EGT's above 1600 farenheit -Need feedback on dyno run-300hp!

[98autogstspyder]

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My car is a 1998 automatic gst spyder with 32,000 miles on it

Well i got my car dyno tuned yesterday with Gary Marsh at his shop, Speed Injected (home of the world's fastest fwd dsm, running a 9.5 in the 1/4 mile). I was some what dissapointed with the power numbers. 243 wheel horsepower and 234 ft lb of torque. i was running 93 octane at 19 psi on my evo3 16g. we leaned the injectors out to an air fuel ratio of 11.4

the whole hour we were leaning the injectors out. these are 450's might i add. We did about 18 pulls on the dyno. after every three pulls we let the car rest for a good 10 min. maybe my power was a little lower because the car had done so many runs, and its not moving, etc; I am thinking because the car is automatic , i am pushing roughly 300 crank hp , give or take.

Now to the egt's. On the dyno they were between 800 and 900 celsius (which is about 1480 - 1600 farenheit) Then Gary and I took it out on I-95. Egt's reached to an incredible number of 1150 celsius. Thats somewhere around 1750 farenheit i believe. I feel like im scared to floor it now even though Gary told me it was normal. Keep in mind my air/fuel ratio is at 11.4. What do you guys think? And whats the point of an egt gauge. The air/fuel gauge is going back in ASAP.

S-AFC HIGH FUEL SETTINGS: On stock 450's doesnt seem right to me
that they leaned out my injectors so much .....
1000rpm -- 0
2000rpm -- -1
3500rpm -- -4
5000rpm -- -15
6000rpm -- -13
6500rpm -- -18
7000rpm -- -17
8000rpm -- -16


Tyler



Any input is appreciated. Should i be making more power?

Mods for quick reference
injen intake
3 inch cat back exhaust
2.5 o2 eliminator downpipe
upper and lower intercooler piping
hks bov recirculated
manual boost controller at 19psi
apexi safc
greddy big fmic
egt and boost gauge (air/fuel will be going back in)
190 walbro fuel pump
magnetic drain plug
ported 2g manifold
evo3 16g turbo

 

[nineD5_GS-T]

You should really get some 550 injectors. You car is running pretty lean and a 11.4:1 isnt that bad air/fuel. As long as your timing isnt getting pulled back, you should be fine. Your next mod should be injectors for sure. If you are that scared, try turing the boost down a couple points. The only way you are going to make nice power (over 300). Is on race gas and lots of boost, especially with an auto.

 

[98autogstspyder]

how is my car running lean with an air/fuel ratio of 11.4??

i was thinking of getting 550's, but it seems like there is no point. i have all the fuel i need it seems.

Tyler

 

[nine5raptor]

Get a logger on there and see what your timing is. Egt's are more affected by timing advance than a/f ratio.

How do you know their wideband was correctly calibrated? Also were they using a tailpipe sniffer or do you have a bung welded in the front of your exhuast?


Those settings seem awfully lean for stock injectors.

 

[doug]

Tailpipe sniffer. At least they did on mine when I dynoed there a few months ago. And I'm almost positive Tyler doesn't have this bung thing welded in.

About the calibration thing, that's a good point. My A/F was off-the-chart rich on my dyno run there. My fuel mods are a rewired stock pump and a -6AN fuel line from filter to rail. I was told that my high EGTs were from the excess fuel still burning when exiting into the exhaust manifold. Makes sense to me, actually, since my EGTs are slightly better now that I've got a bigger turbo which would bring more, cooler air in.

 

[Violater101]

Well, if your knocking alot, regardless of A/F, your EGT's are going to significantly go up. Log it and see what the timing curve looks like.

 

[gsxtacy]

Get some 650 Ball Style injectors and kiss your 243 whp good buy...hello 300+.

I am surprised the 450's got you that far.

Good luck tuning.

GSXTACY

 

[98autogstspyder]

gsxtacy i have a safc. if u read my first post, i said everything i have.

where can i get the logging software from? doug is going to let me use is palmpilot.

Tyler

i have not punched it since the other day so i do not know if the high egts were caused by running it so much that day or if there really is a problem.

 

[Zex4g63]

He has a SAFC but he has no logger. I posed that question to him earlier. I'm glad you replied to this Doug. Since your auto too, maybe you can help him out.

Tim

 

[doug]

I'll certainly try, but I know next to nothing about the S-AFC. I just got DSMLink and have been trying to learn that.

 

[gsxtacy]

What I was saying was with some more fuel flow capabilites the more power you can make.

450's are great and all but you reach the end of their abilities pretty quick once you go to a larger Turbo.

A evo III 16g will do it in a hurry.

A/F ratio good or not your ECU is pulling timing based on duty cycle of the injectors. Get some 550's and lean it out with the SAFC and it lies to your ECU about how much air and fuel is flowing. The ECU still would think their were 450's there.

-18 straight across with 550's would be 450cc's to the ECU but since they are bigger they do the job of 450cc's at a lower duty cycle.

SAFC's are the cheapest way to tune your fuel system, and the best for 3/4 of the modded turbo DSM's running around.

I really hope for good things from your car thats why I am here.
I hope for good things from mine too.

I went with 650 Ball style from extremepsi for $315 from my state IT refund.

Hope to go 12's in street tune...daily.

Best of luck with it.

GSXTACY

 

[doug]

Originally posted by gsxtacy
A/F ratio good or not your ECU is pulling timing based on duty cycle of the injectors.

That's the part I didn't understand-- thanks for that. Can a Pocketlogger log injector duty cycle?

 

[nine5raptor]

Not on a 2g.

 

[NewB2dsm]

I kinda have the same issue you are having. I made 290awhp on my small 16g at 11.2:1 afr. My egts are though the roof. My timing gets pulled from4-5grand then it gives it all back. It gets pulled down to around 8degrees at 4300 and then at lke 5600 i have 22degrees. So i know that is probably why my egts are really high. But what i dont understand is why its doing this. Even when i ran 18psi really really rich it still pulled the timing in the exact same spot. I think it might be my fuel pump b/c its not rewired.

And no offence but those numbers are low, get 550's or bigger and you are looking right around 300whp. I know if i took my cat out of my car i think i would be really close to 300awhp on pump.

 

[98autogstspyder]

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ok so this is what i have gathered so far.

450's with 16g equals pulled timing because injector duty cycle is near 100%. pulled timing equals high egts

550's tuned with safc will trick ecu and duty cycle will be lower. this will lower egt's too right

this right?

Tyler

 

[Scrymerr]

Originally posted by nine5raptor
Not on a 2g.

Apparently there is a chart on Vfaq that converts the injector pulse width to duty cycle. Something like that. All i know is that it allows us 2g guys to see what our injectors duty cycle is running at. 60-70% is where you want it. If I knew exactly where this link was, i'd show ya. Anyone know what im talking about??

later

 

[nine5raptor]

Problem is, we can't read either of those.

 

[nine5raptor]

This what you're thinking of?

http://www.taboospeedshop.com/IPW2IDC.htm

 

[doug]

Originally posted by nine5raptor
Problem is, we can't read either of those.

Another advantage of DSMLink.

 

[kpt4321]

You need bigger injectors, that's it and that's all. You only have enough fuel for 250-260 whp on pump with 450's.

Bigger injectors = more power. 550's will take you to 300 whp.

 

[98autogstspyder]

i just called my shop guy and he said that everything is normal. he said to get ngk brp 7's instead of the stock 6's because they handle heat better. i need something else to show him.

Tyler

 

[doug]

I changed to 7s when I was trying to figure out my high EGT problem a while back. It didn't help much, if at all.

 

[kpt4321]

Spark plugs aren't going to change your EGT.

If your mechanic doesn't understand that you need more fuel, take the car elsewhere.

 

[gsxtacy]

I second that.

Take him that video of the Black GS-T on that Team NABR dyno video.

612hp FWD.....that oughta get his attention.

You need more fuel at lower duty cycles, so the ECU doesn't flip.

GSXTACY

 

[doug]

I completely understand what you guys are saying-- it makes perfect sense. I just can't figure out why Garry (the guy that runs the shop Tyler is going to) is saying what he's saying. He's normally super knowledgeable. I mean, he did build a 4G63 engine that's putting out 800+ HP for their FWD race car. Something's amiss...