No lag electronically spooled turbo

[Bohrn]

the only one that works is the Thomas Knight one, and its heavy and big and expensive.

Of course they shouldn't be called turbo chargers, but electric superchargers, thats another topic.

These work well on cars that are not turbo from the factory, but they are inferior to a good factory turbo setup and run lower boost and lower CFM. As well the extra batteries in the trunk weigh the car down and can only go for 15 seconds or less.

 

[No_Skillz]

the only one that works is the Thomas Knight one, and its heavy and big and expensive.

Of course they shouldn't be called turbo chargers, but electric superchargers, thats another topic.

These work well on cars that are not turbo from the factory, but they are inferior to a good factory turbo setup and run lower boost and lower CFM. As well the extra batteries in the trunk weigh the car down and can only go for 15 seconds or less.

In the one I'm talking about, the setup and operation acts like any ordinary turbo, except an electric motor aids spool up at lower rpms, and exhaust takes over at higher rpms. The turbo looks exactly like a normal turbo except for the fact that there is an extra housing for the electric motor behind the compressor.

 

[1993eclipseGS]

Is it for your car? Don't you already have instant spool on a t25?

 

[GSX_RCR]

anti-lag was invented for a reason

Anti-lag is very harsh on the turbine wheel. But it sounds bad ass, that's for sure.

I prefer my anti-lag in chemical form.

 

[Ryan95tsiAWD]

there was a video floating around with different cars on the dyno and how a leaf blower actually increased HP! I'm sure someone could get creative and hook one of those guys up for "anti-lag".

 

[No_Skillz]

Is it for your car? Don't you already have instant spool on a t25?

Let's not poke fun. I was just wondering because I've seen this turbo but no application to our cars, which would really benefit with only a 2.0L engine.

 

[ericbev]

VNT turbo's have been around for decades. Chrysler used them in the 80's. Diesel's use them today, I think porsche is using them. They are on Garrett's website.

http://www.honeywell.com/sites/ts/t...GMKQK64U00ACROYP858GKIH564VY0812155701757.htm

This is correct. The technology has been around for a while but the first car I am aware of that utilized this was the 1989 Dodge CSX.

The new Porsche 911 (997) will use this design. Porsche claims a a rise in torque from 415 to 457ft lbs as well as in the spread of the peak torque: previously from 2700-4600 rpm now to 1950-5000. I bet this stuff sure is expensive.

http://www.autoblog.com/2005/11/27/next-911-turbo-to-feature-variable-turbine-geometry/

 

[jaredgsx]

There was a guy who tested using super compressed air to spin the turbo independent of the exhaust gas. Well the at the rate he had to expell the gas, and he was using a very small nozzle. like insted of the normal 6-7cm opening on the manifold, he was using a N20 nozzle, anyway, the pressure was so great it wore down the turbine blades in a matter of minutes. So i would just stick with exhaust power.

 

[RiceKiller_TSi]

Reason I posted about using compressed air is because I've used my air gun to spool my turbo before and I don't think that a "properly" mounted and proper sized nozzle would damage the compressor fins. If mounted inside the intake at the proper angle for optimal spool and with a nozzle that does not concentrate immense focus on one spot I believe it would work. I'd build this myself but I don't have the time and money to take on this type of project.

 

[Maglin]

http://www.holset.co.uk/files/2_5_1_5-variable%20geometry.php

There is a link to the Holset's version of a variable turbine cross section with a nice slick gif of how it works. I'm very impressed and this one doesn't require electricity. Can be ran off Vaccumm and maybe a solonid.

 

[No_Skillz]

Reason I posted about using compressed air is because I've used my air gun to spool my turbo before and I don't think that a "properly" mounted and proper sized nozzle would damage the compressor fins. If mounted inside the intake at the proper angle for optimal spool and with a nozzle that does not concentrate immense focus on one spot I believe it would work. I'd build this myself but I don't have the time and money to take on this type of project.

You could just use the gun for your forced induction needs and bypass the turbo altogether.

 

[Maglin]

BTW using forced air pressure to spin a turbo would need to be done on the exhaust side and not the best idea. You are adding more air volume to your exhaust and thus going to create more backpressure. You don't want anything inside your intake blowing C02 or worse yet pure O2.

I've never really understood why so many are conserned with turbo lag. You just downshift and their you go. lag gone. I understand autocrossers not wanting lag but they also don't need monster turbo's either. Although I have seen a drag DSM place 3rd in a reginal autocross event. Think it was sporting a 60-1. And If I remember right it was a 11.6 second car.

 

[RiceKiller_TSi]

You could just use the gun for your forced induction needs and bypass the turbo altogether.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but without the turbo you'd have to have one heck of a powerful air compressor to keep the pressure high enough to create boost in the intake. Interesting idea though. Who knows what the future will hold.

 

[RiceKiller_TSi]

You don't want anything inside your intake blowing C02 or worse yet pure O2.

If you don't mind, whats the problem with using Co2 or just plain ol compressed air to pre spool the intake side of the turbo?

 

[No_Skillz]

If you don't mind, whats the problem with using Co2 or just plain ol compressed air to pre spool the intake side of the turbo?

I'd imagine because CO2 = no combustion

Using compressed air is very possible, although it sounds like it would be a complicated and heavy setup.

 

[RiceKiller_TSi]

I'd imagine because CO2 = no combustion .

Yeah, but you're not trying to inject it into the intake like some kind of water injection, just use it to spool the turbo. For example mounting the nozzle inside the intake tube right before the turbo. And this type of pre spool would only be used for a brief period in this theory not on all the time. This is all hypothetical and I'm getting tired of even thinking about how to make it work anyhow.

 

[Steve93Talon]

Years ago, Garrett debuted a prototype of a hydraulic driven turbo. Picture a turbo with a hydraulic line in and out of the turbine housing instead of exhaust gas. From talking to some of the techs at SEMA a couple years later, it showed alot of promise, but they dropped it due to lack of response from the OEMs.

 

[DSM90AWD]

I'd think if compressed gas or hydrolics were used an entirely different turbo design would be needed, like using a series of reduction fans/gears/clutch that could drive the compressor at varying speeds (like an A/T) with an electronic controller.

Then again this is something that would be hellaciously expensive and as such not in the budget of 99.99999% of DSMers

 

[brute]

Variable Geometry Turbos utilize different angles on the turbine wheel. The new Porsche 911 turbo uses one of these. I found a site of how they work with pictures so you guys can understand it easier. Read the text also, it's pretty fascinating.

http://www.motiontrends.com/2006/m03/porsche2/vtg_turbo.shtml

See how the blades change angle to allow more or less exhaust to pass over them?

 

[Maglin]

Cause Co2 will be filling your cylinders and you want O2 in their to burn. That is why their are Co2 fire extinguishers as they will help to kill a fire.

And if you retorted with just use compressed O2 that is an even worse idea. Pure O2 is to volitale. That is why it's not used in place of No2. The nitrogen acts as a buffer to help control the burn. Pure O2 would cause a very violent explosion ended with parts of motor everywhere at times. I bet if a track tech saw a green O2 bottle in someone's car in place of nitrous that person would get banned from the track for at least a year to think about the errors of his ways. At least that is what I would do.

And people that are using No2 to help spool isn't throwing it at the turbo. It's going into the motor and burned. It's a very condensended oxygen/nitrogen/fuel charge that will expand a lot and thus produce more exhaust gases/pressure at a lower RPM and help spool up a turbo faster. That is probably the best way to go about adding something to the car to help spool up. Expensive yes but safer for the turbo than throwing pressurized air at one of the wheels.

 

[ITSME4G63]

http://www.porsche.com/all/masterwerk/usa.aspx

watch the whole thing, the new 911 turbo has those turbos with electronically controlled veins in them, they call it vtg, variable turbine geometry.

 

[Thomas91169]

I bet if a track tech saw a green O2 bottle in someone's car in place of nitrous that person would get banned from the track for at least a year to think about the errors of his ways. At least that is what I would do.

i wouldnt. id let him run it and find out the hard way the errors of his ways.

 

[Maglin]

i wouldnt. id let him run it and find out the hard way the errors of his ways.

I've always wanted to see it in action. But It could grenade the motor and cause parts to fly and possibly hurt people. that I wouldn't want to happen.

 

[awdwhip]

http://www.porsche.com/all/masterwerk/usa.aspx

watch the whole thing, the new 911 turbo has those turbos with electronically controlled veins in them, they call it vtg, variable turbine geometry.

sweet vid, i look forward to the future of vtg turbos that could very well be implemented on our DSM's

 

[ITSME4G63]

sweet vid, i look forward to the future of vtg turbos that could very well be implemented on our DSM's

I Dont know about that, if they are electronically controlled, means that the ecu will have to have some kind of input on it, well unless the turbos would come already with some somrt of plug which could be plugged into a stand alone, or dsm link.

But that car is wicked!