Oil catch can, Help needed.

[my98GST]

Alright, I've got this Greddy catch can. I also have a FP 4" intake without the nipples on the intake pipe. My question is. Do I take the valve cover line into one port, then do I install a barb valve cover and then block it off, and then take another line from the other nipple on the catch can, install the PCV valve in to the line and plug it back in to the intake manifold?

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How would I do this for the JMF SMIM?

 

[romeen]

Here is a good but somewhat lengthy discussion on various methods for venting the crankcase, the use of catch cans with proper line routing if using one, and a possible fix for the leaking PCV valves which, unfortunately, is all too common.

http://dsmtuners.com/forums/showthread.php?t=229338&highlight=pcv

 

[oldman]

Breather side : VC -> catch can (sealed) -> intake pipe.

PCV side : VC -> PCV -> optional 2nd catch can (sealed) -> heavy duty check valve -> intake manifold.

I also suggest selling the JMF and pick youself up a couple of these.

http://www.z06vette.com/forums/printthread.php?t=73303

 

[my98GST]

the z06? I would in a heart beat

 

[oldman]

the z06? I would in a heart beat

nice.

 

[xveganxcowboyx]

I also suggest selling the JMF and pick youself up a couple of these.

http://www.z06vette.com/forums/printthread.php?t=73303

I really like that idea. I might just have to try that instead of my fuel filter.

 

[oldman]

I really like that idea. I might just have to try that instead of my fuel filter.

I don't like fuel filters because the flow rate sucks once the paper filter gets saturated with oil.

 

[xveganxcowboyx]

I don't like fuel filters because the flow rate sucks once the paper filter gets saturated with oil.

Mine seems to have almost no oil in it, actually. And that's after several thousand miles and blow-by so bad my new dipstick still pops on occasion. There may be more issues, but I'm thinking flow rate sucks all the time...

 

[TerminalTalon]

I presonally have a oil catch can. The only thing I can say is no lines from the valve cover need to go into the manifold. I have a RRE can and I am pretty sure you need a vent. Just my .02

 

[oldman]

The only thing I can say is no lines from the valve cover need to go into the manifold.

Now tell us why.

 

[TerminalTalon]

Isnt that the whole reason for a catch can. So the evaporated oil doesnt make it into the manifold or engine. The 2 lines from the valve cover go into the RRE can from both sides and there is a filter on the top for ventilation. This is just the way mine is set up. It might be different on other designs I guess.

 

[oldman]

Isnt that the whole reason for a catch can. So the evaporated oil doesnt make it into the manifold or engine. The 2 lines from the valve cover go into the RRE can from both sides and there is a filter on the top for ventilation. This is just the way mine is set up. It might be different on other designs I guess.

Well if you're not sure, you shouldn't have made such a definitive statement.

Have you ever look at what comes out of your catch can? There are many reasons why the stock PCV system is setup the way it is but I will stick to the most important. VTA setup like your only take care of half of "crankcase ventilation", it will be enough to relief pressure in most cases but it will do nothing to ventilate crankcase due to lack of vacuum in the system, ventilation as in removing blow by and contaminates which will settle into your oil if not pulled out. What you see on the bottom of your catch can when you empty it is what happens to your oil in your oil pan.

 

[romeen]

Isnt that the whole reason for a catch can. So the evaporated oil doesnt make it into the manifold or engine. The 2 lines from the valve cover go into the RRE can from both sides and there is a filter on the top for ventilation. This is just the way mine is set up. It might be different on other designs I guess.

Take Bruce's advice. When I initially bought my RRE catch can I installed it the same way you are describing (per the instructions on the RRE website). The entire time I had it set up this way my oil came out looking unusually nasty and noticeably smelling like fuel. After gaining a little more knowledge regarding how the system is meant to function I switched back to the original setup. Subsequent oil changes have revealed much cleaner looking oil. It seems as if there is less breakdown of the oil too (not as thin).

I am now using my sealed (capped off) catch can inline between VC and intake pipe. I have loosely stuffed it with some filtering material (from dad's fish pond filtration--he had a bunch of it sitting around ). No oily residue in intercooler since.

If you want to understand why the stock setup works better there are threads that discuss why utilizing intake vacuum to actively "suck" out crankcase gases is superior to just passively venting it to the atmosphere (underhood where it can make a mess).

As an added bonus you won't be getting those noxious fumes in the cabin anymore!

 

[Spoolin4Ever]

Thos little filter things that you linked to; the glass one that you said to add the couplers too; those things only work for one or 2 runs. Once there is about an ounce of oil in them, it just pushes the oil thru. Complete waste of time and money for me.

I am looking for a good, inexpensive check valve for mine, as the stock PCV valve, I believe may be why I am burning oil (and why that little air compressor filter gets full so quickly).

 

[oldman]

Thos little filter things that you linked to; the glass one that you said to add the couplers too; those things only work for one or 2 runs. Once there is about an ounce of oil in them, it just pushes the oil thru. Complete waste of time and money for me.

I am looking for a good, inexpensive check valve for mine, as the stock PCV valve, I believe may be why I am burning oil (and why that little air compressor filter gets full so quickly).

Something must be wrong, I'm running two, one on the intake side and one on the manifold side with a check valve and pcv, I empty the cans at most once every two months. Where is yours hooked up to?

 

[romeen]

FWIW, regarding the filter I gave a link to in post #9. I was recently at Harbor Freight and checked those out. To make it work you would have to buy multiple couplers and hose fittings to make it work for an automotive application resulting in a fairly bulky and heavy unit. So don't waste your time with that one.

The Husky filter that Bruce linked to seems much better suited. However I think a true catch can (larger volume) stuffed loosely with some type of filtering media would be even better.

 

[kenamond]

Thos little filter things that you linked to; the glass one that you said to add the couplers too; those things only work for one or 2 runs. Once there is about an ounce of oil in them, it just pushes the oil thru. Complete waste of time and money for me.

I am looking for a good, inexpensive check valve for mine, as the stock PCV valve, I believe may be why I am burning oil (and why that little air compressor filter gets full so quickly).

You shouldn't put a check valve in your VC breather. It needs to flow both ways. When the IM is under vaccuum, the PCV opens to ventilate the crankcase. This requires fresh, metered air to be pulled into the system via the VC breather. Under boost, the PCV closes (or is supposed to), and blowby and other CC leaks need a way out - through the VC breather.

 

[Spoolin4Ever]

Well let me put it this way; those little filters don't hold much or fill up all the way (about an inch or so is all) when I use them, yet my car still smokes...I think the PCV leaks. I had 2 of them, one for PCV, one for breather. I just didn't see any real benefit from it, car still smoked the same. And they only hold about an inch of oil. I am using Redline motor oil, and these things say not for synthetic oil also...

By the way, the specific filter I purchased were at home depot; they are used for air compressors. Might not be exact same as yours, but I think they are the same.

Yes I will only put the check valve in between PCV and intake. I just bought 2 to have a spare is all.

 

[oldman]

Well let me put it this way; those little filters don't hold much or fill up all the way (about an inch or so is all) when I use them, yet my car still smokes...I think the PCV leaks. I had 2 of them, one for PCV, one for breather. I just didn't see any real benefit from it, car still smoked the same. And they only hold about an inch of oil. I am using Redline motor oil, and these things say not for synthetic oil also...

By the way, the specific filter I purchased were at home depot; they are used for air compressors. Might not be exact same as yours, but I think they are the same.

Yes I will only put the check valve in between PCV and intake. I just bought 2 to have a spare is all.

How are you so sure your smoking issue is from your PCV system? What about turbo (excessive oil pressure/volume, clogged oil return), piston rings and valve seals/guides? Like I said, I have no problem with them filling up after 2 runs nor am I smoking out of my tailpipe on my 2k mile old engine, your problem is somewhere else, I would start with a compression test.

 

[kenamond]

Well let me put it this way; those little filters don't hold much or fill up all the way (about an inch or so is all) when I use them, yet my car still smokes...I think the PCV leaks. I had 2 of them, one for PCV, one for breather. I just didn't see any real benefit from it, car still smoked the same. And they only hold about an inch of oil. I am using Redline motor oil, and these things say not for synthetic oil also...

By the way, the specific filter I purchased were at home depot; they are used for air compressors. Might not be exact same as yours, but I think they are the same.

Yes I will only put the check valve in between PCV and intake. I just bought 2 to have a spare is all.

First, rereading your post I'm not sure why I thought you were putting a check valve in your VC breather line. Sorry.

So you have a check valve on your PCV line or just the mini catch can? If the PCV is leaking and you don't have the check valve, and you've given up on getting an OEM PCV that holds boost, I think you should try the check valve. Verify it holds 20psi or whatever is 5psi higher than the boost you run.

If you do have the check valve in-line with the PCV, does it leak in a boost leak test? If so, the check valve isn't doing its job.

If all check valves, etc. are working properly and you have the mini-filter on the VC breather line and you're still burning oil, could it be one of the other oil-burner culprits and you're just in denial about it? If all of those are in place, blocking oil, and holding boost (PCV), I don't see how they could be the culprits.

Also, do you know if the baffles in the VC have been removed? That could easily account for excessive oil out the VC breather or the PCV.

Did that make any sense?

 

[Spoolin4Ever]

How are you so sure your smoking issue is from your PCV system?
I am not sure yet...I just ordered the check valve today, we'll see if that helps.

What about turbo (excessive oil pressure/volume, clogged oil return), piston rings and valve seals/guides?
I will inspect for shaft play, although this is a fairly low-mileage EVO3 16G turbo. I will post back. There is no smoke upon startup so I don't think it's valve seals. It's not like it's my first day here, I have owned this car for 4 years..

Like I said, I have no problem with them filling up after 2 runs nor am I smoking out of my tailpipe on my 2k mile old engine, your problem is somewhere else, I would start with a compression test.
I didn't so much say that they fill up completely, but just if I do a hard pull, that there is some oil in it, and that they don't seem to be effective at stopping oil burning after a few runs. That's basically it. After about an inch of oil is in these little filters, they are ineffective for me.

Now it looks like were comparing your 2K old engine to my 60K engine? Not sure why...Let me ask you; why do you need one on an engine that new?

A compression test has already been done..it's about 150 across all 4.

Umm.. also; if it was the turbo, or oil return line; that would not fill up the little filter, would it?

And it's not suprising a 2K old engine doesn't fill up the little filter or catch can...is it? Compared to a 60K engine? Most anyone with blowby, or PCV valve leaking, that little filter would need to be emptied very frequently to be useful, was my point. I mean I bought 2 of them plus all the fittings...comes to about $40, and it turned out to be fairly useless. Basically a waste of $40...

So how about if I check for shaft play, and install the check valve, then I will post back?

If that doesn't take care of it, I will look at inspecting the oil return line, but that will have to wait till spring/summer..

 

[Spoolin4Ever]

First, rereading your post I'm not sure why I thought you were putting a check valve in your VC breather line. Sorry.

So you have a check valve on your PCV line or just the mini catch can? If the PCV is leaking and you don't have the check valve, and you've given up on getting an OEM PCV that holds boost, I think you should try the check valve. Verify it holds 20psi or whatever is 5psi higher than the boost you run.

If you do have the check valve in-line with the PCV, does it leak in a boost leak test? If so, the check valve isn't doing its job.

If all check valves, etc. are working properly and you have the mini-filter on the VC breather line and you're still burning oil, could it be one of the other oil-burner culprits and you're just in denial about it? If all of those are in place, blocking oil, and holding boost (PCV), I don't see how they could be the culprits.

Also, do you know if the baffles in the VC have been removed? That could easily account for excessive oil out the VC breather or the PCV.

Did that make any sense?

I had the "mini catchcans" ONLY, on both. wasn't very effective. I took them both off. I think it was a waste of $40. Oh well, I guess it was worth a try.

 

[oldman]

I don't know why you have such a hostile attitude, we are only trying to help you figure out what your problem is, it is certainly not the size of the catch can.

Now it looks like were comparing your 2K old engine to my 60K engine? Not sure why...Let me ask you; why do you need one on an engine that new? And it's not suprising a 2K old engine doesn't fill up the little filter or catch can...is it? Compared to a 60K engine? Most anyone with blowby, or PCV valve leaking, that little filter would need to be emptied very frequently to be useful, was my point. I mean I bought 2 of them plus all the fittings...comes to about $40, and it turned out to be fairly useless. Basically a waste of $40...

Rings need time to seat properly, new engines will always have more blow by and lower compression numbers. I have been running this catch can for 2 years now on both old (120kmiles with 160-165 compression on breather side only) and new engine, recently added (just the breather side) to my 95' AWD (90k miles with 170ish compression) as well as many other DSMs locally, none has problems smoking or catch can filling up too quickly

A compression test has already been done..it's about 150 across all 4.

Did you follow it up with a wet test?

I had the "mini catchcans" ONLY, on both. wasn't very effective. I took them both off. I think it was a waste of $40. Oh well, I guess it was worth a try.

You're not suppost to run it on the PCV side without a heavy duty check valve between catch can and IM, I can only imagine what the catch can looks like under 20psi of pressure. Bottom line, something is not right with your system, blaming the size of the catch can will not solve the problem.

 

[turbosax2]

I also suggest selling the JMF and pick youself up a couple of these.

http://www.z06vette.com/forums/printthread.php?t=73303

Is there any real advantage of using these compared to a true catch can except the price?
Is it OK to put a catch can on the pcv valve on a street driven car - I seem to remember reading that you shouldn't mess with the pcv if its street driven. Also, what is the advantage of putting some filtering material in a true catch can?

 

[oldman]

Is there any real advantage of using these compared to a true catch can except the price?

As long as the catch can is not vented to atmospere, no, except the fact you will get slightly better filtration with the linked catch can. They're both catch cans, one is just bigger (and bling bling) but empty (which relies on gravity alone for filtrations) and the other us smaller but with built in filter element.

Is it OK to put a catch can on the pcv valve on a street driven car - I seem to remember reading that you shouldn't mess with the pcv if its street driven.

You're not messing with the pcv at all, as long as you follow the formula in post number 3, IM ->heavy duty check valve-> sealed catch can -> PCV -> VC. The heavy duty check valve is to prevent pressurizing the catch can as well as leaking pressure into the crankcase, a well known issue with the PCV valve. Keeping the PCV valve is to regulate flow when IM is in vacuum as well as minimizing amount of oil pulled out of the crankcase.

Also, what is the advantage of putting some filtering material in a true catch can?

To promote better filtration/settlement in an empty catch can therfore minimizing amount of oil passing right through the can.