ECUlink later, what gauges now?

[AskDrStupid]

So I know there are TONS of posts about what gauges to get (there is a 26 page long one for cryin out loud) but I have a few very specific questions.

I plan on getting ECUlink in the future but for now I want to update my gauges. Currently I have a mechanical boost gauge and a narrowband AF gauge. I'm thinking that I need a digital boost gauge and a wideband AF gauge.

Questions
-Is an EGT gauge useless now because of wideband AF gauges?
-Does datalogging through ECUlink eliminate the need for all but boost and AF gauges (and maybe even an AF gauge)?
-Do you need to weld into the lower exhaust for proper installation of a wideband AF gauge on a 1g?
-Does it make sense to save money by buying Glow Shift gauges rather than an AEM gauge?

Whew. Thanks guys!

 

[AskDrStupid]

No worries LandoAWD!

The innovate lc-1 has two outputs, one for the wideband signal, and a 0-1volt narrowband ouput.

You'd just have to wire that into the ecu's front 02 signal, and have the lc1 simulate the narrowband signal.

Ok that makes sense, no problem. The cheaper gauge says:
"• Built-in Direct Digital™ Wideband Controller reduces wiring and simplifies installation (No LC-1 required)"

Does this mean I can still use it to simulate narrowband? It seems like the other option includes extra stuff I don't really need.

Thanks!

Innovate offers more then just those 2 gauges...
You could also use a Lc-1 with a DB gauge...

Here's a few... Extrema Psi ~ Innovate Motorsports

I'm impressed with the serial LED functionaility for quick easy reference and comparison. But if I can't use the cheaper version of that (MTX-L) I might have to seriously consider the DB gauge.

 

[MY1GDSM]

In any event the LC_! an DB gauge work great it is what I use... I would recommended it 100 times over any AEM product(I use to have AEM UGEO among other Aem products)

As far as the boost gauge goes, I recommend the aem truboost. Its a gauge and controller in one, easy to use, and i've had mine for 3 years and I have never had any issues with it.

Honestly I don't see the point in him getting a Truboost... Although he could use the Map sensor output to run Speed density their a far better and Cheaper Map sensors out their...

An As far a boost control as long a he is getting Full Ecmlink he with have built in boost control an can use the stock BCS or the Ecmlink boost solenoid

 

[Doubleot]

Get a Defi Boost/Vaccuum Gauge and a UEGO wideband..Both in a cluster bezel pod.

Defi's are really nice but really, not necessary. Over paying for a product that does the same and has been proven to last and be reliable is just pointless all together.


Autometer or Prosport are the two I would recommend as a great bang for your buck.

Take your pick.

 

[AskDrStupid]

Does anyone know if you can use this product to similuate narrowband for the stock ECU on a 1g dsm?

MTX-L Wideband O2 Digital Air/fuel Ratio Gauge

 

[LiquidX]

You may have to do more searching online or email Innovate. The ECU and vehicle doesn't matter as it's the controller itself that makes the signal. The LC1 with gauge can be found for $180, I use the DB gauge and it's amazing.

 

[92AWDHX40]

Installed mine to i love the color of the lc1.

 

[UofACATS]

So I know there are TONS of posts about what gauges to get (there is a 26 page long one for cryin out loud) but I have a few very specific questions.

I plan on getting ECUlink in the future but for now I want to update my gauges. Currently I have a mechanical boost gauge and a narrowband AF gauge. I'm thinking that I need a digital boost gauge and a wideband AF gauge.

Questions
-Is an EGT gauge useless now because of wideband AF gauges?
-Does datalogging through ECUlink eliminate the need for all but boost and AF gauges (and maybe even an AF gauge)?
-Do you need to weld into the lower exhaust for proper installation of a wideband AF gauge on a 1g?
-Does it make sense to save money by buying Glow Shift gauges rather than an AEM gauge?

Whew. Thanks guys!

As another option, you could get ECMlink now and forgo all those gauges. Personally I run no gauges in my car, I log everything I need to see. Once I set the MBC, it's set. I don't need to see a boost gauge flapping around everytime I touch the pedal. Once its tuned it's tuned. If I have a problem the log shows it, better I might add than a WB gauge in the car as you're WOT through third...

But mainly it keeps the interior looking stock which is less inviting to the unscrupulous, and also keeps my eyes on the road during WOT pulls.

 

[AskDrStupid]

As another option, you could get ECMlink now and forgo all those gauges. Personally I run no gauges in my car, I log everything I need to see. Once I set the MBC, it's set. I don't need to see a boost gauge flapping around everytime I touch the pedal. Once its tuned it's tuned. If I have a problem the log shows it, better I might add than a WB gauge in the car as you're WOT through third...

But mainly it keeps the interior looking stock which is less inviting to the unscrupulous, and also keeps my eyes on the road during WOT pulls.

Isn't it possible to recognize potentially dangerous conditions immediately with a gauge and and start taking it easy rather than waiting until you are done driving and looking at the log?

You may have to do more searching online or email Innovate. The ECU and vehicle doesn't matter as it's the controller itself that makes the signal. The LC1 with gauge can be found for $180, I use the DB gauge and it's amazing.

I found the User's manual online and it says:
"Optionally, the YELLOW (Analog out 1) and/or BROWN (Analog out 2) can be
connected to the analog inputs of other devices such as data loggers or ECUs. If
either one or both of these wires are not being used isolate and tape the wire(s) out
of the way. The default analog outputs are as follows: Analog output one (yellow) is
0V = 7.35 AFR and 5V = 22.39 AFR. Analog output two (brown) is 1.1V = 14 AFR
and .1V = 15 AFR. This is a simulated narrowband signal."

http://www.innovatemotorsports.com/support/manual/MTX-L_Manual_1.1.pdf

So it seems like I am good to go!!! The MTX-L offers the same functionality as the XD-16 but it's only $180 and its easier to install.

Now if only I didn't have UofACATS's idea to think about....

 

[UofACATS]

Isn't it possible to recognize potentially dangerous conditions immediately with a gauge and and start taking it easy rather than waiting until you are done driving and looking at the log?

This is the thing. Think about what that actually means.. Say the wastegate signal line tears off and your turbo is free to spike to whatever boost it wants. Under normal conditions, when boost hits it hits pretty fast. Your small 16G is no exception. Now with a gauge, how much time will you have to recognize the gauge is showing above what your boost is set to. You'll probably be on the limiter before you can think to react. On my e3 16G, when boost hits 10psi or so, it rockets to full boost faster than I could ever think to react to it. When I adjust anything on my car I log while doing a pull getting on to the freeway near my house. It's the safest place to do so, and I do a second gear pull so it's still legal. Then I get off at the next exit which has a gas station, and review the log.

If I'm adjusting the MBC I'll do a half pull so even if it spikes it won't go out of control. For a real-world example of why: On my old setup I've accidentally boost spiked on a slower spooling 3065 and thought I got off the gas in a blink of a second, but the log showed otherwise.

With ECMlink, I've set the CEL to flash at 1 degree of knock. I'm completely trained to lift when that light flashes because it is a very rare occurrence. Now in your case, if something is horribly wrong, it's more likely that a flashing light on the dash will trigger a lift off the throttle at least as fast (if not faster) than the gauge would. This is assuming you're staring at the gauge the second the abnormality shows itself.

It's just my 0.02 here. If you feel more comfortable with a guage then you should use one, but IMHO gauges are a waste of money. Let me back that up too by saying I can't possibly "follow" what my boost gauge says as I do a pull, but if I have ECMlink which logs at an excellent resolution, I can review everything in a much more efficient, accurate, and safe manner because I'll be parked. Now gauges can help by showing little things like vacuum leaks because you'll see a slight less bit vacuum on the gauge than you normally do, but on the other hand, with ECMlink you'll also see this because the log will show it.


another no-gauge opinion.

 

[92AWDHX40]

Everyone will have options and likes and dislikes sometimes my laptop crashes even though i have several i like gauges.

 

[nlzn]

Not to steal the thunder from the Wideband argument.. but..

If you want or have to have an oil pressure gauge, get electronic with the sensor. Hot oil running into the cabin is asking for problems

 

[AskDrStupid]

IMHO gauges are a waste of money. Let me back that up too by saying I can't possibly "follow" what my boost gauge says as I do a pull, but if I have ECMlink which logs at an excellent resolution, I can review everything in a much more efficient, accurate, and safe manner because I'll be parked. Now gauges can help by showing little things like vacuum leaks because you'll see a slight less bit vacuum on the gauge than you normally do, but on the other hand, with ECMlink you'll also see this because the log will show it.
another no-gauge opinion.

So what do I need to get started with this configuration?
ECMlink v3 or v3 lite?
LC-1 cable and wideband O2 sensor?
Anything else?

 

[UofACATS]

If you want or have to have an oil pressure gauge

In the 2G's, oil pressure gauges are stock equipment. There's no "number" but I can see if I've lost all pressure, and that would be my concern.

So what do I need to get started with this configuration?
ECMlink v3 or v3 lite?
LC-1 cable and wideband O2 sensor?
Anything else?

v3 lite is hugely capable. Also upgradeable to the full version if needed. That saves a few bucks with no penalty later.

Also required to tune:

A wideband - I have no recommendation. I use an Innovate LM-1 but only because I had multiple turbo vehicles and would interchange the device among them.
A boost pressure sensor - I recommend the OMNI 4-Bar sensor. You can pick it up from ECMlink, but for 6 bucks more you can get this bundle. Let me tell you that's a screaming deal. Actually, seeing as you have a boost gauge you technically don't need a boost sensor. The gauge isn't an absolute pressure sensor, and cannot be logged for review (for reviewing boost vs. boost est. and ect.) but a basic tune can be achieved with the boost set via the gauge. I would still recommend it highly though.


Here's an ECMlink supported aftermarket sensor list. Check these out and do the research on the WB and Boost sensors, then decide. You can figure out the total costs associated.

 

[92AWDHX40]

Got to the ecmlink site, link is just fine upgrade later you can run sd which i am going to do this spring and you can eliminate the maf all together, and a wideband havent seen any of us not use one.

 

[UofACATS]

Got to the ecmlink site, link is just fine upgrade later you can run sd

It's possible I've misread your post, but I'd like to interject that Speed Density is supported on both the full version and the lite version of ECMlink v3.

 

[92AWDHX40]

Exactly lite and full version.

 

[AskDrStupid]

get this bundle. Let me tell you that's a screaming deal. Actually, seeing as you have a boost gauge you technically don't need a boost sensor. The gauge isn't an absolute pressure sensor, and cannot be logged for review (for reviewing boost vs. boost est. and ect.) but a basic tune can be achieved with the boost set via the gauge. I would still recommend it highly though.

If I use the Speed Density setup you referenced, do I still need a MAS or MAF to calculate airflow or is the airflow calculated exclusivly using speed density methods?

Update: ECU is in route to ECMtuning. I bought ECMlink V3 lite.

 

[UofACATS]

The airflow is calculated using speed density, you don't need the MAF to meter the airflow.