ECMlink Car won't start on SD

[smills1840]

1). Any boost, vac, or exhaust leaks?
No major leaks, but will test again.

2). Verified mechanical timing?
Yes.

3). Verified base timing?
Yes.

4). Ignition system
COP or Stock Coil: Stock
Wire brand and Age: NGK, new
Spark Plug brand, type and Gap: NGK BPR6ES, .028

5). Motor health (Compression Test)
Cylinder 1:
Cylinder 2:
Cylinder 3:
Cylinder 4:

6). Performed basic throttle body adjustments?
Idle Switch: Yes
Throttle Cable: Basic adjustment, might need work
TPS: Same as above
BISS: Same as above

7). Compression ratio

Stock '99 7 bolt

8). Any known bad sensors or brittle wiring?

None.

9). Any DTC/CEL codes?

None.

10). Electrical system
Car off (not running): 12v
Car running: 13.5-14.0v

11). Base fuel pressure and injector values
Base Fuel Pressure: 42.5
Injector Size (cc/min): 950cc

12). Properly calibrated and configured wideband sensor
Sensor Brand: Innovate LC-2
Calibration Date: This week

13). Type of fuel
Type: 93 Octane
Percent of Ethanol:

14). Watched ECMlink how-to videos?

Yes.




My car is a 99 gsx, with the head/block that came from the factory in 1999. I recently just restored the engine bay, and in the process I installed several upgrades, including Link V3, Omni 4 Bar, and an HX40.

The car was previously tuned on 2g MAF using EcuFlash/Ceddy Mods. The car ran well enough to daily drive.

The injectors are supposedly PTE 950cc (that's what is engraved on them), but I don't see much information about them online as far as scaling and deadtime are concerned.

After putting the car back together, it started up and ran well enough on the EcuFlash/Ceddy Mods tune (with MAF) to drive to a car show a few miles away. I then decided to switch to Link V3 due to the support. Again, I was able to get the car to start and idle on MAF, but I can't get any action on SD. The Omni 4 bat is mounted in the stock location on the intake mani, although it is rotated 180 degrees because I did a wire tuck. Could this be a potential issue?

I've tried a lot of different injector settings, and I've also flashed a tune from a running SD car with similar modifications. Still, the car won't start.

Since I'm so new to link, I'd like some advice on what/how to log so you guys can see what is going on.

Thanks!

 

[kmetiuk]

I would speculate that its your deadtimes.

My car is super sensitive to deadtimes. If I change more than 1us at idle it will die and I cannot restart until changed back.

You can use the global scaling value in link....but you need to know the deadtimes to get it idling properly. Deadtimes are the MOST important at idle as that is where the injector pulse width is the smallest and the deadtime makes up the largest portion of the total injector pulse width.

Try and look around for deadtime on the 950's on here and on the link forums.

 

[usmcjay]

Make sure under pin assignments you select where the omni 4 bar sensor is installed and right below that you tell ecmlink where to look for input from that sensor..

 

[d1prospect]

+1 I had the same problem. Ended up being my pin assignment "usmc jay" said. Simple click of the right option and mine fired right up

 

[gofer]

Since I'm so new to link, I'd like some advice on what/how to log so you guys can see what is going on.

Thanks!

Look at the stickies in the forum you posted this in.

http://www.dsmtuners.com/threads/helpful-links.443307/
http://www.dsmtuners.com/threads/list-of-values-to-log.444831/
http://www.dsmtuners.com/threads/wa...r-receive-no-replies-from-the-wisemen.443297/

 

[smills1840]

The Omni MAP sensor is plugged into the factory MDP sensor plug. I've tried selecting both MDP and BARO, and still nothing. I've also tried a WIDE range of injector settings, none of which seem to make a difference. Also, I can get the car to start on MAF with quick guesses at global and deadtime settings. Is SD much more sensitive to these values being absolutely correct?

I've read most of those link, and I guess I'm a little confused on the logging. First of all, a couple of the values listed in Brian's thread don't appear for me. Does SD have to be enabled for them to appear? For instance, I don't have the option to add VE to the log.

Second, if the car won't start at all, will a log of me trying to crank the car provide any valuable info?

 

[Galipso]

Did you put an IAT in the UICP? when i did that, i didnt have one of the wires in the harness grounded after i cut it to splice in the IAT ground, this caused a no start

 

[smills1840]

Not yet, but I've it supposed to be possible to run the car with it, right? I have the IAT sensor already, just don't have it installed yet.

 

[miliman13]

The Omni MAP sensor is plugged into the factory MDP sensor plug. I've tried selecting both MDP and BARO, and still nothing info?

For example if i go to the ECU INPUT TAB and i don't have my setting correct my car will shut off.


play with it, i don't have a current log so i cant see how my setting is, but i have my MAP wired into the harness MDP wires.

You must be logged in to view this image or video.

So select your (MAP) then below select (MAP TYPE)
Save to ECU and above that, select it to show as a logged value. Then using F9 on your log you can add it to displayed values.


I may be wrong, if so im sure someone will school me.

 

[smills1840]

When you say "Save to ECU and above that,..." where are you talking about?

 

[usmcjay]

Since your sensor is installed in the mdp location, where it say mdp up top, omni 4 bar should be selected there..save pin assignment..below that you will see an area that says manifold pressure I beleive, that should say mdp telling the ecu to look at the mdp location for manifold pressure which is where your pressure sensor is installed. Click save to ecu.

 

[smills1840]

Yeah, I did that and still nothing. I also tried the baro setting, didn't work either.

 

[usmcjay]

just connect ecmlink and make a quick 3 sec log with the car off and post it so I can see your settings. Myself or someone may be able to better assist you then

 

[smills1840]

I'm going to post a log with the car running on maf, then a log of me trying to start the car on SD.

 

[kmetiuk]

I'm going to post a log with the car running on maf, then a log of me trying to start the car on SD.

Posting a log of the car on maf will help a bit. It will allow you (us) to tell how far out the deadtimes are based on WBFactor, CombinedFT, and AirFlowPerRev.

You MUST tell the ECU where the omini4bar is plugged in. Switching it to anything other than what it is physically plugged into is just creating a nother porblem and will make it impossible to tune due to it not being read by the ECU b/c it is not looking at the right sensor.

It is plugged into MDP spot. SET TO MDP and leave it. Setting it to baro is ridic if it is not plugged in there.

There are 2 parts in the ECU inputs tab that you must set. The "ECU-side" and the "PC-side". Set yours up EXACTLY how @miliman13 has in his screen shot. It is 100% corrrect for your setup if you have the omnin4bar plugged into the old MDP wiring harness. Does not matter where the sensor is physically tapped into and has everything to do with what wiring plug you wired the omnin4bar into.

Run it off MAF and post a log and that will help give an idea of your settings and also from the data logs will help tell if your deadtimes are totally fcuked or the global is way off.

Deadtimes are SUPER IMPORTANT at idle and startup. Your ECU doesn't even use the WB for a few seconds after startup depending on your settings....it will how ever use airflow readings (MAF or if SD:MAP, IAT, and VE).

I cannot stress hard enough how much deadtime plays a major role at startup and IDLE. You must have this correct or as close a guess as you can.

The deadtime battery voltage adjust table in the DA tables is SUPER SUPER important it startup as the starter draws so much power there is always a voltage drop during startup which affects deadtime hugely.

 

[boostdawd]

Good info here. Also make sure that in MAF Comb u have selected speed density.

 

[smills1840]

I had originally set the MAP pin location to Mdp. When that didn't work, I set it to baro as a troubleshooting step based on other threads. The didn't work either, obviously.

I'll set it to MDP.

My question is, if the car idles relatively well on maf, shouldn't it start/idle relatively well using the exact same injector settings on SD?

 

[boostdawd]

Technically it should. or at least on mine it did. One thing I remember doing also when I set mine up is adjusting the BISS. It wouldn't stay running until adjusted.

 

[smills1840]

Alright, maybe I'm just forgetting what I did last night, but I got the car to start and idle pretty well on SD just now. I'll post the logs so you guys can see if anything stands out.

I let the car idle for a long time on SD, and I can tell right away that the front O2 sensor isn't cycling. Not sure if it is injector settings or a bad sensor.

Thanks for the help guys, I guess the "No start" issue is resolved. Now I'll need help with everything else I'm sure!

 

[gofer]

If you can't log capture VE or some of the other values then odds are you don't have the latest version of ECMLink installed on your laptop or the latest firmware on the chip.

First download the most recent version from the ECMLink Downloads page. After doing this you'll want to update your firmware as well but to do so its a bit trickier than just clicking a link.

1. You'll want to submit a firmware request and to do it requires you to connect to your cars ECU. Click ECU from the drop down and click Create Firmware Request... paying close attention to where its saved on your computer.
2. Request Firmware Upgrade... and select Choose File and find your firmware file you just saved.
3. Download the new firmware to your desktop or somewhere you can easily access it and then open up ECMLink.
4. Click the ECU drop down menu and select Upgrade Firmware and then pick the file you just downloaded while your connected to the ECU in the car.

 

[smills1840]

Really not sure whats going on, but just now when I opened the SD log I posted, I was able to add VE as well as several other values that weren't there before. I guess I won't complain, but seems kind of weird.

 

[miliman13]

When you say "Save to ECU and above that,..." where are you talking about?

It seems like you got it.
But for clarity, save to ecu is on the bottom right, and it automatically saves the changes you make in real time.

And above that; i meant above the MDP settings is a list of saved pin assignments, you have to tell the ecu were to log. So on the image you can see were i have mines and then and only then can you view it during a stream .

 

[usmcjay]

Really not sure whats going on, but just now when I opened the SD log I posted, I was able to add VE as well as several other values that weren't there before. I guess I won't complain, but seems kind of weird.

Dude I looked at your log and you don't have a manifold pressure source identified in pin assignments, you have it selected at the bottom telling the ecu where to look but you need to also select it up top. Where is say MDP------factory/ click on factory and in the drop down menu select your omni 4 bar.

 

[miliman13]

gofer would know about this, but i believe you need to check
"lock manifold differential pressure"
next to your MDP setings

see my image

 

[smills1840]

gofer would know about this, but i believe you need to check
"lock manifold differential pressure"
next to your MDP setings

see my image

I noticed that you had that checked. Why do I need to check it? What does it do?