1G (Best) Rod/Piston Combo

[RonRonTSI]

I'm going for a street/drag build but I want to assemble a high revving motor. I'm definitely going with the wiseco HD pistons. I'm a little lost on choosing the right rod combination because of all the arguments on the forums.

Ive read a few threads stating that they use there groden rods on the street? My questions are:

Best combo choice for street/drag? (mostly drag)
Do I use the rod bolts that come with the rods or use ARP?
Are the groden rods a possibility?

 

[92tsiawdguy]

wiseco hd pistons and howard i beam rods. maperformance is making over 1000whp on these rods.

 

[92tsiawdguy]

most rods come with arp rod bolts

 

[TSi Kid]

most rods come with arp rod bolts

And for the off chance that they don't, definitely go out and purchase some arps.

 

[RonRonTSI]

Thanks for the responses so quickly. I looked on MAPerformance website and couldn't find the howard rods. Ive never even heard of those.

Thanks for the responses so quickly. I looked on MAPerformance website and couldn't find the howard rods. Ive never even heard of those.

I found them. Those things are pretty pricey, But if they are proven then I wouldn't mind throwing in the extra money at all.

 

[TSi Kid]

I know you said it will be a primarily track car but what times/hp goals do you have.
1000whp is pretty cool but you can hit 10s on 500-600whp easy, so are you going for a dyno queen, and if not, what kind of time slips do you want?

 

[RonRonTSI]

What kind of power levels? What kind of motor? 6-bolt? 7-bolt? What displacement/crank? rpm range?

A bit more detail will help this process alot.

Well the current turbo that I have is the GT4088R. Its a complete stock 6 bolt right now. im getting suggestions on the rod/piston combo for revving purposing a longevity for street use. I want to build a high revving 2.0 that can handle 700 hp range and around 500 for street use.

 

[laserspeeddemon]

You want high revving. Get these:

FFWD Connection - Race Injuns That Will Freeze Your Brain

 

[RonRonTSI]

You want high revving. Get these:

FFWD Connection - Race Injuns That Will Freeze Your Brain

If you look at the top of the thread thats one of the main topics I was talking about.

How would the grp's do on the street?
I dont know if aluminum rods would be capable for some long hour drives. Tell me if im wrong I would love any input.

 

[92AWDHX40]

How many combinations have you looked at, arguments here, thats not going to change whats your budget?

 

[TofastForU_99]

Manley I beams and Wiseco HD's for a 2.0.

 

[92AWDHX40]

Im looking at that set up allen, preparing for a new build myself.

 

[kthackst]

High revving would make aluminum rods (Groden or GRP) an attractive choice. They can handle upwards of 1200hp and can spin at 10,000+ rpms . A guy near me has a set of Grodens on a GT42R and runs 50psi all the way up to 9500rpms. To say his car is nasty is an understatement. The reduced weight of the rods means less stress on the bearings and faster you can rev the engine. however you have to wait for the engine to come up to temperature before you can drive so the rods can expand and not spin a bearing.

I have a set of GRPs for my car I plan on using if I dont sell them before my current setup explodes.

So since you are saying you want this to be a street car I would shy away from Aluminum rods unless you really know what you are signing up for. Any of the rods above will work. its just personal preference.

The Wiseco HD is the best piston you can buy for our car right now hands down.

 

[RonRonTSI]

Well looks like I am going to go with the HD's and the Groden rods. I guess im going to go with the stock crank that is in the car.

Should I keep the oil squirter's in or remove them?

Like I said I want to be able to drive to the track and back home. Any more idea's on my setup would be appreciated.

 

[Big Woo]

A good starting point would be to establish a budget for your built. Doing so may allow to to pass over some rods, or if price is a concern not bother with high end options.

I have used five differnt types of rods in various DSM builds over the years. 1: Oliver great rod, super tough, but pricey, 2: Eagle good budget rod, will work well for 80% of customers, 3: Manely good mid grade rods at moderae pricing, 4: Scat another good budget rod and will also suffice for 80% of customers, 5: Stock Mitsu rods with ARP bolts have put over 350 hp to the wheels with this combo on a lot of cars.

Many of the aftermarket rod manufacturers allow differnt connecting rods bolt choices, whether you need this up grade is dependent on your specific build. Many come with ARP bolts upon purchase.

Anything is a possability, but I would suspect that your extra dollars may be better spent elsewhere. Aluminum rods typically require additional block clearancing due to the increased mass of the rods, therefore this can lead to additional machine shop expenses.

 

[99gst_racer]

I'm going for a street/drag build but I want to assemble a high revving motor.

How high? And what's your budget?

 

[RonRonTSI]

I dont really have a budget I just want the best bang for the buck. I want to rev to 9k safely with the longevity for a street car. Im running a 4088R and the most power I can see me getting out of it is probably 6ish on pump.(unless it makes more than that on pump)

 

[Big Woo]

So is it safe to say that your looking for a budget build / bang of the buck build that will rev to 9000 rpm, make 600 plus HP, and have the life expectency of a street build?

 

[99gst_racer]

I dont really have a budget I just want the best bang for the buck. I want to rev to 9k safely with the longevity for a street car. Im running a 4088R and the most power I can see me getting out of it is probably 6ish on pump.(unless it makes more than that on pump)

You can reliably rev to 9K and make 600 WHP on regular off the shelf Eagle rods. Although, there are benefits to running a lighter aluminum rod. You just have to ask yourself if you're willing to spend double the amount for less rotational weight.

If you ever think you'll be revving beyond 9500, I'd probably go with an aluminum rod.

 

[RonRonTSI]

So is it safe to say that your looking for a budget build / bang of the buck build that will rev to 9000 rpm, make 600 plus HP, and have the life expectency of a street build?

I dont have a budget. I want what is best for my application. I wanted to hear everyones opinion on these aluminum rods. My talon over the summer that I sold dynoed at 629 on ross/eagle combo. Those rods never saw past 8.5 and I drove it everyday. I wanted to maybe take aluminum rods in consideration Because they hold more power and rev alot faster. Reliability is my concern on this one.

 

[99gst_racer]

Newer aluminum rods are leaps and bounds more reliable than when they first came out in the 70's. They've come a looong way as a product in general. I wouldn't hesitate to trust a good aluminum rod to be reliable these days.

 

[olddsmer]

The Grodens are probably the best choice in alum rods. You just need to pull the oil pan every now and then to check them out. They can stretch a little.
When I did my bottom end with Manley products, I kept my squirters. Word is
you don't need them with forged pistons. I kept mine and did not see any loss
in oil pressure. My pressure is at 75psi and 3000rpms.

Regards
Greg

 

[TurboAnything]

OH boy here we go with the old stretch myth. The rod will not stretch only the rod bolts will and only if you use standard ARPs if you switch to L19 bolt you only have to check them every season or so.

 

[Big Woo]

Everything streches when rotated fast enough with enough weight on the end of it. If this was not the case no one would need to leave .080 for piston to valve clearance, ar .040 for deck clearance.

We are not talking about perminent strech here, only dynamic. Some combonations may need some additional amount of clearance to compensate for the differences dynamicly.

 

[TurboAnything]

But i do not believe that was what he is implying. I just do not want people to get old outdated info.