some great gas mileage with it though

It just so happens I do have an AFX/ECU I'd sell to you. But she ain't cheap. PM me if interested.

MB

 

[Slippi84]

I'll leave the thought of the advanced timing mixed with the shot up to you. But I ran the Howell unit and the safc with no problems. It netted me very little on the dyno, but I used it mainly for leaning out the low end. I got some great gas mileage with it though

It just so happens I do have an AFX/ECU I'd sell to you. But she ain't cheap. PM me if interested.

MB

My b-day is coming up in less than a month I can use that as an excuse to buy it . That's why I want to use the safc to add fuel instead of pull timing up top only when spraying that's why I said the safc2 becuase it's cheaper than the new neo and I like the knobs better than the buttons anyway and the the safc has two settings so i'll have one for off the bottle and one for on te bottle which I can switch back and forth between.

 

[Slippi84]

I'm thinking now maybe just race gas and a slightly bigger fuel pill might make things easier then a safc.

 

[1slow97]

I thought you can't add fuel with a safc? you could only take fuel away.

 

[Slippi84]

I thought you can't add fuel with a safc? you could only take fuel away.

Trust me I swore that was the case too till I looked on apexi's site and it clearly says +/-50

 

[VelocitàPaola]

Trust me I swore that was the case too till I looked on apexi's site and it clearly says +/-50

It doesn't have anything to do with what Apex'i says; of course they're going to advertise the unit's full functionality (under completely optimal circumstances, mind you) - they want to sell S-AFC's! Not all features work with all cars, though, and the feedback systems our cars employ inhibit the S-AFC from enriching the AFR. The only way to achieve sufficient amounts of control in this manner is to modify its TPS input with something like Corbin's TPS->MAP sensor mod.

 

[Slippi84]

It doesn't have anything to do with what Apex'i says; of course they're going to advertise the unit's full functionality (under completely optimal circumstances, mind you) - they want to sell S-AFC's! Not all features work with all cars, though, and the feedback systems our cars employ inhibit the S-AFC from enriching the AFR. The only way to achieve sufficient amounts of control in this manner is to modify its TPS input with something like Corbin's TPS->MAP sensor mod.

Ok well I mean it's not the end of the world I can simply add fuel and what nort via pill sizes. It's actually a lot cheaper that way and you don't have to worry about anything except clogging. af/x ecu with c16 in a fuel cell dedicated just for the nitrous fuel feeder will have to do cause I'm not messing with MSnS

 

[crab1092]

I totally agree with forgeting about the SAFC. However, have you decided how you are going to control your timing? I know you said you would rather richen the fuel instead of pulling timing. However I dont think you could make it rich enough with that much ignition advance, high compression, and that much nitrous to work safetly and efficiently. I know C16 is very high octane but it too has its limits.

 

[Slippi84]

But the thing is you dictate how much fuel inrichment you get with the pills. I was looking at Zex's site and they have a list of combos and how much hp they equate to. I figured on top of using c16 I would go one up in fuel pills to be extra safe. Say for 175hp shot you use a .043 pill for fuel and a .083 pill for nitrous. Instead of doing it like that I would use a .046 or maybe even a .052 depending on results fuel pill and then I would be more than safe I figured with c16 does this make sense??

 

[crab1092]

I have the zex direct kit on my car. If you look at the tuning suggestions you will see that zex also recommends that you pull 1 or 2 degrees of timing for every 50 hp increase you do. They also say that they recommend race gas for anything over a 100 shot. I guess there is a point at which you could put enough fuel in there to stop detonation. I just dont think that you will be anywhere close to seeing the full potential of your setup. IN your situation i think the additional 300 or so dollars it cost for an ignition would be extremely well spent.

 

[Slippi84]

I have the zex direct kit on my car. If you look at the tuning suggestions you will see that zex also recommends that you pull 1 or 2 degrees of timing for every 50 hp increase you do. They also say that they recommend race gas for anything over a 100 shot. I guess there is a point at which you could put enough fuel in there to stop detonation. I just dont think that you will be anywhere close to seeing the full potential of your setup. IN your situation i think the additional 300 or so dollars it cost for an ignition would be extremely well spent.

Yeah as much as I want the ecu it's just not worth it in my situation. I"m just gonna spray and live with how the ca is off the bottle. I would rather get the most out of my car when I spray then risk the car as a whole to get a little more out of it when i'm not spraying.

 

[Slippi84]

I have the zex direct kit on my car. If you look at the tuning suggestions you will see that zex also recommends that you pull 1 or 2 degrees of timing for every 50 hp increase you do. They also say that they recommend race gas for anything over a 100 shot. I guess there is a point at which you could put enough fuel in there to stop detonation. I just dont think that you will be anywhere close to seeing the full potential of your setup. IN your situation i think the additional 300 or so dollars it cost for an ignition would be extremely well spent.

how much you spraying by teh way with your zex kit

 

[crab1092]

I was spraying a 75 shot before i put the turbo on(stock motor). I havent gotten the balls to mess with it under boost ...yet. In a month we have Import face off here so i think i am gonna have to spray if i want a chance in hell against some of these boys around here. Its still jetted for a 75 shot so i think i will try it out as soon as my roll bar gets done.

 

[bullettdsm]

.... In a month we have Import face off here.

I hate you and your good weather

MB

 

[Slippi84]

I hate you and your good weather

MB

Yeah it's def like 1* here right now. No Bueno

Like I told Mark even though I think that the ecu is badass and would make my car pretty dam quick off the bottle with all the mods I have I am not one of those guys you will hear say yeah I went threw like one bottle last year. This thing was built like it could take being boosted so a nice couple shots a week of 100 for quick spirts and maybe 1 or 2 times a month that big 200 shot is def likely.

 

[Slippi84]

How do you 420a guys monitor knock? Can you just hook up a basic datalogger like a tubro dsm and watch for it cause to be honest there really isn't any point going to a dyno to tune other than to get numbers for on here. If I can watch knock I'm pretty much just gonna keep increasing shots till I get to about 400whp or I start seeing knock.