Resolved rear passenger brembo won't bleed

[miliman13]

Back story
This is the second non abs P valve I've used, the first would not allow any fluid to enter the rears..

Front two both inner and outer bleed valve come out thick no air.

Rear driver comes out similarly but less fluid; thus what the P valve does.

Rear passenger NOTHING
REPEATED HUNDREDS OF TIMES.
Vacuum hands pump + assistant foot pumper + praying to the gods.

Nothing***

Anyone have any insightful worth reading comments??



...
Disclaimer ' i know there's always one guy who can't wait to see his post count go up.. go a way ***** not here buddy.

 

[1990TSIAWDTALON]

Can you crack the feed line and make sure it is getting pressure? Just like when bleeding thru the bleeder? We used to have to bleed some old farm trucks that way. At least its a test. Hopefully just a plugged bleeder.
If the bleeder was good, I will tell you how I FINALLY got my motorcycle's clutch to bleed. I hooked up a liquid transfer pump (like your hand pump) and turned it on and let it suck the fluid out of the master. It worked. I was by myself so I gave it a shot after 20 some times bleeding by hand. Just a old mechanics story.

 

[tunedbysaturnsl]

Could be a clogged bleeder. Is both the inner and outer on that caliper not passing fluid or just one of them?

 

[tay97gst]

If i remember correctly I think I encountered a similar problem with my brembos. One would not bleed using the pump the brake and crack open method, no matter how many times I tried. After getting a hand pump speed bleeder it finally started flowing brake fluid.

Coincidentally enough I swapped to a non-abs prop valve at the same time as well. I know you said you tried the hand pump already and didn't have luck but maybe there's hope that that's the way to go.

Is it possible your fittings at the prop valve aren't sealed all the way so you're pulling air in instead of fluid? Are you using braided lines or the stock hardlines? Just trying to think of anything that may be of help. Good luck

 

[miliman13]

Thanks everyone.

It's both inner and outer.
I removed both bleed valves and cleaned them out.

I checked for leaks at the P valve and found none.

I'm thinking i should remove the hard line that is for the rear passenger and poke it with a paper clip, idk.

I'm using hard lines everywhere.
( Teflon tape and grease to prevent leaks)

Brembos with ABS was .
Since going non ABS my car has tried to kill me by dramatically pulling to one side when i brake...

I had ALOT of air in my lines...even though i bleed them before..


The pedal is super hard, no loss of pressure ' still no fluid to that one rear..

 

[EC17PSE]

I had this aswel, did you selfbleed the MC first! Remember when you do that you MUST hold the pedal down to close the system before you connect it back up to the Prop valve! Then you can release,

Once you done that it should bleed fine, so remove the 2 feed lines to the prop valve and bleed the MC again correctly! We have an open system so as soon as you let the pedal off it opens it up and lets air in the MC chamber and wont bleed well,

 

[miliman13]

I had this aswel, did you selfbleed the MC first! Remember when you do that you MUST hold the pedal down to close the system before you connect it back up to the Prop valve! Then you can release,

Once you done that it should bleed fine, so remove the 2 feed lines to the prop valve and bleed the MC again correctly! We have an open system so as soon as you let the pedal off it opens it up and lets air in the MC chamber and wont bleed well,

Knowing the internals of the p valve, the port the feeds from the mc , feeds the front , and the rear through the same chamber.
If I'm getting solid fluid from front, but not from rear; that instantly eliminates ( bleed the Mc) notion.

 

[EC17PSE]

Knowing the internals of the p valve, the port the feeds from the mc , feeds the front , and the rear through the same chamber.
If I'm getting solid fluid from front, but not from rear; that instantly eliminates ( bleed the Mc) notion.

you would think so but we have 2 ports for a reason and the 2 out lets in the MC mean it can keep air in the MC line and push and pull it back in, I have been in your situation and my advice is what fixed mine so you can take it or not its upto you!

I am more then happy to walk you through exactly the process I did to fix my issue like you described but if your happy you dont need or want my advice or at least try it! then please proceed to ask others

 

[miliman13]

you would think so but we have 2 ports for a reason and the 2 out lets in the MC mean it can keep air in the MC line and push and pull it back in, I have been in your situation and my advice is what fixed mine so you can take it or not its upto you!

I am more then happy to walk you through exactly the process I did to fix my issue like you described but if your happy you dont need or want my advice or at least try it! then please proceed to ask others

Proceed

 

[EC17PSE]

Proceed

are you using 1 bleed line or a split 2 line system? it matters!

first ditch the pump! use the brake pedal and only pump half way or you can blow the seals in the MC! so 2 people are needed! first close all the nipples on the calipers!

take the 2 feeds off to the prop valve! place them into the res bottle of the MC and pump so it a loop feeding itself, make sure no air is circulating still! once your happy hold the pedal down and keep it down!!! its important! or you will let air get back into the lines and it wont work! while they hold the pedal, place the ends back onto the prop valve and do them up! only once you done them up tight may you release the brake pedal!

then start with the rear passenger and get some fluid to come out! dont bleed it fully yet, just get most of the air out the line! then rear divers and then front pass and then lastly front drivers! once you dont basic air removal then go and bleed as normal! always open the inner nipple first and the pedal operator must hold the pedal down agin when you crack them open for a few seconds only! then close and only then the pedal can be released!

If you still find your getting nothing then your rear caliper internal seal ( o rings are not sealing correctly and this could be your issue! but i had no fluid from the rear either so this way fixed it for me so Im hoping this is the cause

 

[miliman13]

are you using 1 bleed line or a split 2 line system? it matters!

first ditch the pump! use the brake pedal and only pump half way or you can blow the seals in the MC! so 2 people are needed! first close all the nipples on the calipers!

take the 2 feeds off to the prop valve! place them into the res bottle of the MC and pump so it a loop feeding itself, make sure no air is circulating still! once your happy hold the pedal down and keep it down!!! its important! or you will let air get back into the lines and it wont work! while they hold the pedal, place the ends back onto the prop valve and do them up! only once you done them up tight may you release the brake pedal!

then start with the rear passenger and get some fluid to come out! dont bleed it fully yet, just get most of the air out the line! then rear divers and then front pass and then lastly front drivers! once you dont basic air removal then go and bleed as normal! always open the inner nipple first and the pedal operator must hold the pedal down agin when you crack them open for a few seconds only! then close and only then the pedal can be released!

If you still find your getting nothing then your rear caliper internal seal ( o rings are not sealing correctly and this could be your issue! but i had no fluid from the rear either so this way fixed it for me so Im hoping this is the cause

I made the attempt, to take your advice seriously....

I knew it won't work.
And it did not.
Like i said i actually understand the inner mechanism of the p valve. As I've proven to your previously in a different thread...

After pulling the rear brake and testing both rear p valve ports ice concluded that once again...
I've been screwed on p valves.

This is two valves now i bought, one from a wise man; no i don't blame him these things occur i guess....

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Also, there is some serious mistakes in the repair manuals....

It says both** that the rear brake and the front brake are on the same side, and also that it's Cris cross apple sauce...


It's Cris cross , see how the top right rear brake p valve line, and the rear passenger brake are both dry with no fluid ....

 

[EC17PSE]

I made the attempt, to take your advice seriously....

I knew it won't work.
And it did not.
Like i said i actually understand the inner mechanism of the p valve. As I've proven to your previously in a different thread...

After pulling the rear brake and testing both rear p valve ports ice concluded that once again...
I've been screwed on p valves.

This is two valves now i bought, one from a wise man; no i don't blame him these things occur i guess....

You must be logged in to view this image or video.

You must be logged in to view this image or video.

You must be logged in to view this image or video.

Also, there is some serious mistakes in the repair manuals....

It says both** that the rear brake and the front brake are on the same side, and also that it's Cris cross apple sauce...


It's Cris cross , see how the top right rear brake p valve line, and the rear passenger brake are both dry with no fluid ....

Thats fine at least you tried it, i was only saying this way as i had the same thing and it resolved my issue so it was my first initial idea an air lock was still in that line for the rear somewhere from the MC to the valve,

 

[miliman13]

Also pressurized the line from the rear brake to the p valve to try and push the piston back down...
After several tries ive surrendered

 

[kmetiuk]

Back story
This is the second non abs P valve I've used, the first would not allow any fluid to enter the rears..

Front two both inner and outer bleed valve come out thick no air.

Rear driver comes out similarly but less fluid; thus what the P valve does.

Rear passenger NOTHING
REPEATED HUNDREDS OF TIMES.
Vacuum hands pump + assistant foot pumper + praying to the gods.

Nothing***

Anyone have any insightful worth reading comments??



...
Disclaimer ' i know there's always one guy who can't wait to see his post count go up.. go a way ***** not here buddy.

I have a much different method of bleeding brakes that I have been using for YEARS without any issues whatsoever.

I also use the same method to bleed my clutch line.

Originally came up with the syringe system on the cheapo to clear my clutch line that would not bleed....and would stick the pedal to the floor intermittently while driving around. Used this to blast a tiny bit of teflon tape the idiot PO had gotten in there when doing a braided clutch line install.


ANYWAYS....it works for me...may work for you. Worth a shot as you seem stuck.


Instead of doing a regular "forward" bleed, I reverse bleed my brakes. See pic below:

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With the setup above I do the following:

1: I fill the syringe 3/4 of the way up with clean brake fluid and then hook up the tubing over the bleed nipple on the caliper and the other on the filled syringe.

2a (first time fill of the sys): If I changed lines or added Brembos then I point the syringe downwards to make sure any air bubbles in the syringe don't enter the tubing and I then crack open the nipple and force the brake fluid through as hard as I can. I open the bleed nipple so that I can empty that syringe in about 1-3 seconds so that I have TONS of flow and velocity in the lines. It forces all kind of shit out of those lines. Always surprised how much crud comes out.

2b: If the system is full and I am chasing air bubbles out then set the 3/4 full syringe on the ground, crack the bleed nipple, and pump the brake pedal a few times to get any air bubbles out of the bleed nipple/caliper/silicone tubing and into the syringe. Then I point the syringe downwards to make sure any air bubbles in the syringe don't enter the tubing and I force the brake fluid through as hard as I can. I open the bleed nipple so that I can empty that syringe in about 1-3 seconds so that I have TONS of flow and velocity in the lines. It forces all kind of shit out of those lines. Always surprised how much crud comes out.

3: I then use the syringe the "regular" bleed the system to ensure I don't have any air bubbles....which I never do. The reverse bleed just blasts fluid through there so fast that I have yet to get a air bubble during the "regular" bleed check. Reverse bleed FTW!


I do this everytime I bleed as it also flushes the whole system b/c at 1-3 seconds per 250mL (depends on syringe) of fluid you can do the whole car solo in about 10 mins. Flushed and bled.


Just my method. Works very well for me. Declogged a clutch line one time for me so hope this helps.

 

[miliman13]

This is for you, future person reading this.........


I just now learned this.

One way to know if your p valve is bad ; is you crack open your bleed Valve and nothing comes out by itself.

Then yours could be completely sealed shut..Or collapsed enough to limit flow.


I had no idea the rears were supposed to see do much flow.

....Special thanks to Miller import parts.