Clutch issue

[RedRex02]

Was going to work this morning and had a weird problem. I got in, pushed the cltuch in, started the car but as soon as I pressed it in, I knew there was something worng. The clutch seemed VERY soft and it did not go up fast at all. I have a ACT 2100 with an XACT flywheel. This was installed a year ago. Ever since then no problems. All of a sudden this pedal is crazy soft. Haven't beat on it for a while and it drove fine the day before. It sat outside all night bein about 25 degrees. Any ideas what to look for?
Jon
PS it barely engages going into gear. Feels as if it has no pressure.

 

[1993eclipseGS]

I'm glad everything worked out for you, And i'm happy for you that you got the tools and stepped up to the job!

 

[RedRex02]

I'm glad everything worked out for you, And i'm happy for you that you got the tools and stepped up to the job!

It is funny that this job took 4 hrs, when my longtube install on my LS1 took 3. Shows ya how much a lift helps. This was the first time back in the garage in the past year, kinda makes things a bit more difficult.
Jon

 

[delta448]

What do those usually cost? Anything else that it may be?
How can it get air in the system if it hasn't been messed with for the last year or so?

-I'm having a similar problem with my newly purchased, formerly Arizona 97 TSI now in much wetter and colder SWern PA. Very little pressure at the pedal until it almost hits the floor, and the clutch is not disengaging completely even when I try stomping the clutch pedal clear through the firewall. I'm grinding horrifically in first, second and reverse . The shop I took it to today added fluid to the system and bled it, and the problem was psuedo-cured for about 6-8 hrs . I have been unable to find any leaks anywhere and I'm pretty sure the master and slave cylinders are both still good. Anybody have any ideas on how I'm losing fluid or adding air to the system? Or do I likely have another problem?WTF

 

[punishercb]

WOW, this is the exact same problem that I've been having!! About a month ago my clutch went out and I lost all hydraulic fluid in my slave cylinder. The signs before that happened was a really really long clutch travel. It would start to catch earlier and earlier until it caught about a 1/4" from the floor. I got the hydraulic line replaced but now the clutch pedal doesn't seem right. Hey 1993eclipseGS, you sound like you know what you're talking about. Do you have any advice on how to adjust the pedal? I had them adjust it but they either adjusted it too close to the floor or had it catching like 1" from the stop. How do I adjust the pedal so it catches in the middle like it supposed to? I hope that made sense.

 

[delta448]

Update:
I'm never taking my car to that shop again . They never even checked the clutch master cylinder, even though I told them that was the likely problem . So, after inspecting it myself I did find a moderate amount of fluid around the master cylinder rod in the footwell and will be replacing both master and slave myself very soon. I guess if you want something done right you have to do it yourself. I sincerely apologize for my previous post on this topic and for wasting everyone's time who read it.

-Anybody have any install pics for the 2G clutch master or slave cylinders? I don't have a lot of tools at my disposal, but I understand all the concepts fairly well and I'm willing to give it a try. Any help would be GREATLY appreciated.

 

[Wufei]

http://www.plymouthlaser.com/slave2.htm

Here ya go. I recently went through this myself, though my symptom was pedal going rock hard, and in my case it was the clutch/PP going out

Yours I'm 90% sure is cylinders though.

 

[RedRex02]

I'm glad everything worked out for you, And i'm happy for you that you got the tools and stepped up to the job!

New update...
All parts are on and here is the deal. After everything was done, I took it out and it needed an adjustment. So I adjusted it so that the engagement would be closer to the floor and I got it set about 99% to what I wanted it as. I used the rod adjuster for this btw. Took it out again, did not slip up top, or grind in high rpm's. Drove about 5 miles and all of a sudden it began to go back out(the engagement) farther away from the floor. WTF? Locking nut was tight as can be and there was no leaks.

Could it be:
More air in the system from adjusting it again?
Need to adjust the Cruise, Clutch upper stop adjustment?
Or something else I missed.

What order should I do everything again to fix this problem?
Jon

 

[punishercb]

New update...
All parts are on and here is the deal. After everything was done, I took it out and it needed an adjustment. So I adjusted it so that the engagement would be closer to the floor and I got it set about 99% to what I wanted it as. I used the rod adjuster for this btw. Took it out again, did not slip up top, or grind in high rpm's. Drove about 5 miles and all of a sudden it began to go back out(the engagement) farther away from the floor. WTF? Locking nut was tight as can be and there was no leaks.

Could it be:
More air in the system from adjusting it again?
Need to adjust the Cruise, Clutch upper stop adjustment?
Or something else I missed.

What order should I do everything again to fix this problem?
Jon

This is the same problem I'm having too people, if you can help this guy you'd be helping both of us!

 

[RedRex02]

I think it't time to take it to a shop. I can not get it adjusted and have it stay adjusted the way I like. Damn thing
Jon

 

[ericbev]

If your engagement point is moving around it probably pedal pump. It was doing this to me when I did my clutch install. This is a quote off of RREs website.

If you are fighting an inconsistent pedal adjustment in a 2G, adjust the upper pedal stop adjuster so that you gain additional free play at the top of the pedal travel. If this is your problem, you will notice that the pedal suddenly gets very tight and the release point will suddenly move up a lot, this is the cause.

2Gs need free play at the top of the pedal travel. If it is close to no travel and right on the edge, then it pumps up. Only 2Gs have a relief valve in the master cylinder that needs to be uncovered so fluid can go back into the reservoir on the clutch release. If not, it gets tighter and tighter and tighter. Then it may slowly relieve the pressure and it is back to normal. Just a 2G thing. You need more free play at the top of the pedal travel.

Left unchecked, the pedal will pump up more and more. The clutch will begin to slip since it is as if you are driving around with your foot on the clutch pedal. Also it plays hell on the crankshaft thrust bearings. The constant pressure pushes the clutch release bearing onto the clutch and flywheel. When centrifugal force throws the clutch release fingers outwards, they make additional pressure on the thrust bearings of the crank. This is an additional factor in short lived crankshaft

Go to the bottom of this page.
http://www.roadraceengineering.com/clutchandflywheeltech.htm

 

[RedRex02]

If your engagement point is moving around it probably pedal pump. It was doing this to me when I did my clutch install. This is a quote off of RREs website.



Go to the bottom of this page.
http://www.roadraceengineering.com/clutchandflywheeltech.htm

Well here was my first problem: The parts store that I bought the master from gave me a non-turbo one. So I brought it back and got the right one.

Second is, the free play RRE is talking about, are they saying that when the clutch is erngaged, there should be more play as the pedal goes up?

Jon

 

[ericbev]

They mean that your clutch shouldnt begin disengaging as soon as you start to depress your pedal. There should be a little "slop" or freeplay before it actually starts moving fluid. Like it says, is you dont have this the fluid never goes back into the cylinder and it keeps trying to push more into the line. This is why it tightens up and eventually starts slightly disengaging the clutch. Use this pic under clutch adjustment to get this right. There is a little nut on the back of the rod. You loosen it and adjust the rod till your disengagement point is about in the middle or at least not right at the top.



Hope that helps.

 

[RedRex02]

They mean that your clutch shouldnt begin disengaging as soon as you start to depress your pedal. There should be a little "slop" or freeplay before it actually starts to do its job. Like it says, is you dont have this the fluid never goes back into the cylinder and it keeps trying to push more into the line. This is why it tightens up and eventually starts slightly disengaging the clutch. Use this pic under clutch adjustment to get this right. There is a little nut on the back of the rod. You loosen it and adjust the rod till your disengagement point is about in the middle or at least not right at the top.



Hope that helps.

Gotchya. Yea here is what I think the problem was. I had enough freeplay before. It was just that I had the wrong master, which I think made it very hard to adjust. I have the correct master, and will be installing tomorrow evening. Hopefully everything goes well and I am done with this problem.

I will keep everyone updated.
Thanks
Jon