mmcd knock, 2nd opinion needed

[wannarace]

The links posted are for three seperate runs. cruise, MID and WOT. so far, what i've done to fix: re-tourqued knock sensor, replace manifold with stock to eliminate known exh. leak, ripped out emissions feedback and put egr block, timing set to 5 degrees and idle around 718-750, checked engine bay for loose items to be causing false Knock. I have added an aeromotive FPR to the mix to be certain of fuel pressure. Have that set to 39 with vac. hose off. with hose on, drops to 33-34.

things i'll soon try: setting base timing to 0 degrees. re-tuning with the MAF-t only setting it to 450cc injectors to richen my base line. if i'm thinkin about that right...? i have been doing boost checks religiously but i guess i'm due for another. i do also notice that my WG flapper has a slight leak. wondering if that may be part of the problem. well guys i'm stuck, anyone else has idea or comments that i may have missed out on. will be busy with work this week so i'll get to my list next week.

Thanks




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[turboglenn]

Man, i'm lost on that. It's the factory knock sensor and similar events that cause me to use a system without a knock sensor for years. Now i have a J&S safeguard knock sensor and it's 10000x better than stock, so if you can afford one, it's a lot more reliable and you only have to take yours out, put it in and hook up about 5 wires

 

[Black_Bullet]

Your TPS shows you were only 80% throttle... Were you really full throttle and it was only reading that way? If so id look into getting a new TPS , maybe thats screwing with your afr?
Speaking of that... Do you have a wideband? If so what is your WOT afr?

You didnt give us too many variables to help solve your problem.
How much boost are you running? That could tell a lot right there.
What are you tuning with, fuel trims etc?

You shouldnt be knocking in partial throttle like it showed in that first link.
Possible that the knock board is damaged in your ecu? Is your ecu capactitors leaking?

Do you have any local friends with a turbo 1g dsm that could let you borrow their ecu and see if the knock goes away? From the looks if it, looks like your on stock timing maps, ( which are getting hella timing pulled.) Either way your knocking thruout your whole rev range and thats weird.

Someone else can elaborate on this, but maybe if you took out your knock sensor but still leaving it plugged in and wrapped it in a thick towel to shelter it from vibration, then drive around ( no boost, just cruise ) and see if it still logs knock... If so you have another problem, because in that scenario i just discribed there shouldnt be no knock for the sensor to pick up...( Dont unplug it though, that may throw a code and give you default knock maps or something.)

Something may be fudged up because if youve been driving around with that much knock youd be shooting your dipstick out or have thrown a rod. Fingers crossed that its fake knock...

Which leads me to another question... Do you have any excessive vibrations coming from your engine/ drive train, or anything that would trigger phantom knock?

When i revved it up suddenly , or did a stuttarbox my car used to throw out a lot of phantom knock and set off my 10 count knock buzzer. This was due to harsh vibrations of having no balance shafts, prothanes, and the main reason of the vibrations being that the flex section of my 3in megan DP was sitting smack up against my Tcase... Well i took off the DP after I got tired of that, and i used a sledge hammer and dented it in some to were it just barely cleared the Tcase without touching, and boom, 70 % of my vibrations vanished.

Another trick i did was program my chip to ignore all knock under 3500 rpms, which is were the prothanes/ bs removal contributes the most to the vibrations.
I figured that random knock in this area was jusdt phantom knock. Doing that all so helped/

 

[wannarace]

thanks guys, sorry, i knew i might have left some stuff out, i was kind of in a hurry.

To "Black Bullet", no wide band. using MMCD. The 80% throttle was a MID range pull. I have a MAF-T and wired it inside the car. i just hit the gas hard enough that the green stayed illuminated without going into WOT mode. that's set at 20psi. i've tried at 15 and get the same results.

As far as the knock thing goes, yes, it is confusing the crap out me. you would think that with that much knock, you should be hearing something. the only thing out of the ordinary is i can feel it pulling timing on me. just the fact that it's doing that kinda makes me cringe. but had to do it to see what it did. ya know what i mean. i also ordered the revised lifters to eliminate the possibility of lifter tick.

now that you say... i do have prothanes. the vibrations, well who knows, i spent part of my day saturday rev'ing the engine and listening and tightening things that were loose.

here's another fact though. i do have a jdm engine. i blew the original due to lost oil pressure. i put the original manifold and TB to keep vaccum lines right. i put the original CAS on there as well. By original i mean my previous engine. i have been through the manual a few times, checking the TPS, ISC and CAS. they are all fine.

now that i think about it. set at 20psi. it'll jump to 15 but takes a sec. to climb to 20. could be boost leak. bad thing and good thing about a blow through set up. if you have a leak it's not metered so the car doesn't act up too bad. then again, you don't know the problem is there. the only thing that throws the idea of that is that i knock bad while cruising. That's with no boost.

anyways, thanks for the input guys. gave me some more things to look for. it may not be till next week that i get to it but i'll surely post if i find anything or not.

 

[Black_Bullet]

thanks guys, sorry, i knew i might have left some stuff out, i was kind of in a hurry.

To "Black Bullet", no wide band. using MMCD. The 80% throttle was a MID range pull. I have a MAF-T and wired it inside the car. i just hit the gas hard enough that the green stayed illuminated without going into WOT mode. that's set at 20psi. i've tried at 15 and get the same results.

As far as the knock thing goes, yes, it is confusing the crap out me. you would think that with that much knock, you should be hearing something. the only thing out of the ordinary is i can feel it pulling timing on me. just the fact that it's doing that kinda makes me cringe. but had to do it to see what it did. ya know what i mean. i also ordered the revised lifters to eliminate the possibility of lifter tick.

now that you say... i do have prothanes. the vibrations, well who knows, i spent part of my day saturday rev'ing the engine and listening and tightening things that were loose.

here's another fact though. i do have a jdm engine. i blew the original due to lost oil pressure. i put the original manifold and TB to keep vaccum lines right. i put the original CAS on there as well. By original i mean my previous engine. i have been through the manual a few times, checking the TPS, ISC and CAS. they are all fine.

now that i think about it. set at 20psi. it'll jump to 15 but takes a sec. to climb to 20. could be boost leak. bad thing and good thing about a blow through set up. if you have a leak it's not metered so the car doesn't act up too bad. then again, you don't know the problem is there. the only thing that throws the idea of that is that i knock bad while cruising. That's with no boost.

anyways, thanks for the input guys. gave me some more things to look for. it may not be till next week that i get to it but i'll surely post if i find anything or not.

For most of us boost leaks test should be done about once a week.
I dont do mines that often because i have my setup pretty tight and have had the same minor leak at my tb shaft seals, but i do test mines at least once or twice a month.

A boost leak will definitly cause the results your saying, even w/ the maft setup.
Also make sure your boost leak isnt after the Maft ( i.e. TB shaft seals, vacuum hoses, injector seals. )

Now if all that checks off, then maybe you sure confirm your fuel pump is still good.
Make sure that your fuel lines are ok, and for the hell of it change your fuel filter and maybe even run some seafoam engine cleaner thru that motor and fuel system.

If your still in the same predicument after that, then try my idea about pulling the knock sensor out of the block and wrapping it in something thick and soft that can absorb vibrations like a towel and drive around to see if you still have the same results. *( Leaving the knock sensor still plugged in of course.)

Also confirm that your mechanical timing is correct and that your running proper fluids and etc.
Your car should feel a ton faster when you fix your issue and get your full timing adv back with that 20 psi!

 

[Talek]

I have an almost identical situation. I'm running an evo16g with 650cc injectors and a 3" gmaft. Right now I'm only pushing 14lbs and I'm afraid of damaging something. According to my logs, whenever I do a pull and push more than like 8-10lbs I log 20-30 counts of knock with no audible signs in the cabin. I have noticed that my TPS only registers 80% or so typically even though I think I have it floored.

I'm running pretty rich as far as I can tell, even so I tried richening it up top but didn't notice an appreciable decrease in knock, even after lowering the boost output as well. I'm anxious to figure this out. Now that it's nicer out I'll try wrapping my knock sensor. Aside from that, I'm at a loss.

Edit: I don't typically get knock while cruising. Occasionally I'll get a moderate spike for one read and then it's gone.

 

[wannarace]

well i've got the time this week so i started working on it. so far i've pulled the intake manifold and ordered a new gasket, TB gaskets and injector seals. In the mean time i've been scrutinizing everything on the back side. Nothing loose or anything. i also got the red rtv to ensure i'm not leaking. man, pulling that manifold is a biznatch!!! hopefully i'll have it back together in the next couple of days to try it out.

 

[Talek]

I'm anxious to find out what you discover because I have a feeling it is the root of my problem as well. If there's anything specific you want me to check just in case, lemme know.

 

[wannarace]

well i did get the manifold back on last night. alot easier going back on then it was comming off. i spent a minuite this morning checking my timing and idle and all that good stuff but as soon as i backed up and let off the gas to shift into 1st, the car just stayed at a 2k rpm idle. needless to say now i have to go back over my throttle cable, TPS and all that good stuff.

I did notice a noise comming from a pulley. couldn't pinpoint wich one though. hope to god it's not my water pump. almost sounds like a bearing noise... very light clicking. not too mention i think my pwr steering pump is squeeking a little. maybe....?

well i guess one thing at a time... i'll get the idle right, make a test run and see if it helped at all.

 

[wannarace]

boo-yah... forget the pulley thing. i went for a ride and my idle was sitting pretty high.. adjusting throttle cables was a quick fix. i hit I-10 for a quick run and all i can say is holy shit. i almost forgot what that felt like. made the run at 20psi. the links are for my 3rd gear pull and just cruising. the cruise log is actually the worst log yet, other than that, i typically saw 1 or 2 which is normal. now, i am showing alot of knock on the WOT log but now i have either, a nice little boost leak, or my fuel pump isn't sealing in the feed tube, which may more than likely explain the high IDC's and why the car doesn't start very quick. turns over a few times before firing. (loss of fuel pressure). The only thing is that i am using a aeromotive FPR and i did crank it up to like 70psi for a pressure check and worked fine. i'm guessing it's two totally different conditions so it may act differently...?

anyways, short story long... i attribute my previous knock to either a leak in my intake manifold gasket and/or bad injector seals. i know it wasn't the throttle body cause i RTV'ed the hell out of it in the beginning. i do notice a difference in exhaust tone also. sounds a little more throaty and deeper. even with the retarded timing on the WOT it got the adrenaline going... oh and no the engine didn't blow... yet. ha ha

WOT

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cruise

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[Black_Bullet]

20 + counts of knock isnt anything to take lightly.
Im unhappy when i get more than 5 counts. Not to be the bearer of bad news but
this knock is putting accelerated wear and tear on your engine, and will take it out if this continues for long enough.
No motor can deal with repeated knock, and Im one that doesnt like to assume its fake knock.

Something you may want to consider ( something i have.)
Is getting a knock light/ knock buzzer... Of course you will need to chip your ecu or some sort of stand alone to operate this,but for instance, I have a knock buzzer hooked up to my purge solenoid ( not in use, emissions pulled.)
and whenever i get 10 counts of knock or more, my ecu is told to send a signal to the purge solenoid and boom, the knock buzzer goes off and I hear it instantly and let off the gas... Therefore i dont stay on it when i have any sever knock. This buzzer has helped me greatly dozens of times, and i cant see myself going without one now knowing what I know... Logging knock just tells you the damage already done, doesnt tell you to take your foot off.
So many 4g63 engines would be spared if only people had better control of their tuning and knock monitoring...

Now to get into it.... From looking at your logs your timing is way to high...
Honestly for 20 psi on pump gas full throttle and 4k rpms up my timing starts at about 10 or 11 degs and slowly ramps up to a peak of 19, but the 19 degs advance doesnt come until after 7k were boost is already falling flat on its face...

Your logs are showing you with around 17 degs of timing all the way thru torque peak which is the worst place to have high timing and its also the area of the rev range were knock is most harmful.

I cant remember what your tuning with or what injectors you've got going on ( too tired to read the thread again) but appears like you have a safc or something which i pretty much always direct people with crappy 93 octane away from those.
Another thing about knock is since the dsm cylinder head doesnt have any special efficient cool design or anything, once you start knocking its hard to stop knocking throughout the rest of a pull.
So if you knock at 4k, that knock may carry all the way thru 7k until you shift into the next gear.

Go get you some BR7ES NGK spark plugs if you have stock plugs.
These plugs are non projected and help against knock.
The projected tip style plugs are more prone to knock, projected plugs would read BRP7ES....
So if it has a P in it dont get it.

Also something else you should know is that you can also knock from running too rich... "Rich knock."
Masking a detonation problem by throwing more fuel on it doesnt always help a situation.

I dont know what your fuel trims and afr looks like ( wideband?) but
one thing i can see is that you need to get that timing down and just doing that alone I bet you stop knocking.

 

[wannarace]

thanks for the help....

you got me kinda confused though... aren't 1G's known for their "aggressive timing maps"? i originally thought the same as you but i've read a few posts that say otherwise. i am set to 5 degrees base timing, i guess i'll try a little lower and see what happens.

i did notice the knock was happening at the time i was experiencing that surge, stutter or hesitation. whatever it's called. i have had a similar experience with low fuel pressure. whatever the case, at least if i pull timing for the time being i'll have a lesser chance of detonation. i am with you on the fake knock, i cleared up most of the knock i was getting which tells me it never was fake knock. i don't get on it much anymore living in the city but when cruising, even though i can't hear knock, i can feel timing being pulled. that's my cue for lettin off. how did you tie in the solenoid with the ecu... my solenoid is empty as well and sounds like i may do a similar setup.

i will most definately look into those injectors though.

As far a EGT's go, they look normal up until WOT. a little over 800 degrees at idle, about 1300 for cruise around 50-60 and 1400 70 and up. when i lay into the pedal, it stays at 1400. i know you can't just go by the EGT's but it is a great help. does that sound like i'd be too rich or is that my EGT setup just haning up at 1400?

while i'm thinking about it, maybe you can help with this. when in WOT the ECU goes into closed loop, i know it goes off of predetermined values and i read .91-.93v from my o2 sensor via MMCD. the question is, even if the fuel trim is showing 100%, is it there still a possability of being lean or too rich.

using MAF-T and i'm running 550cc injectors, i guess before long i'll have to upgrade that too.

thanks again bud...

 

[Black_Bullet]

thanks for the help....

you got me kinda confused though... aren't 1G's known for their "aggressive timing maps"? i originally thought the same as you but i've read a few posts that say otherwise. i am set to 5 degrees base timing, i guess i'll try a little lower and see what happens.

i did notice the knock was happening at the time i was experiencing that surge, stutter or hesitation. whatever it's called. i have had a similar experience with low fuel pressure. whatever the case, at least if i pull timing for the time being i'll have a lesser chance of detonation. i am with you on the fake knock, i cleared up most of the knock i was getting which tells me it never was fake knock. i don't get on it much anymore living in the city but when cruising, even though i can't hear knock, i can feel timing being pulled. that's my cue for lettin off. how did you tie in the solenoid with the ecu... my solenoid is empty as well and sounds like i may do a similar setup.

i will most definately look into those injectors though.

As far a EGT's go, they look normal up until WOT. a little over 800 degrees at idle, about 1300 for cruise around 50-60 and 1400 70 and up. when i lay into the pedal, it stays at 1400. i know you can't just go by the EGT's but it is a great help. does that sound like i'd be too rich or is that my EGT setup just haning up at 1400?

while i'm thinking about it, maybe you can help with this. when in WOT the ECU goes into closed loop, i know it goes off of predetermined values and i read .91-.93v from my o2 sensor via MMCD. the question is, even if the fuel trim is showing 100%, is it there still a possability of being lean or too rich.

using MAF-T and i'm running 550cc injectors, i guess before long i'll have to upgrade that too.

thanks again bud...

Ay man, i dont know much about EGT gauges or if its even worth to tune off of those, i just know whats hot and what isnt considered too hot. If your timing is getting retarded your EGTs naturally will increase. That doesnt mean nothing for your afr imo...
Someone else will have to answer that question..

I can go back thru my knock buzzer setup and tell you how it was done.
My friend set it up, and i believe the parts were purchased at radio shack.
It wont work if your trying to wire up a knock buzzer just by a maft or safc. I use custom eprom chips...

Also, knock is knock regardless of what rpm your at... Sure you can have different severities of knock at different loads but it still is a very stressful situation to always be riding on knock... I cant speak much for your fuel setup, maybe your injectors arent being compensated right or something? But the thing i CAN tell you is that you have way too aggressive timing advance... More aggressive than stock, which can show signs of that maft/ safc ( whatever it was that you tune w/ ) raising your timing adv due to injector compensation... When you lie to the ecu to run bigger injectors its basically telling it theres less air flow so that it doesnt open the injector as much... Less air flow puts you on a different g/rev load row and generally means more timing.
With my chip, and my evilscribe tuning program i can tune each low row individually in my car but since you cant your running unsafely...

Now your issue does seem a little abnormal. If you could get your hands on higher octane until you fix your problem it may save you an engine and at least youd have fun again
when you drive your car.

I will suggest you change your spark plugs to the br7es if you dont have those currently., and doing another boost leak test as well... Not to mention turning the boost down.

 

[wannarace]

i would love to know how you set up that knock buzzer. that would be a big help.

new findings... i kept smelling gas everytime i made a run. when i cranked up the AFPR at idle, i guess i didn't wait long enough. this time i cranked it up to 70 psi and went around the car to see if i could smell gas. sure enough, the feed line under the fuel filter was leaking. i'm assuming that has to be what my high RPM hesitation was from.

i'm going to fix that possibly today and i'll get back on here with the results.

 

[Black_Bullet]

i would love to know how you set up that knock buzzer. that would be a big help.

new findings... i kept smelling gas everytime i made a run. when i cranked up the AFPR at idle, i guess i didn't wait long enough. this time i cranked it up to 70 psi and went around the car to see if i could smell gas. sure enough, the feed line under the fuel filter was leaking. i'm assuming that has to be what my high RPM hesitation was from.

i'm going to fix that possibly today and i'll get back on here with the results.

Maybe I can do a little write up on the knock buzzer but probably not today.
If your car is knocking as much as yours it will be something annoying to hear constantly because i made sure mines was loud enough that i could hear it over high rpm, or music.

A fuel delivery problem would make sense. Im assuming you dont have a wide band?
If you did you might be able to see for yourself if its leaning out way to much cruising, or if its going excessively rich ( rich knock.)

Yes you have high timing but not nothing insane, actually pretty average "high" timing for the dozens of dsmers running the same type of tuning tools as you do. I just think the timing is making it even worse.
Please turn the boost down to no more than 15 psi until you fix your problem... Save yourself an engine.

The 1g timing map already isnt ideal. Reason being is that it ramps up a little too quickly especially right around 6k theres a nasty little spike. The 2g timing maps are much smoother and there is a lot less overall timing. A slightly tweaked 2g map would do you wonders, and youd be surprised how much leaner you could run with a bit more boost without knocking. With my modifyed 2g timing maps, i am able to see 24psi daily on my 1g on 11.1-11.2 afr w/ no knock.

Plus pulling timing in a middle of a run makes the car sluggish like how you mentioned yours feels because your suddenly raping it on ign adv and is bad for the combustion. Id say, you'd probably be faster with just lower overall timing adv on that psi you run w/ no knock.

Do you have eprom ecu? If so i suggest your next goal w/ the car would be to get it socketed and chipped with a similar map that im talking about ( + you get all the other valuable bonuses of the chip ) OR just get dsmlink which is even better.

 

[wannarace]

yeah, i heard that... i've only got plans to go bigger as to why such a fairly big turbo. i've actually been planning on going with a full engine management system, such as the AEM EMS for example. not that i know for a fact that i am going to use that specificly, haven't done the homework yet. first thing is a TRE tranny.

I do keep it set at 15psi regularly... just crank it up for testing.

i've looked into wideband but haven't got to it yet. been more focused on finding the gremlins from the having sat for so long. some of the upgrades done were from having to replace bad parts. i'm almost at the point where i can just upgrade cause i have to and not cause i need to.

i already patched up the fuel line but have to wait for the JB weld to set. i'll post it as a how to or something. i don't have access to a lift so this was the easy way without doing the entire feed line.

thanks again for the help. it's one thing to know a problem and work towards fixing it, rather than chacing problems in the wrong direction.

 

[Black_Bullet]

yeah, i heard that... i've only got plans to go bigger as to why such a fairly big turbo. i've actually been planning on going with a full engine management system, such as the AEM EMS for example. not that i know for a fact that i am going to use that specificly, haven't done the homework yet. first thing is a TRE tranny.

I do keep it set at 15psi regularly... just crank it up for testing.

i've looked into wideband but haven't got to it yet. been more focused on finding the gremlins from the having sat for so long. some of the upgrades done were from having to replace bad parts. i'm almost at the point where i can just upgrade cause i have to and not cause i need to.

i already patched up the fuel line but have to wait for the JB weld to set. i'll post it as a how to or something. i don't have access to a lift so this was the easy way without doing the entire feed line.

thanks again for the help. it's one thing to know a problem and work towards fixing it, rather than chacing problems in the wrong direction.

Its just knowing were to look...

One day in the near future id think about just upgrading that entire fuel system of yours.
Supposing you had the money to do this, what i suggest is dsmlink, wideband, and more mods to push your current turbo further than you thought youd be able to. Looking into upgrading tranny would be a smart move.
Fortify your set up first and dont just go slap some bigger turbo on there expecting it to solve anything.
( Not that im saying you are.)

My philosphy, max out your current set up... Send your current Holset HX towards its peak efficiency range.
Rip some weight out of that thing. Get it fully reliable and with an awsome tune.
Consistently run mid- low 11s on that setup or a lil better.. Then at that point, if your still craving for more, with money to blow on blown drivetrain parts ( sorry had to add that in) then move up to a bigger snail...

Moral is, most ppl upgrade their turbos too soon when they havent even truely "used" their old ones yet. Id say 60 % of us dsmers dont need anything bigger than a evo3 16g on our "street" cars supposing there is good fuel involved like E85, or some meth injection, and also supposing it has full supporting mods w/ excellent tuning.
On a good set up you can do mid 11s with the 16g no prob...
Now a mid 11 sec street car is more than enough... Therefore who really needs more than a cool 16g setup anyways on their dailys....

 

[Black_Bullet]

I do keep it set at 15psi regularly... just crank it up for testing.

Are you knocking on 15 or was that on 20psi? I also didnt notice a fmic in your mods list...

 

[wannarace]

but it did solve something. ha ha i bought the holset cause i blew out my big 16G. figured if i had to buy i was only gonna buy once. i kept testing for boost leaks but never thought to be the turbo, then... poof. but yeah i know what you're saying, or even with the 20G to be able to run the higher boost with a little bit more efficiency than the 16G. not why i went with the Holset but i also like the face people make when you tell them it came off of a Cummins.

i thought i had the FMIC on there, but anyways, i do have one from DSMotorsprots.

before the gasket changes... yes i was knocking at 15 and 20 psi. after that, i am really only knocking in WOT at 20 psi.

i say i'm getting a new tranny cause i'm tired of being embarrassed. 2nd is all ate up. ha ha. that was my 4th tranny, in 5 years. , it's actually funnier now that i stopped to think about it. 1 tranny per year damn near. if i don't just carefully caress it into second gear... crrrrrrunch. that and i think it's leaking from the seal on the driver side half shaft. i got that from the collection of tranny fluid (not gear oil) on the bottom of my transfer case. was a little overfull before but i corrected that.

P.S. how is that cyclone intake workin for you. i have one from the engine swap i did. i went with the stock manifold cause they actually flow a hair better than the cyclone. but in knowing the theory and how the cyclone works, i figured a little improvement would make it flow better and still get the torque + top end combo. just curious

 

[Black_Bullet]

i say i'm getting a new tranny cause i'm tired of being embarrassed. 2nd is all ate up. ha ha. that was my 4th tranny, in 5 years. , it's actually funnier now that i stopped to think about it. 1 tranny per year damn near. if i don't just carefully caress it into second gear... crrrrrrunch. that and i think it's leaking from the seal on the driver side half shaft. i got that from the collection of tranny fluid (not gear oil) on the bottom of my transfer case. was a little overfull before but i corrected that.

P.S. how is that cyclone intake workin for you. i have one from the engine swap i did. i went with the stock manifold cause they actually flow a hair better than the cyclone. but in knowing the theory and how the cyclone works, i figured a little improvement would make it flow better and still get the torque + top end combo. just curious

Yea just get a good tranny built and be done with it. I have nothing special about mines but it has double 2nd gear syncros from its rebuild... As long as the clutch is adjusted good it will shift fast with no grind into 2nd no matter what rpm im at... My 3rd gear syncro is damaged though ( user fault.) So that gear will grind at anything above 6500rpm if i shift too fast...

Also, i dont have the cyclone installed right now, itll be on in a month. Im getting it fully ported out. Reason being is that if you port it properly you can make it flow better than the stock 1g and pick up a average of 5 ish whp up top while still reaping the benefits down low... Some people have tested about a 30 lbs ft torque gain all the way up to 4800 rpms... Some more some less on their gains but should still be significant. Ive even heard the turbo spools almost 1000 rpms quicker in some cases. This local tuner Jerry runs one on his 4g63 mirage and he took off the magnus intake manifold for a cyclone and gained nearly 100 ft of torque with almost no power loss under 7k. I dont know if that was proven dyno tested results or just crazy speculation but still must've been pretty impressive to the booty dyno id say . He hooks it up using the T25 waste gate actuator which is how ill be doing mines.
My e316g is going to spool insane after that goes on, especially in conjunction with this Fp race manifold....

 

[wannarace]

I fixed that fuel leak. posted in how to. "another fuel line fix". Good news is i think i have it figured down to "rich knock"

I went for a drive (15psi) not really getting on it either. cruising around the knock started up again. i leaned it out a little but only helped a little. still knocked. took out some of the timing ,about 2-3 degrees, and that only made it worse.

i haven't done anything else yet but tonight i will set the timing back to 5 degrees and set my MAF-T to 450cc injectors verses the 550 setting. The only think i can think of is that my base fuel trim is too rich. The FT02 stays around 60 when cruising which is way rich. although, at idle it jumps up to 130 giving me an overall low fuel trim average of 117.

Also picked up a set of the BR7ES plugs this morning and will be swapping those out.

 

[Black_Bullet]

I fixed that fuel leak. posted in how to. "another fuel line fix". Good news is i think i have it figured down to "rich knock"

I went for a drive (15psi) not really getting on it either. cruising around the knock started up again. i leaned it out a little but only helped a little. still knocked. took out some of the timing ,about 2-3 degrees, and that only made it worse.

i haven't done anything else yet but tonight i will set the timing back to 5 degrees and set my MAF-T to 450cc injectors verses the 550 setting. The only think i can think of is that my base fuel trim is too rich. The FT02 stays around 60 when cruising which is way rich. although, at idle it jumps up to 130 giving me an overall low fuel trim average of 117.

Also picked up a set of the BR7ES plugs this morning and will be swapping those out.

Have you done a spark plug check on your old plugs to verify that its a overly rich condition. You may very well be right about the rich knock, and if you are putting in those colder range spark plugs that i recommended they wont help you at the momment...

The biggest single solution that i can think of is what ive already mentioned about changing your tuning methods to dsmlink, or chipped ecu route.

In the meantime, why dont you drop the boost to 10psi or something lower than you have been posting you've dropped overwise, then do another log of that full 3rd gear 10psi pull and post it back up here... If you still have the same knock then im on your side about the rich knock. But you can smell when your running that rich 8 times out of 10. A wideband should def be on the table for you now.... But its still possible you could be going to lean also under cruise if something isnt compensated for correctly... A lot of variables, but im sure your getting close to figuring it out.

 

[wannarace]

...! my car is killing me... well i know it's not due to fuel mix... yet anyways. I have ghost knock.. or for lack of a better term, "traveling knock". My assumption is that as soon as i diagnose and fix a problem causing said knock... the next item on the list, probably on it's way to going bad, goes bad.

left the parking lot last night and didn't even get on the gas before it started. tried way rich on the maf-t and worked my way lean, never even touching boost, trying to get the idle right at least. when i got home. i detected the faint sound of an exhaust leak. looked around but couldn't really tell.

This morning i started the car and felt around the exhaust manifold but nothing. I moved around to the side of the car and it got louder (timing gear side).

Now the process will include double checking the mechanical timing and replacing the valve cover gasket. don't know for sure but that's what i'm thinking thus far. At first i almost though head gasket, but the car doesn't overheat, smoke. it runs great just with a crap load of knock.

To verify something... setting the base timing to 5 degrees, take off the jumper to ground, the car jumps to 8-12 degrees. is that normal? I inspected my spark plugs and the ground strap shows my timing is way advanced. as much as i tried messing with the ignition timing, that would mean i might have to adjust mechanical timing.(BRP7ES) The tip and middle were light tan... normal. i don't use wot very much so it had some carbon build up. i am wondering if the ### motor had diferent timing specs. i'm gonna have to see if this is posted somewhere. oh yeah, i am using a JDM swap. More trouble than it's worth IMO.

this is where i got my info on reading plugs:

Spark plug reading

Note on the BR7ES... I loved the fact that they came pre-gapped to .28.

 

[wannarace]

Well guys, i'm back to solving the actual problem and what do ya know. Black bullet, sorry i didn't listen to ya sooner. i guess i got a little carried away.

Something i didn't realize with the MAF-T, as a side effect, tricking the computer into seeing more MAF, to comp. for 550's, causes it to adjust timing accordingly. (applys to the SAFC i'm assuming also) so now i'm at the 550cc setting and I also set the base timing back to 2-3*.

I made a run in the car mostly cruising to see if i got rid of the knocking, boosting occasionally. ran at 12psi and no knock, turned it up to 15... again, no knock. turned it up to 20 psi and i managed to pull of a couple of 5-6 count spurts. not bad but i came back home and set base timing to 0*.

Thanks again black bullet for all your input... i had been busy with work the past few days so i'm guessing that's all i needed.. time away to actually think about my problem. ha ha. i think the injectors were the blinding truth behind it all.

 

[Jetrosr]

Someone else can elaborate on this, but maybe if you took out your knock sensor but still leaving it plugged in and wrapped it in a thick towel to shelter it from vibration, then drive around ( no boost, just cruise ) and see if it still logs knock... If so you have another problem, because in that scenario i just discribed there shouldnt be no knock for the sensor to pick up...( Dont unplug it though, that may throw a code and give you default knock maps or something.)

/

Unplug it or take it out it throws a code and goes default 9 counts