Help! Car dont wanna make Power...

[Evo-Jr]

Hey guys. After going crazy and spending so much money trying to built this new set up, now the car is not doing what it suppose to do. I dont wanna lip up the car on fire

This is what i have:
2.3 Stroker, Wiseco 9:1 piston,0.20 Manley I beam,Eagle 100mm crankshaft,Kiggle main girdle,ACL bearings, Fluidampr Damper, Bshaft remove,ARP head studs,3 angle valve job,Custom sheet metal intake manifold,SI dual springs and retainers,SI nitride valves,272/264 HKS,T4 tubular manifold, Precision turbo billet wheel 6268,ACT 6 puck,ACT 2900 pressure plate,Fidanza flywheel,AEM wideband,3" downpipe,FIC bluemax 1450,Walbro pump in tank and bosh 044 inline,MAF, DSM link v3 full..

Took the car to get tuned at a shop in PA, the guys at the shop work all day trying to figured out the problem.. The car only made 433 and 343 torque.. For some reason the car wasnt making boost, only about 23psi on C16.. They though it was the wastegate or the boost controller, they swap both with parts from the shop and nothing. After swapping the parts they gaved it another try and then they said the clutch was slipping which it cant be possible because is brand new, then they said it might be the cams or that my turbo is holding back! 6262sp journal bearing T4 .68 v-band...

Really dont know what to do at this point I dont wanna go and spend money that i dont really have on parts that i might not need.. Can someone please help out on this one, im clueless

Please guys, very confused....

 

[gofer]

3" GM MAF. You can't leak boost around a 1g MAS because its pre-turbo and only see's vacuum.

Here's a photo of his engine bay, its small but you can see the GM MAF.

You must be logged in to view this image or video.

 

[Evo-Jr]

I've never heard good things about the Delta gates, is that an OBX Racing brand?

It sounds like the wastegate is blowing open, not allowing you to build boost. The next thing on your list of parts, after you fix this boost control issue, is definitely a different set of cams. Not yet though, you need to fix this first.

Im defently gonna change the cams, but ike u said i wanna fix the boost issue first... so hopefully the wastegate fixes my problem

 

[doayamaha]

1. are you seeing any knock
2. what cams are you running
3. since you said that your delta gate has a adjustable screw for spring rate have you tried adjusting it.
4. speed density= good aka throw that maf in the trash.

 

[hypergenesis]

I know what u saying, but I have a delta gate wastegate and I can't find springs for it.. So I guess I rather buy a tial wastegate for now instead of cams n springs! So which spring should I order when I perchase the wastegate?

Ohhhh sorry from your response I got another message my mistake.

Im not to waste gate knowledgeable but im sure a lot of others are to help pitch in towards what spring or what not.

 

[sciondan]

Can't you try shimming your waste gate with some washers? That would act like a tighter spring.

 

[Evo-Jr]

1. are you seeing any knock
2. what cams are you running
3. since you said that your delta gate has a adjustable screw for spring rate have you tried adjusting it.
4. speed density= good aka throw that maf in the trash.

Last time I went to the dyno we were seeing a lot of knocks. Even the tuner said that it was crazy cus he was doing whatever possible to get rid of them he was still seeing them.. Running hks 264/272, I didn't touch the screw because I don't know how to mess with that.. But it looks like is going to the garbage cus I keep hearing bad things about it, and defenetly getting the sd combo from ecmlink...

 

[gofer]

Would you mind attaching a log to a post? I'd like to see it.

 

[Evo-Jr]

Would you mind attaching a log to a post? I'd like to see it.

I don't have it, I was so upset that I didn't even wanna take it

 

[ShizzySupra]

Definitely would advise against this. Among other things it is a giant band-aid on an amputee and unreliable.

Can't you try shimming your waste gate with some washers? That would act like a tighter spring.

 

[DSMTyson]

Just so everyone is clear on this. The Turbonetics Deltagate is an adjustable wastegate, you don't change out the springs. You adjust the spring pressure like you would a BOV, with a screw at the top.

Can't you try shimming your waste gate with some washers? That would act like a tighter spring.

This is not in internal wastegate..

 

[doayamaha]

i would think that the cams would be choking that turbo out a little bit up top, but you are saying it is only hitting 23 all the way through the rev. i would turn the screw in on the waste gate a little bit at a time just to see if it gives you a little more.

 

[ShizzySupra]

Geezuz it's an external wastegate man...there is nothing to turn or tighten.

i would think that the cams would be choking that turbo out a little bit up top, but you are saying it is only hitting 23 all the way through the rev. i would turn the screw in on the waste gate a little bit at a time just to see if it gives you a little more.

 

[PieEyedPiper]

Just so everyone is clear on this. The Turbonetics Deltagate is an adjustable wastegate, you don't change out the springs. You adjust the spring pressure like you would a BOV, with a screw at the top.

Geezuz it's an external wastegate man...there is nothing to turn or tighten.

Did I miss something?

 

[zcoh2gdsm]

Did I miss something?

no. you read it properly. the other bull missed something .

 

[Evo-Jr]

Just to refresh you guys a lil bit.. when i was dynoing the car i had the delta gate, but i didnt wanna go over 23psi.. Then the shop install a 44mm tial wastegate and the same thing accure, but who knows what spring the wastegate had inside.. I check the flex pipe to make sure it wasnt closed shut or any problem with exhaust! So thats when they told me that i needed to get bigger cams because the car is making power but around 7-7500 rpm the graph drop... Too bad i dont have the graph to post, i was so upset that i didnt take one.. I was even told to adjust my tial blow off valve because it could be staying open or closed! I have no idea on how to adjusted

 

[Talon tsi PR]

Geezuz it's an external wastegate man...there is nothing to turn or tighten.

Turbonetics deltagates have an adjusting bolt on top, so for your knowledge it is something to turn and tighten

 

[ShizzySupra]

Turbonetics deltagates have an adjusting bolt on top, so for your knowledge it is something to turn and tighten

By a very small amount. The internal springs still need to be changed to increase boost by a significant amount.

 

[-Boosty-]

This is a very informative thread, read every post, please keep us informed at everything u do to tackle the problem.

 

[doayamaha]

By a very small amount. The internal springs still need to be changed to increase boost by a significant amount.

i am wanting him to turn it in a little bit just to see if that gives it a little bit more, if it does then i would advise to get the tial and at the very least get the 1 bar spring. if it doesn't raise it at all then the problem may lie elsewhere, like the cams aren't camming right or something.

And that i know of there isn't any higher psi spring for that wg, the screw is what you have to adjust. If it was me i would disconnect the boost controller and just run a vac line to the wg, so that way it will run wg spring pressure. i am guessing it will be somewhere in the 7 range, then turn the screw in to try to get it to 14 to 15ish, then reinstall the boost controller and see where that gets you, obviously if it doesn't change don't get all crazy and crank it way down or else you may boost creep and end up with big problems.

also you said it was getting knock, this is something you are going to want to figure out as well, when the car knocks it pulls timming to save itself, this will also make it run like ass. im not shure if it was said or not but what fuel are you running.

 

[Evo-Jr]

i am wanting him to turn it in a little bit just to see if that gives it a little bit more, if it does then i would advise to get the tial and at the very least get the 1 bar spring. if it doesn't raise it at all then the problem may lie elsewhere, like the cams aren't camming right or something.

And that i know of there isn't any higher psi spring for that wg, the screw is what you have to adjust. If it was me i would disconnect the boost controller and just run a vac line to the wg, so that way it will run wg spring pressure. i am guessing it will be somewhere in the 7 range, then turn the screw in to try to get it to 14 to 15ish, then reinstall the boost controller and see where that gets you, obviously if it doesn't change don't get all crazy and crank it way down or else you may boost creep and end up with big problems.

also you said it was getting knock, this is something you are going to want to figure out as well, when the car knocks it pulls timming to save itself, this will also make it run like ass. im not shure if it was said or not but what fuel are you running.

I never touch the screw in the middle cus I was just told to change the spring, but I did disconnect the vacuum hose and I was still seeing the same boost level... I'm waiting for a tial gate that comes in Saturday and I have to install the tranny back, Just got it back from sheperd!

I use c16 for tuning and 93 to drive around, but always c16 at the dyno.. The last guy that tune the car for me found it very weird that it was knocking even thou he was doing everything possible to get rid of it.. So he was telling a bunch of things to change.. Including ecmlink and get aem and also get rid of the maf, which is a pain to get it to work!

 

[gofer]

I'm not trying to chop your tuner off at the knees but it sounds like he was trying to tailor your setup so he could tune what he's comfortable with, not because it was a limiting factor to the HP/TQ goals you have. Making a switch to AEM EMS is going to cost you more money, not just purchasing the system but also having it tuned because you've got to start from nothing. Also, switching to SD at your current power levels isn't necessary its just a bit more convenient and, from the sound of things, is what your tuner is comfortable tuning since AEM EMS is a MAF'less setup too. A friend/tuner for RRE told me, when I was debating on switching from a GM MAF to Speed Density, "A MAF and SD do the same thing, in a different way. Lets say the grocery story is two blocks south and 1 block east. You can drive east 1 block and drive down the street. Or you can drive down the street and turn east. You get to the same spot, different route."

It is true though, a MAF does have its limits but you aren't reaching the limits of your GM MAF with those power levels and once again you'd be spending how much MORE money just so your tuner can be comfortable? Find a place that can tune YOUR SETUP, not tell you to go buy a bunch of other crap.

The only thing actually choking your setup, after you fix this boost control issue, are those cams. Even then, that cars going to scare the hell out of you once its tuned on 30+psi...

 

[Evo-Jr]

I'm not trying to chop your tuner off at the knees but it sounds like he was trying to tailor your setup so he could tune what he's comfortable with, not because it was a limiting factor to the HP/TQ goals you have. Making a switch to AEM EMS is going to cost you more money, not just purchasing the system but also having it tuned because you've got to start from nothing. Also, switching to SD at your current power levels isn't necessary its just a bit more convenient and, from the sound of things, is what your tuner is comfortable tuning since AEM EMS is a MAF'less setup too. A friend/tuner for RRE told me, when I was debating on switching from a GM MAF to Speed Density, "A MAF and SD do the same thing, in a different way. Lets say the grocery story is two blocks south and 1 block east. You can drive east 1 block and drive down the street. Or you can drive down the street and turn east. You get to the same spot, different route."

It is true though, a MAF does have its limits but you aren't reaching the limits of your GM MAF with those power levels and once again you'd be spending how much MORE money just so your tuner can be comfortable? Find a place that can tune YOUR SETUP, not tell you to go buy a bunch of other crap.

The only thing actually choking your setup, after you fix this boost control issue, are those cams. Even then, that cars going to scare the hell out of you once its tuned on 30+psi...

I agreed with u 100%.. I seeing people here making really good power with ecmlink, but I want whatever is gonna make this car make good power. Tired of seeing 400hp knowing that I have a set up capable of making well over 600! It so hard to find a tuner out here to mess with ecmlink... I took a 3 hour ride and spend over 9 hours on the dyno to only make 433hp ;-( no good

 

[gofer]

Its too bad that STM isn't closer to you, though you might call them and ask if they trust anyone up your way with an AWD dyno that can tune your car with Link. Worst case scenario they say no and recommend you take the car to them...

 

[Evo-Jr]

Its too bad that STM isn't closer to you, though you might call them and ask if they trust anyone up your way with an AWD dyno that can tune your car with Link. Worst case scenario they say no and recommend you take the car to them...

Lol I spoke to them and that's exactly what they told me

 

[doayamaha]

im not to firmiliar with link but, arent you able to raise the flow limit for the maf through it. i know the 3in gm has much more flow than a 1g and im not really shure what its as is limit is but shouldn't that turbo be close to it. I know this isn't the main issue but i was just running through some possibilities.

Is your knock sensor new or atleast in very good condition. and are you ignoring fantom knock.

Once you get the new waste gate with higher sping pressure we will see were you are at.