Is the HX35 overkill for 400hp? What about street-ability?

[smills1840]

Like the title says, is the HX35 going to be overkill for 400whp on a GSX?

I'm really liking the holset turbos, specifically the hx35 for a little quicker spool (from what I read) compared to the hx40.

My build is planned out like this:

This build list is in no way set in stone, so PLEASE feel free to replace any parts listed below with other parts!

HX35
BEP .55 housing
PR ex mani
Recirc O2 housing with Tial WG
3" turbo back
FMIC
Walbro 255 rewire
1000cc + injectors (still reading up on which ones to go with)
DSMlink V3

My main engine question is: Will I need cams? I am not completely opposed, but unlike many others, I don't like a lopey idle. But I'll probably sacrifice the sound if it means big gains.

And of course all other supporting mods:
Bolts/hardware
gaskets
head studs
etc.

Suspension:
Koni Yellows
Ground Control Coilover kit
Prothane Total Kit bushings
Sway/strut bars

Timing belt and full engine gasket rebuild was done ~2,000 miles ago

No balance shaft delete, haven't decided if I'm doing that yet.

So my questions are:

Will this setup be overkill for 400whp? If this will do more, that's awesome! But my goal right now is 400whp.

This setup will maybe be tracked once a month, if that. It will be purely a street car. It's also my DD. Will this setup be streetable? I know there are a lot of factors that play into this, but is this a pretty reliable looking setup if done right?

Thanks guys, and I am 110% open to criticism!

 

[Tyeler18]

That FP mani won't work with the BEP housing, it'll hit the block. You're going to need something to space if farther out from the block. If you plan on hitting 400, you're going to need cams too, a good set without too severe of a lope would be the kelford 264's. They'll be good for street driving, keeping your powerband lower.

 

[Seamus]

I just switched from a 20g on a 2g manifold to an Hx35 in a BEP housing with a DN power manifold this past week. I am really mad I changed. I ran the 20g at 28psi and for the time being i am running the hx35 there. The 20g spools WAAAAY faster than the holset. It feels like it is connected to your foot. the holset is very laggy compared to it and I think the 20g is a way better choice for a 400hp street car.

The ceiling the hx35 has over the 20g if you want to go deep into the 400's is nnice, but if you are looking for 380-400whp a well setup 20g car is tough to beat.

car is a 90 gsx with link, fic1150's, BC 272's stock intake

 

[Agent Ezzard]

I just made (93oct) on a mustang dyno at 22psi with my HX35. I have pretty much everything you mentioned. The tune is conservative because I told want to DD the car.

Now it's getting HKS272s, springs, and an Evo3 intake manifold and once it's retuned I'll dyno it again to see what the gain will be.

I'm running speed density.

 

[4g63Powered]

That FP mani won't work with the BEP housing, it'll hit the block. You're going to need something to space if farther out from the block.

FWIW, I have the FP Race manifold with my HX40, which IIRC has a similar sized compressor housing, and I just had to dent the water pipe a bit; no issue with the block itself.

 

[Tyeler18]

FWIW, I have the FP Race manifold with my HX40, which IIRC has a similar sized compressor housing, and I just had to dent the water pipe a bit; no issue with the block itself.

Interesting, Justin posted a picture of it not clearing, maybe that was with an adapter on the manifold....

 

[smills1840]

That FP mani won't work with the BEP housing, it'll hit the block. You're going to need something to space if farther out from the block. If you plan on hitting 400, you're going to need cams too, a good set without too severe of a lope would be the kelford 264's. They'll be good for street driving, keeping your powerband lower.

I think I meant to say PR mani. Not sure what I was thinking. Thanks for correcting me!

I just switched from a 20g on a 2g manifold to an Hx35 in a BEP housing with a DN power manifold this past week. I am really mad I changed. I ran the 20g at 28psi and for the time being i am running the hx35 there. The 20g spools WAAAAY faster than the holset. It feels like it is connected to your foot. the holset is very laggy compared to it and I think the 20g is a way better choice for a 400hp street car.

The ceiling the hx35 has over the 20g if you want to go deep into the 400's is nnice, but if you are looking for 380-400whp a well setup 20g car is tough to beat.

car is a 90 gsx with link, fic1150's, BC 272's stock intake

Hmmmm, that's interesting. That's really one of the first negative comments about the HX35 that I've heard.

I just made (93oct) on a mustang dyno at 22psi with my HX35. I have pretty much everything you mentioned. The tune is conservative because I told want to DD the car.

Now it's getting HKS272s, springs, and an Evo3 intake manifold and once it's retuned I'll dyno it again to see what the gain will be.

I'm running speed density.

Did you forget to type your HP number before the "(93 oct)" or am I missing something?

FWIW, I have the FP Race manifold with my HX40, which IIRC has a similar sized compressor housing, and I just had to dent the water pipe a bit; no issue with the block itself.

Interesting, Justin posted a picture of it not clearing, maybe that was with an adapter on the manifold....

I think I've seen that picture, and I think it IS with the adapter if I'm not mistaken.

 

[Seamus]

I think I meant to say PR mani. Not sure what I was thinking. Thanks for correcting me!



Hmmmm, that's interesting. That's really one of the first negative comments about the HX35 that I've heard.

Its not a negative comment really, its just that a 20g is a great turbo for 400hp. I've had 20g with td05 and td06 wheels and anyone who says an hx35 outspools a 20g has never tried both turbos. My avatar is my old 20g setup. Like i said, i upgraded the manifold and switched forma tial 38 on the mani to a o2 housing tial 44 with the BEP hx35

I am definatly considering changing my 20g to 02 mounted wastegate and selling the hx35.

 

[smills1840]

^Point taken. Thanks for the input!

I'm also looking at the FP green.

The reason I like the holset turbos are the same as everyone else..cheap and reliable. I am definitely open to suggestions on other turbos though!

 

[Seamus]

^Point taken. Thanks for the input!

I'm also looking at the FP green.

The reason I like the holset turbos are the same as everyone else..cheap and reliable. I am definitely open to suggestions on other turbos though!

it doesn't get much cheaper than turning a 14b or 16g into a 20g.

new MHI 20g wheel is about 60
use a FP 8cm or ebay 7cm exhaust housing
20g compressor cover 25-125 depending on where you get it.
If using a 14b you will spend about $50 getting the CHRA cut to fit the 20g wheel.
Rebuld kit 50-60

So you spend about $400 MAX for a 20g and realistically you can do it for a lot less.

 

[bradikus7]

That FP mani won't work with the BEP housing, it'll hit the block. You're going to need something to space if farther out from the block. If you plan on hitting 400, you're going to need cams too, a good set without too severe of a lope would be the kelford 264's. They'll be good for street driving, keeping your powerband lower.

This is definitely incorrect. I run this exact setup, only had to dent the water pipe.

I think I meant to say PR mani. Not sure what I was thinking. Thanks for correcting me!

I don't think that PR even makes a manifold that is mitsu flanged. I believe you were correct in the first place meaning FP.

 

[Agent Ezzard]

No I didn't forget. My iPhone probably copied over the HP number. Anyway it was 305awhp.

 

[smills1840]

This is definitely incorrect. I run this exact setup, only had to dent the water pipe.



I don't think that PR even makes a manifold that is mitsu flanged. I believe you were correct in the first place meaning FP.

Maybe that's the picture I'm thinking of. A PR mani with an adapter, and the turbo is hitting the block.

Either way, I'm going with the FP if I go holset.

 

[TSIshwdwn]

here you go http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/turbo-system-tech/341834-manifolds-work-holset-hx35-hx40.html

Just depends if you go with a Holset turbo in a BEP .55 turbine housing you can fit a stock manifold by only denting the water pipe. go with the Fp manifold it flows better than stock. For T3 setup, the PR manifold is good to use if you get the BEP .70 a/r housing.

 

[jrohner]

If you're getting a different manifold anyways, why not forget the BEP housing and keep the Holset housing? For just a bit slower spool than the BEP housing, you can use an open T3 manifold; for faster spool than the BEP you can spend more for a far superior setup and use a divided T3 manifold. I think the BEP housing is a waste of money unless you need to use the stock manifold.

 

[TSIshwdwn]

Interesting, Justin posted a picture of it not clearing, maybe that was with an adapter on the manifold....

Is this the picture?

You must be logged in to view this image or video.

I think that's a stock hx35 housing on PR manifold. There's no way it's gonna fit.

 

[crash89]

This really all comes down to where you want your powerband. Like SEAMUS said, the 20g is an awesome turbo for a 300-400hp street car. So is the Hx35 however they are totally different monsters. I made my 297 whp on at 20g 14psi, stock injectors and no tune.. Spool is quick and very responsive and pulls awesome! However, if you're wanting to rev past 7k this may not be for you. I felt as if mine was falling off a bit up top.

Now, my holset pulls like a monster but does spool a bit slower. I dont know how my set up would differ from the BEP housing and Punishment manifold but I see full spool (26psi on 93 pump and low timing) by 4200rpm. The hx35 is definitely good for 500 whp+ Now, what sucks is unless you can find a 20g for cheap that wouldnt be a good option for you. You could piece one together as stated above.

So if you're looking for fast spool and quick responsiveness the 20g would be the way to go, not to mention its strictly bolt on!!! But to answer your question, no the hx35 is not overkill!

 

[jrohner]

Now, my holset pulls like a monster but does spool a bit slower. I dont know how my set up would differ from the BEP housing and Punishment manifold but I see full spool (26psi on 93 pump and low timing) by 4200rpm.

It says in your profile you're running a twin scroll setup, but that spool seems really late for twin scroll unless you're talking about first gear. Mine in an open manifold spooled like that. My cousin is running a divided manifold that I made, and it spools about like a 16G.

 

[crash89]

Yes, I have a Redjack twin scroll manifold mated to the stock 12cm housing. My slow spool could a couple different things. My BC272s need to be degreed or the very low timing I have to run for 93oct or both could be a huge contributing factor. Maybe even the large runner size of the manifold itself could also contribute. That spool is based on my 3rd gear pulls.

 

[TSIshwdwn]

So the redjack bolts in the hx35 t3 divided turbine housing with problems? What do you do if you have a internal wastegate housing?

 

[bradikus7]

So the redjack bolts in the hx35 t3 divided turbine housing with problems? What do you do if you have a internal wastegate housing?

You weld the wastegate flapper shut or buy a NON wg turbine housing.

 

[TSIshwdwn]

I found a hx35 8 blade with bep housing for 500. I didn't buy it because the T3 setup is growing on me. personally I should had bought it, for that price he basically threw it in as a deal and they're hard to come by as a package.

 

[My1GLaser]

I had an FP mani & HX35 in a BEP .55 A/R housing. I barely had to dent the water pipe. It nearly outspooled my 18g I had on before it. 33 psi by 3800. That was on 50% E-85 which spools a little quicker than pump gas alone.

It is a better street turbo than the 14b, Evo 16g & FP 18g6sl2 I ran before it IMO. It hits hard and fast. I spin all 4 in 2nd every time I hit full boost if I punch it. I've had this HX35 in 3 different turbine housings in the last 2 years. The T3 .70 A/R hits 33 psi by 4400 rpms, which is plenty streetable! One of these days I might even get a better time at the track

 

[untouchablecc]

I just switched from a 20g on a 2g manifold to an Hx35 in a BEP housing with a DN power manifold this past week. I am really mad I changed. I ran the 20g at 28psi and for the time being i am running the hx35 there. The 20g spools WAAAAY faster than the holset. It feels like it is connected to your foot. the holset is very laggy compared to it and I think the 20g is a way better choice for a 400hp street car.

The ceiling the hx35 has over the 20g if you want to go deep into the 400's is nnice, but if you are looking for 380-400whp a well setup 20g car is tough to beat.

car is a 90 gsx with link, fic1150's, BC 272's stock intake

I have run both set ups you are refering too. I agree with the lag. I was running a stock 7:8.1 bottom end which im assuming thats what your running. It didnt really feel like the hx35 in a bep housing hit good boost till around 4200-4500. It had a very on off feel too it. Plenty of power up top for sure. I switch to a 20g in a 2g manifold external gate and it was a very linear power band very nice on the street but I could tell my peak hp was not what it was with the holset.

Long story short, when I did my rebuild I went with wiseco 9:1 comp and back to a hx35/h1c with a 12cm garret housing. Let me say its a totally different ball game with the 9:1. I would never turn back to a 20g at his point. I get the best of both worlds. Spools like a 16g and makes power to 8.5k .

If the origonal op has no future plans of upgrading past the 8:5.1 compression and a 400whp number he should stick with the 20g imo. If you want room to grow and will crave more like the rest of us you might be in the market for a holset or other garret based turbo,fp series ect.

 

[My1GLaser]

You can advance ignition timing or retard your exhaust cam to increase spool up also. It makes a world of difference to add 5* from 2k-4k if you can do so without inducing preignition. V3 should give him the ability to tune in some streetablility. However, I have 9:1 CR and I'm running 60% E-85, so it might make more difference than I realize...