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1G Performance Possibilities with these mods.

Posted by Chase_Smith40, Jul 9, 2019

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  1. Chase_Smith40

    Chase_Smith40 Proven Member

    42
    0
    Joined Jun 7, 2013
    Tecumseh, Michigan
    Hey guys,
    I have a 1990 Plymouth Laser RS was looking for a guestimate of where i could be power/performance wise with the modifications that i am doing to the car as well as a possible heads up if i am headed down the wrong path. Car Currently:
    Engine:
    • Rebuilt 6 Bolt
    • 1G Rods & 2G Pistons
    • BS Delete
    • Strictly Import Motorsports Head (7 angle valve job, Crower Beehive Springs, Titanium Keepers, Large port and Polish, 272 Cams, 3g Lifters)
    • MLS Headgasket
    • ARP HeadStuds
    Fuel:
    • Stock Fueling
    Air:
    • Offbrand Tubular Manifold
    • 20g Turbo
    • MBC
    • 3IN Downpipe to 2.5in out
    Clutch:
    • ACT 2600
    Upcoming Mods:
    • FP Race Mani
    • MHI20G
    • FIC 750cc Injectors
    • Wallbro 255LPH
    • Aeromotive AFPR
    • 2g MAF
    • DSM Link V3
    • Cat-Back 3in Straight
    • Wideband
    • Injen Cold Air
    • COP Setup
    • Manual Rack conversion
    • Upgraded Motor Mounts
    Any other things that i will need?
    Thanks!
    Also if anyone has any of these parts used at a discounted rate that would be awesome.
    Located in Michigan
     

    288  0

    1990 Plymouth Laser RS Turbo
    · 1G DSM
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  2. Mham2k

    Mham2k Proven Member

    174
    25
    Joined Feb 8, 2008
    Dallas, Texas
    The 20G will max out around 450hp, your car should be able to handle that if you upgrade the fuel pump.

    Why upgrade to an MHI 20g, if you get a new turbo get a bigger one if you want more power.
     

    Street Build 352  1

    1996 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    awd · manual · 2G DSM
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  3. Chase_Smith40

    Chase_Smith40 Proven Member

    42
    0
    Joined Jun 7, 2013
    Tecumseh, Michigan
    I have the Wally 255 listed as an upcoming upgrade but can’t really mess with fuel till I have link. And I’d like to bigger but I may have to run it on stock fuel til I get the other stuff because of the cost. Also what would be a DSM flanged turbo that would be larger and support maybe 600hp?
     

    288  0

    1990 Plymouth Laser RS Turbo
    · 1G DSM
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  4. Vegas smith

    Vegas smith Proven Member

    2,691
    1,275
    Joined Dec 2, 2002
    Houston, Texas
    That car will be crazy at even 450hp. I doubt you'll want a 600hp fwd laser but some do. What are your specific goals? Will you be using gas or e85? Daily driver or weekend car?
     

    Street Build 3K  10

    1993 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    awd · manual · 1G DSM
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  5. Chase_Smith40

    Chase_Smith40 Proven Member

    42
    0
    Joined Jun 7, 2013
    Tecumseh, Michigan
    I ag
    its just a street car it’s full interior but ac was deleted and what not. I agree I want to be at 500hp no more but 450 will be more than plenty, I’d just like a turbo that is going to be good to 600hp if I ever get to that point. What is one step above a 20g? HX35? And I feel I should do E85 to get maximum potential and it’s not readily available to me. But I am not sure what is needed to convert it to e85.
     

    288  0

    1990 Plymouth Laser RS Turbo
    · 1G DSM
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  6. ThunderChild

    ThunderChild Supporting VIP

    2,541
    713
    Joined Jan 5, 2012
    Rathdrum, Idaho
    Nothing will be bolt on and make that much power while still using as many stock pieces as you can with the 20g. That said, you're also not going to make max power from a 20g with most of the factory-fit style pieces either.

    I'd ditch the cop setup, good condition stock coils will get you a loooong way. COP is not necessary and you need a controller to get the most out of it.

    Ecmlink v3 should be the first thing you get, then fuel stuff and a full 3" downpipe for sure.
    I'd recommend going bigger than you think you'll need for fuel. Not much more cost gets you a bigger pump and injectors to keep you solid to around 600 for when you pop the rebuilt short block and go built with a bigger turbo.

    Wideband, oil pressure and boost gauges are other things that are nice to have.

    The manual rack is your choice, but I'd say keep your power steering or do a depowered rack with EPAS.

    The FP race manifold is a great piece, but may be riding the line of overkill for a 20g on the street. You'd probably see better spool from a lightly ported 2g/Evo3 manifold.

    Otherwise your list looks decent. I wouldnt do much till you have ecmlink, it'll help with alot of common issues when you're mostly stock with a larger turbo.

    With everything done right and the modlist above, you should be able to have a relatively quick spooling high 300-low 400 hp setup.

    What are your goals with the car?
     

    Street Build 226  3

    1990 Plymouth Laser N/T
    fwd · manual · 1G DSM

    318  8

    1987 Toyota Pickup/Hilux
    awd · manual · Misc Vehicles

    Street Build 868  7

    1997 Mitsubishi Eclipse Spyder GST
    fwd · manual · 2G DSM

    Street Build 1K  1

    1992 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    manual · 1G DSM

    Street Build 2K  10

    1992 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    awd · manual · 1G DSM
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  7. Chase_Smith40

    Chase_Smith40 Proven Member

    42
    0
    Joined Jun 7, 2013
    Tecumseh, Michigan
    The problem is trying to find link for not $800 I have the socketed ecu just need the chip and cable and software. But I feel like I need a bunch of other stuff to run link. My goal is a 500hp or close to it Street car.
    How do you feel about a ported 2g mani and a 7blade hx35? Would I be able to get the 450-500 range with 750cc and a single 255?
    Thanks
     

    288  0

    1990 Plymouth Laser RS Turbo
    · 1G DSM
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  8. ThunderChild

    ThunderChild Supporting VIP

    2,541
    713
    Joined Jan 5, 2012
    Rathdrum, Idaho
    That's really pushing it with that fuel setup. You'd need to log IDC's, but I'd bet you'd be maxed out or really close to it. By the math, my 340 stealth and 880s should be good for 600 @90% IDC, but I'd never try to push them that far in the real world without a very close eye on everything. Your current question says 500 is doable @90% with 750cc's. I'd say go to 1100s and at least a 340 or 450 pump and future proof yourself.

    I'm not a fan of bolt on holset housings, good way to snap a turbine shaft when pushed, ask @1990TSIAWDTALON . If you're going to go holset, go t3 and enjoy. Twin scroll even better if you can afford the manifold.

    Ecmlink is one of those things that stings initially, but it's so worth it you won't even care after you drop the cash on it. That's why I say it should be your very next purchase. Check the classifieds, there's usually a couple setups for 1gs for sale for ~ 5-600 or less if it's just the chip and cable etc.
     

    Street Build 226  3

    1990 Plymouth Laser N/T
    fwd · manual · 1G DSM

    318  8

    1987 Toyota Pickup/Hilux
    awd · manual · Misc Vehicles

    Street Build 868  7

    1997 Mitsubishi Eclipse Spyder GST
    fwd · manual · 2G DSM

    Street Build 1K  1

    1992 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    manual · 1G DSM

    Street Build 2K  10

    1992 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    awd · manual · 1G DSM
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    1990TSIAWDTALON likes this.
  9. Chase_Smith40

    Chase_Smith40 Proven Member

    42
    0
    Joined Jun 7, 2013
    Tecumseh, Michigan
    I’m trying to get a manifold and turbo used for about $700 at most. So I’m basically limited to a 20g. I feel I’d like to go FP Black or Green. I do like going overkill with the big pump and big sticks. I just am trying to do it on somewhat of a budget and go used. And with e85 it’s easier to get more power right?
     

    288  0

    1990 Plymouth Laser RS Turbo
    · 1G DSM
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  10. fredom dsm

    fredom dsm Proven Member

    231
    36
    Joined Jan 31, 2006
    Denton, Texas
    Im running a 20g built by Justin with a Holset internal gate, I love it to say the least. Im running a FP exhaust mani that will be replacing for a 2g mani, I have 272 cams so I need the quick spool up. I daily drive it and dont like the 2-4 sec lag. Like Thunderchild said, its a bit over kill.
    If I was to do it all over again, I would start with the Link, the fuel for power goals and then the turbo to support those numbers. Your mod list and idea seem to be good, but if you want 450-500 and a 20g is not going to net you those goals, why buy twice? Id get the supporting mods for 500 hp then the right turbo that supports those numbers. Thats just me, I will be installing my link this fall, should be fun. Good luck on whatever you decide to do. I will be selling that FP mani soon if interested.
     

    Street Build 1K  7

    1997 Mitsubishi Eclipse Spyder GST
    fwd · manual · 2G DSM

    492  0

    1997 Mitsubishi Eclipse Spyder GST
    manual · 2G DSM
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    ThunderChild likes this.
  11. boostdawd

    boostdawd Supporting Member

    1,150
    306
    Joined Apr 6, 2010
    phoenix, Arizona
    Ditch the COP. It's not needed and a waste of money if u don't have the dynatech to control them. Hx35 with twinscroll manifold would for sure get u the power u want. E85 all u need is link of course and bigger injectors say at least 1000cc. I used to have an evo 3 running e85 with rewired 255 Wally and 1200cc injectors pushing close to 400 according to link est.
     

    Street Build 684  1

    1997 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    awd · automatic · 2G DSM

    Drag Race Build 4K  10

    1991 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    manual · 1G DSM
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  12. ThunderChild

    ThunderChild Supporting VIP

    2,541
    713
    Joined Jan 5, 2012
    Rathdrum, Idaho
    if you hunt around for the manifold to turbo, you should be able to find something in that range. Hell, might even be able to find a holset set up for that price. Keep in mind, when you go holset, you have to do a lot of other stuff just two get it fitted on there properly, as well as modify every other part that attaches to it.

    @fredom dsm is correct, that you will not get the 450 - 500 HP from a 20g.

    Yes you can get more power out of e85, but you will need even more fueling capability, as you have to supply about 40% more fuel with e85. So an even bigger and injectors.you would also need something to tune the engine for e85 use, which means needing ecmlink or some other form of engine management.

    It may be better to do all of your supporting mods first and then decide how you want to do the turbo while collecting your parts, so you don't buy twice as fredom DSM said.
     

    Street Build 226  3

    1990 Plymouth Laser N/T
    fwd · manual · 1G DSM

    318  8

    1987 Toyota Pickup/Hilux
    awd · manual · Misc Vehicles

    Street Build 868  7

    1997 Mitsubishi Eclipse Spyder GST
    fwd · manual · 2G DSM

    Street Build 1K  1

    1992 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    manual · 1G DSM

    Street Build 2K  10

    1992 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    awd · manual · 1G DSM
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  13. Chase_Smith40

    Chase_Smith40 Proven Member

    42
    0
    Joined Jun 7, 2013
    Tecumseh, Michigan
    So with this list I’m probably looking at like 380-400? And if I want to break into 450+ I need to spend 2K on a turbo setup LOL. I am sure that 400hp this car being FWD and really light is going to be more than quick on the street? I currently am running a 20g some Chinese junk and it has a 4-5 second lag which I have actually liked because it allows me to stay out of boost for normal driving and allows me to build wheel speed first being FWD. Trying to do the mods I want to next and stay under 2 thousand dollars is not really possible LOL
     

    288  0

    1990 Plymouth Laser RS Turbo
    · 1G DSM
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  14. 1990TSIAWDTALON

    1990TSIAWDTALON Moderator

    4,351
    1,864
    Joined Nov 14, 2013
    Independence, Kansas
    On gas, my 20g would get me into the high 12's at the track. When I switched to my Holset, with all the supporting mods plus E85, I dropped 2 seconds off the ET's and unleashed a MONSTER! :sneaky:
    It's ok to run a HX35 on a DSM housing but the 40's don't like the housing, as @ThunderChild said.
    I snapped 3 shafts because of the heat and the small .55 AR that all that exhaust was trying to go through. This was at 35-40 lbs boost. On my 20g, I was at 28 lbs.
    I now run T3 and haven't had any problems.....yet. :pray:
     

    Street Build 3K  27

    1992 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    awd · automatic · 1G DSM

    403  13

    1990 Mitsubishi Eclipse GSX
    awd · manual · 1G DSM

    412  17

    1967 Chevrolet Camaro RS
    rwd · automatic · Misc Vehicles

    Street Build 585  4

    1998 Eagle Talon TSi
    fwd · manual · 2G DSM

    Street Build 5K  11  25

    1990 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    13.620 @ 108.460 · 1G DSM
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  15. Boomdeeze

    Boomdeeze Proven Member

    1,627
    270
    Joined Jul 5, 2009
    Independence, Minnesota
    You really need to pick a power goal/ET before buying parts for two different goals. You say you want a turbo that will do 450 hp but also be good to 600, that's a ~15 lb/min difference which is quite a bit. If you get a turbo for 600 hp and only run it to 450, you will be adding a lot of lag to your setup that you will not like on the street.
     

    Street Build 4K  1

    1997 Mitsubishi Eclipse GSX
    10.793 @ 128.98 · 2G DSM
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    OH91awd and ThunderChild like this.
  16. ThunderChild

    ThunderChild Supporting VIP

    2,541
    713
    Joined Jan 5, 2012
    Rathdrum, Idaho
    It coming down to what @Boomdeeze said, pick a goal and stick to that.
    Being fwd, if you have anything making 300+ hp, you'll have to be realistic about a few things.
    1: traction will be almost non-existent once you get on the power.
    2: wheel hop is going to be killer.
    3: maybe 600 hp isn't a reasonable thing to do for your setup.

    400hp in a fwd is going to be a righteously quick car if setup correctly. To keep costs down, I'd go for a lightly ported 2g/Evo3 manifold, 7cm turbine housing, 8cm if you can't get a 7, 9 blade turbine, billet extended tip 20g compressor in a 3inch antisurge housing. Add in a good O2 housing and full 3" turbo back, and with the rest of the supporting mods you can easily snag close to 400hp with good drivability and lag characteristics.

    If you do a bastard housing to use j-pipes and whatnot, it's going to surge like a biatch and kill some power, but look completely sleeper.

    Make a budget, pick a goal, and start putting money away for it all. Don't get impatient to throw parts on right now, cuz you'll end up with a broken car, no money and lots of disappointment.
     

    Street Build 226  3

    1990 Plymouth Laser N/T
    fwd · manual · 1G DSM

    318  8

    1987 Toyota Pickup/Hilux
    awd · manual · Misc Vehicles

    Street Build 868  7

    1997 Mitsubishi Eclipse Spyder GST
    fwd · manual · 2G DSM

    Street Build 1K  1

    1992 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    manual · 1G DSM

    Street Build 2K  10

    1992 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    awd · manual · 1G DSM
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  17. Chase_Smith40

    Chase_Smith40 Proven Member

    42
    0
    Joined Jun 7, 2013
    Tecumseh, Michigan
    Will the FP mani 20g and the other mods I listed get me close to 400 and a fun street car?
     

    288  0

    1990 Plymouth Laser RS Turbo
    · 1G DSM
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  18. gofer

    gofer Moderator

    5,484
    971
    Joined Feb 18, 2006
    South Gilbert, Arizona
    The turbo is what's going to allow you to reach your goals, if you want something that's capable of 600whp but currently you're working towards a 450whp capable setup I recommend you buy a turbo and a fuel system that's capable of producing/supporting 600whp when you're ready.

    Since you're FWD, the 20g isn't going to be much fun on the street since WOT is just going to roast the tires and you'd be lucky to get 500whp out of it. I recommend a FP Black which bolts on, is a 71lb/m turbo and is a solid turbo from 450 to 650whp, and then get a set of injectors/pump that can support the turbo. If you're doing this on 91oct+meth injection then I'd recommend a 1000cc injector (minimum) and if you plan on reaching your goals on E85 then I'd recommend a Hi-Z 1650 or 2150cc injector.

    It might seem like overkill to jump straight into an FP Black and a set of big injectors but if you go 20g/750's you're going to be spending the money twice.


    As far as the rest of your mods list goes..
    Upcoming Mods:
    • FP Race Mani
    • MHI20G - Get a FP Black, it's slower spooling (FWD) and you can reach your HP goals.
    • FIC 750cc Injectors - Get 1000cc/m if you plan on going 91+meth or if you're going to go E85 grab Hi-Z 1650 or 2150cc/m injectors, the 750cc injectors will be >80% IDC at 450whp.
    • Wallbro 255LPH - Get a Walbro 450 pump, the 255 won't be able to support your 600 goals and you'll have to replace it.
    • Aeromotive AFPR
    • 2g MAF - Can support the 450whp goal but you'll need to look into going to a GM MAF or Speed Density setup over 500hp (50lbs/m)
    • DSM Link V3
    • Cat-Back 3in Straight
    • Wideband - If you're going with ECMLink, don't get a AEM UEGO unit they have a hard time logging accurately.
    • Injen Cold Air - You'll want the FP 4" intake, recirc with stock 2g MAS or non-recirc if you go GM MAF or Speed Density.
    • COP Setup - Just don't, the stock ignition system is capable of supporting your goals and COP setups just cause misfire problems.
    • Manual Rack conversion
    • Upgraded Motor Mounts
     

    Street Build 16K  12  61

    1997 Mitsubishi Eclipse GST
    11.634 @ 126.050 · 2G DSM

    2K  0

    1997 Mitsubishi Eclipse N/T
    manual · 2G DSM
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  19. Chase_Smith40

    Chase_Smith40 Proven Member

    42
    0
    Joined Jun 7, 2013
    Tecumseh, Michigan
    Changed my power goals up a little and i am now thinking i want to be at 400hp 450 at most thinking a billet 20g and the 750s will get me there?
     

    288  0

    1990 Plymouth Laser RS Turbo
    · 1G DSM
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  20. ThunderChild

    ThunderChild Supporting VIP

    2,541
    713
    Joined Jan 5, 2012
    Rathdrum, Idaho
    This would be my recommendation if you don't want to go holset. Maybe an fp green, but you could build a nice 20g for about half the price and make just a bit less power.
    Traction is going to be the killer no matter what really, but a solid 375-400hp in a fwd will be fun, especially if you get ecmlink, use the EBC capability and do boost by gear. Or just have a very trained right foot.
     

    Street Build 226  3

    1990 Plymouth Laser N/T
    fwd · manual · 1G DSM

    318  8

    1987 Toyota Pickup/Hilux
    awd · manual · Misc Vehicles

    Street Build 868  7

    1997 Mitsubishi Eclipse Spyder GST
    fwd · manual · 2G DSM

    Street Build 1K  1

    1992 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    manual · 1G DSM

    Street Build 2K  10

    1992 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    awd · manual · 1G DSM
    Loading...
    Chase_Smith40 likes this.
  21. Dsm panda

    Dsm panda Proven Member

    179
    55
    Joined Dec 8, 2017
    Franklin, Wisconsin
    My talon is around 300hp and fwd and I tell ya it's not as fun at low speeds as it is above 40mph. I spin the tires way to much(no lsd). Driveing my awd opened my eyes to how big a deal good tires and traction are. You could have 600hp but really 99% of the time you cant put it all down until your moveing faster. So I'd say invest in some good sticky tread as well and maybe look into a lsd. 400hp is plenty on the street.
     

    994  2

    1991 Eagle Talon TSi
    327 whp · 307 lb/ft · 1G DSM

    Street Build 604  2

    1990 Plymouth Laser RS Turbo
    fwd · manual · 1G DSM
    Loading...
    ThunderChild and Chase_Smith40 like this.
  22. Goldenugget

    Goldenugget Probationary Member

    17
    9
    Joined Jan 30, 2019
    Albany, New York
    You will find the limit of the factory fuel system very quickly.
     

    Street Build 154  2

    1990 Mitsubishi Eclipse GSX
    awd · manual · 1G DSM
    Loading...

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