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Fender braces fixed the floppy front end!!

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H@xtGSX

10+ Year Contributor
1,093
9
Aug 9, 2011
Carlsbad, New_Mexico
This weekend I decided to make a set of front fender braces because of all the positive reviews they have received from other people. I used a gas shielded MIG welder, a 12" miter chop saw, a drill with a 3/8" carbide bit, and ~$25 worth of steel tubing from Lowes, plus a bit of 3/16" plate I already had in the garage to make it. They took about 2 hours to measure, cut everything up, drill the bolt holes in the door hinge tabs, and weld. More time was spent getting the fenders off and back on again than fabricating. I made them so that the knee brace was at a 45 degree angle, as close as possible to the inside lip of the wheel well. This made it so the horizontal arm could extend halfway down the fender. The front most section of each brace is welded to a piece of 3/16" x 2" flat bar stock 6" long. The 6" plate was then welded to the sheet metal of the chassis, futher extending the brace past the center of the front tire. The rear tabs are attached with the door hinge bolts, on top of the hinges, so the door can still be removed if needed.

I have been driving with these braces in place for a couple of days now, and it is true... these make more difference than any other suspension modification I have done. They stiffen up the front end so much that the slop you feel when driving through a corner, even slowly, is gone. The whole car no longer shakes when it hits a rough spot in the road. It's actually quieter when it does hit those rough spots, and the struts also recover faster. There's no bounce like before. It makes the steering feel very solid and responsive... really connected to the road, not mushy like it is normally. Coupled with a front strut bar, the combination make the car drive like you would expect a sports car to drive. Now that I've felt the difference, I would highly recommend fender braces as one of the first suspension modifications that should be done to a 2g car. It is by far the most bang for the buck.

I shot a picture with my phone... sorry for the crappy quality. I didn't take any other pictures before getting the fenders back on because I was tired and just wanted to get things put back together as fast as I could. This was taken right after I sprayed the steel with black engine paint to seal it up from rusting. It was painted in place, so the welds were covered too... that's why it's kinda tough to see everything, but I hope it helps encourage any of you thinking you might want to try them to do so. They were not hard to make. :thumb:

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I'm amazed at the difference. It was actually your pictures that made me want to try this. I was checking out the roll bar stuff you did and saw these too. I fit it by tack welding everything in place with it mounted as it would be when completed, then removed it and welded it out. They are a huge improvement, worth every minute of the work. If I didn't have a welder and the time to build these, I would definently buy a set. I am very pleased with them, though I may add one or 2 more supports in the knee brace to make sure it is rigid. :D
 
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Spyders would benefit from this the most as just a upper strut bar on mine fixed my windshield shake when going over rough spots in the road.

I may try this when i get my talon going. :hellyeah:
 
I would think the convertibles would get a very large gain in handling. I still have the roof, even though it has a hole with some annoying rattle trap glass in it, to reinforce the front from torsion. It definitely eliminated a ton of flex on mine, but I think you would probably want to use heavier tubing than what I used for your Spyder. They'd be taking a higher load than mine will likely see. I used mild steel 3/4" square tubing with 1/8" wall thickness, and it is pretty stiff, but for yours I'd say use 3/4" to 1" Schedule 10 pipe or something similar. Round supports would be significantly stronger.
 
Yup. Those are definitely stronger than mine. I was lazy though and didn't want to fish mouth the pipe, so I went with square tubing. Those undoubtedly will take a heavier shock load and remain stiffer than any square stock will. I am going to compensate with 2 additional triangulated legs off of the knee brace.

....they look better too. :thumb: ....if someone is strange enough to be looking inside your fenders. LOL
 
I wonder how much of your "improvement" is based on you're still on stock front suspension. I'd be interested to ride in a car with and without fender braces on stock and aftermarket (Koni shocks with either GC coilover setup or Hypercoil/Koni coilover setup) suspension setups to see the results.

I can't wait to get my set installed though!
 
I wonder how much of your "improvement" is based on you're still on stock front suspension. I'd be interested to ride in a car with and without fender braces on stock and aftermarket (Koni shocks with either GC coilover setup or Hypercoil/Koni coilover setup) suspension setups to see the results.

I can't wait to get my set installed though!

It's sort of stockish... I did replace my bushings with ones I cast into the sleeves with PMC-790 urethane rubber from Smooth-on though. They are a lot tighter and harder than most aftermarket ones I have looked at. That may change the perceived gains vs the stock bushings also. Regardless, the fender braces make a very big difference all on their own. It is immediately noticeable.

If you're interested in making tougher bushings:
http://www.smooth-on.com/Urethane-Rubber-an/c6_1117_1150/index.html
I will warn you though... it's a messy project. I like the PMC-790 material more than Energy Suspension or Prothane bushings though, and it conforms exactly to the sleeves. Be ready to do some MacGuyvering to seal the sleeves up for casting... it can be tricky.
 
With your sqaure stock I'm sure it would help with how long the span is on the shock tower point.

Kevin

That's my concern. If I had used round stock, I would leave it as it is. I am planning on running a support from the center of the knee brace to 3/4 of the way to the end of the top tube, and another from the center of the knee brace (on the opposite side) horizontally to the vertical tube. I am not sure if extending the brace makes any difference, but my thought was that the more of the sheet metal that was unloaded to the brace, the better. With square stock though, adding to it is as easy as setting the miter saw to the right angle, cutting it up, and welding it on. I also stitch welded the fender arms and a bit of the strut tower sheet, hoping that helps keep the sheet from flexing.

One of the things that kind of surprised me about doing this was how little there is actually holding the fender arms on. It's 3 little 1 inch welds and some spot welds. That's it. The other support for them comes from the spot welded strut tower sheet metal, and glue. It is no wonder they flex so much.

Now I see how you got the front bolts in. I was wondering about that... I thought you'd drilled through the arm and bolted it on with a long bolt or something. I couldn't see anywhere where that would've been easily done. If you hole saw out a spot to slide in a stud plate though..... that's MUCH easier and less permanent. I don't think many DSM people have welders anyhow, so that's a great solution for simple hand tool installation.
 
these are great, yet another fabbing mod to do to the car while its apart. Im sure its a world of difference, great pics too
 
The ends dont look tick enough are they? Seem like it would flex a little on hard turns so just asking.

They might flex a tiny bit as they are now. That is square 3/4 tubing with 1/8 walls though, so a 1/4" thick in each plane. It isn't very flexible. Round tubing would be stronger. The tabs are 3/16" thick plate steel and the front is actually welded to the car sheet metal itself. It isn't going to move any at all. I am going to add a little reinforcement to make them absolutely rigid, but they are stiff enough now. They make an enormous difference. I just did 23 miles on the highway at 80 mph, and even then the difference is noticeable. The car just responds so much better, it is hard to describe compared to the stock ride. There are a ton of differences, both big and small, for such a simple modification.
 
The weakest point that I can see isn't the mounting tabs; I'd say it is the 4" or so from the triangle to the front tab. The point of these is to keep the tower from moving up and down, yes?
 
Here is a set of Kevin's braces mounted on my car.

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Best suspension mod for the money. And oddly enough, they make the ride smoother. I have solid aluminum motor mounts front and back and after install, the vibrations smoothed out.

I won't say the car rides like its on rails because I hate that saying but I will say that the car is extremely predictable and as long as I'm on the throttle, it'll go where I want it. It actually scared me first time I really pushed it.

Sorry for the thread jack but after buying strut tower bars and other miscellaneous suspension products, I just wish these were available sooner.
 
Best suspension mod for the money. And oddly enough, they make the ride smoother. I have solid aluminum motor mounts front and back and after install, the vibrations smoothed out.

I have solid mounts also, and yes, they smooth the ride out tremendously. Even the tire vibration stopped and started being absorbed by the suspension as it should be... There was virtually no vibration in my car at 80 to 85 mph, and before these the front tires ALWAYS vibrated some at that speed. Not anymore.

The weakest point that I can see isn't the mounting tabs; I'd say it is the 4" or so from the triangle to the front tab. The point of these is to keep the tower from moving up and down, yes?

You are correct, from my knowledge. I used 1 bolt per tab, but I switched them to grade 10.9 bolts to compensate for the shear forces. Ideally, you would use all 3 bolts on top and both below, but as Kevin will tell you, that adds some complexity to both fabrication and installation... Though not a tremendous amount. I just used high grade bolts and 1 bolt per hinge, BUT because I welded the front to the chassis, my configuration should see a bit less torsional force at the bolts. I will be reinforcing the exact area you are talking about though. I am cutting steel right now. We discussed that very point a bit earlier, and I described how I would be reinforcing that point. If I weren't fabricating this crap myself with my own welder and engineering software, I honestly would have bought one of the ones Kevin has shown. They are obviously quality pieces, and having seen the difference, they ARE worth the money.

The amount of floppiness in the front end is horrendous... I just measured the flex, string across the strut method, which I did before doing this. That first measurement was another reason I did this. Now, when I jack one front wheel off the ground, there is a lot less slack in the string. The first time had at LEAST an inch of slack. It now has maybe a 1/4 of an inch slack. That is a major improvement!
 
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Here is a set of Kevin's braces mounted on my car.

You must be logged in to view this image or video.


Best suspension mod for the money. And oddly enough, they make the ride smoother. I have solid aluminum motor mounts front and back and after install, the vibrations smoothed out.

I won't say the car rides like its on rails because I hate that saying but I will say that the car is extremely predictable and as long as I'm on the throttle, it'll go where I want it. It actually scared me first time I really pushed it.

Sorry for the thread jack but after buying strut tower bars and other miscellaneous suspension products, I just wish these were available sooner.

How much would it cost to get myself a set of these? :)
 
I am about to dump honey in the bear trap... I just now got home from running my car through our local hairpin track. I have driven that track after work a couple times a week since I bought the car. It is an informal little bit of pavement, made for guys to talk shit and prove it on, and it is on a friend of mine's private property. I am not sure how big it is exactly, but normally it would take me 1:40ish to complete a lap going as hard as I could without breaking things, if there wasn't a bunch of caliche rock and crap on the pavement. I just finished a lap on the same pavement at 1:31, and I did not feel like I was pushing it that hard. That is more than enough proof for me. These things work. Period. The car simply does not roll as much in a turn.
 
The weakest point that I can see isn't the mounting tabs; I'd say it is the 4" or so from the triangle to the front tab. The point of these is to keep the tower from moving up and down, yes?

Yes they help eliminate vertical movement. The weak point is that stretch to the out mounting point. I limited mine two right around 2 inches to keep that in check. Also if you move the point of the brace out futher than my design toward the strut you run into internal bracing in the fenders. You cannot slide the bolt in sandwich plate into place.
So welding is the only option for attachement.
 
Am I getting a commission for this? :thumb: :D

What Kevin mentioned about the internal braces is right. That is why mine is welded in place. I ran a wire down the fender arm and right about where Kevin's brace ends, there is a piece of sheet blocking off further down the fender. I wanted to take as much load off the sheet metal and into the brace as possible, and I wanted that to occur beyond the pivot point of the strut. This helps deflect the forces from the suspension that would normally make the chassis flex above the wheel and sends them back to the firewall cross member. The flex load is transfered to a 3 dimensionally stable point in the car. From what I have gleaned, the more fender you can span, the better... So long as you use something that can take the same force and it is reinforced and anchored properly, it will help handling. If you don't want to weld stuff to your car's chassis like I did, what Kevin is making is probably one of the best "bolt on" suspension upgrades for the money. No joke. These braces have made my car fun to drive again.
 
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