another problem with shredding belts

[jaders]

I sold my Talon about 7 months ago. I only asked for 3000. I put a lot of work into it. My wife and I could not afford the payments after moving into a new apartment. I have been stuck driving a mini van since then. Not realy a huge deal except for that I work as an car audio installer for best buy and all of the other installers drive civics with engine swaps. They used have more respect for me in the Talon. Now they chuckle when I drive by. Any way thats not my real problem. The guy I sold my car to wants to sell it back to me for 800. The problem it is having is it keeps shredding belts. When I go to pick it up it will be on it's 3rd belt. when I had it I replaced the water pump/ harmonic balancer/idler pulley/idler and all belts. I am not a mechanic and did these repairs on my own. When I had the car it only sqealed when it was realy cold out. Smoke usualy would puff out for a few seconds after a cold start. My friend told me that his talon does that too. I did not think anything more about it. The new owner told me that the alternator went bad and he had replaced it. He started having the sqealing problem on just about every start up. About 5-6 months after the new alternator his belt shredded. He had a mechanic put a new belt on. 1-2 months after that it shredded again. He does not know anything about these cars and I have helped him on some other problems he has had with this car. I don't feel he is trying to scam me or anything. It is a realy good deal. The clutch and flywheel I had put on cost more then 800. I read the other posts and everything that I read does not fit my problem. I may have missed something. The water pump and harmonic balancer are new. Less then a year new. I plan on checking the alternator and seeing if it was installed correctly. The only thing is that the guy who put the alternator on for him was the same guy who helped me my timing belt. He knows more about these cars then I do. He has owned 2 1st gens and 1 2nd. Is there something else I can check with out pulling the wheel off and takin that damn cover off the timing belt. Thanks for any help I am excited and scared at the same time. I need some advice and some reassurance. Jaders

 

[huafist]

Sounds like symptoms of a crank pulley seperating, even though you've replaced it. I'd check it. Also check to see if the belts are being tightened too much, or if the pulleys are out of line.

 

[jaders]

Sounds like symptoms of a crank pulley seperating, even though you've replaced it. I'd check it. Also check to see if the belts are being tightened too much, or if the pulleys are out of line.

In your opinion is it normal that when it is realy cold that the belts sqeal on start up and smoke will come out of that area? Obviosly it can't be too normal but is it something I should have worried about?I live in Iowa and it can get pretty cold. My battery gets pretty drained trying to start on cold days like that. I sometimes sit there for about 5 minutes cranking the engine over.

 

[dhonda]

In your opinion is it normal that when it is realy cold that the belts sqeal on start up and smoke will come out of that area? Obviosly it can't be too normal but is it something I should have worried about?I live in Iowa and it can get pretty cold. My battery gets pretty drained trying to start on cold days like that. I sometimes sit there for about 5 minutes cranking the engine over.

When I had this problem it was due to the mechanic (20 years of exp) putting my belt on backwards. I brought it back and then he put the pulley on backwards. I am not really car smart, but when I looked at the exposed belts I could see they were getting torn up and in some cases smoking. If you look at the belts dead one (facing the car) they should align perfectly if they are \ by a little it will eat the belt.

 

[ADrewzki]

I wouldn't necessarily say it's a temperature issue but over time the rubber that's supposed to dampen the crank pulley from vibration will deteriorate causing it to wobble a little bit which can cause your belts to shred. If this is the case, the belts that are getting ruined are probably the alternator and AC belt because the power steering belt is further up on a different pulley. Take off or loosen the belts and check the crank pulley. Otherwise, maybe you just had the belts put on wrong (doubtful though).

 

[realitytb]

LOOSEN YOUR BELTS!!! if they keep shredding even after youve replaced things, LOOSEN THEM! That is most likely your problem.

 

[FourG63 97GST]

or tensioner pulley installed wrong

 

[realitytb]

tensioner pulleys for DSM's are on the timing belt. If you shredded your timing belt, kiss our engine good bye. So with that, i would count tension pulleys out.

 

[jaders]

I wouldn't necessarily say it's a temperature issue but over time the rubber that's supposed to dampen the crank pulley from vibration will deteriorate causing it to wobble a little bit which can cause your belts to shred. If this is the case, the belts that are getting ruined are probably the alternator and AC belt because the power steering belt is further up on a different pulley. Take off or loosen the belts and check the crank pulley. Otherwise, maybe you just had the belts put on wrong (doubtful though).

I am going to pick the car up on Monday. I will have to install a new belt to get the car running. I can't remember if you have take anything off to install the alternator belt or not. I gave him my Chilton's when I sold him the car. If I am looking at the crank pulley/harmonic balancer what am I lookig for? Am I just checking to see if it wobbles or am I checking to see if the rubber is deteriorating? The manuel calls for the harmonic balancer to be changed at 120000 miles. It is my assumption that it should last this long if it was replaced.

 

[jaders]

I am going to pick the car up on Monday. I will have to install a new belt to get the car running. I can't remember if you have take anything off to install the alternator belt or not. I gave him my Chilton's when I sold him the car. If I am looking at the crank pulley/harmonic balancer what am I lookig for? Am I just checking to see if it wobbles or am I checking to see if the rubber is deteriorating? The manuel calls for the harmonic balancer to be changed at 120000 miles. It is my assumption that it should last this long if it was replaced.

Well I put the new belt on today. Pretty easy to do. It started up with no squeel . I drove it home and no problems. I park it and let it sit for about 2 hours. I go to pull it in the garage and it starts squeeling and blowing smoke by the belts. You can smell rubber burning. I turn the car off and feel the pulley's. The alternator pulley is pretty hot , the water pump pulley was warm and the crank pulley was cold. I felt down at the crank pulley it does not wobble.Thats when I relised that there was no belt shavings any where along the bottom of the motor. The top part of the motor was covered espeacialy the alternator. Is it possable that the alternator pulley is some how locking up?I thought maybe the waterpump pulley might be wobbling so I put some nail polish on it so I could see better while the engine was running. It runs perfectly in line. As I said before the crank pulley is only about a year old. The alternator only four months old. The shredding belts started after the alternator was switched out. The alternator has a warranty on it but could it be the alternator? If so how would I prove that to the auto parts store?

 

[huafist]

Either the ALT is out of line with the W/P and crank, or the ALT pulley is fried.

 

[jaders]

Either the ALT is out of line with the W/P and crank, or the ALT pulley is fried.

How can I get the alternator in line? Do I need new brackets? If The pulley is fried would the place I bought it be able to test it? Last question, Is there a diffrence between 1st and 2nd gen alts or man an a/t trans alts? Thanks for replying to my post.

 

[huafist]

1G and 2G alts are different - the 2g's use the ECU for voltage control.
Usually if an alt is out of line it's because the tensioner is either loose or off the car. And it doesn't have to be the tensioner arm, the track it rides in can be loose and cause the problem.

And yeah, the place you bought it from should be able to test it with no problems.

 

[iowaTSIfWd]

When I recieved my car the same thing happened. I will bet you 10 dollars your water pump pulley is on backwards. It is easy, if you dont know what your doing, to put the pulley on backwards. If the belt jump about one thread each time it shredds thats definatly it. So go put up a 10mm self racheting wrench and youll be back to normal in 10 minutes. Good luck!!!

 

[Defiant]

In your opinion is it normal that when it is realy cold that the belts sqeal on start up and smoke will come out of that area?

No.

Obviosly it can't be too normal but is it something I should have worried about?

Yes.

I live in Iowa and it can get pretty cold.

That shouldn't matter.

My battery gets pretty drained trying to start on cold days like that. I sometimes sit there for about 5 minutes cranking the engine over.

Don't do that. Give it one 5-second crank, stop, try again. It should catch right away. If not, now that you're $2500 bucks up, pay a mechanic to fix the thing. Start by pulling the CE codes.

 

[jaders]

No.Yes.That shouldn't matter.Don't do that. Give it one 5-second crank, stop, try again. It should catch right away. If not, now that you're $2500 bucks up, pay a mechanic to fix the thing. Start by pulling the CE codes.

I have some kind of draw on my battery. I went through an optima red top in less then a year. If I let my car sit for a couple of days it will be completely dead. There for my car does not have the right amount of cranking amps. I never crank the car for more then 5 seconds at a time. I usualy have to jump it from my other car. The car cranks fine it just does not seem to get any fuel.The plugs I had in it were the ngk's 7series. I do not know the model number. I also had accel spark plug wires at that time.

 

[jaders]

When I recieved my car the same thing happened. I will bet you 10 dollars your water pump pulley is on backwards. It is easy, if you dont know what your doing, to put the pulley on backwards. If the belt jump about one thread each time it shredds thats definatly it. So go put up a 10mm self racheting wrench and youll be back to normal in 10 minutes. Good luck!!!

If I was looking at the pulley how would I know if it was on backwards? The side with lip I think is facing away from the engine

 

[iowaTSIfWd]

If my memory prevail, it is suppose to face the other way. The best way to see if it on backwards is look straight down onto the pulley and see if its aligned to the crank pulley. You could also compaire the position of yours to another fellow dsmer in your area. Good luck!!

 

[90CherryTSI]

a thousand words, even more if we can fix your problem by posting one. Take a picture and post it, that will help us tell you if it's on wrong.

 

[iowaTSIfWd]

What city on Iowa are you from?

 

[AleksLukic]

i noticed my alternator belt shredding once, and i figured out why, when i was putting the pulleys back together, i had on flipped the wrong way causing it to shred my belt, with that swapped never had a problem again. yeah noob mistake, but hey I learned.

 

[jaders]

a thousand words, even more if we can fix your problem by posting one. Take a picture and post it, that will help us tell you if it's on wrong.

I agree. I spent most of last night reading through my chilton's trying to find something that would tell me the direction that the pulley was sapose to go. I felt behind the pulley and the other side has a deep cavity. If I was to switch it around it would stick out about another 1/2 inch.I do not have a digital camera and even if I did I would not know how to post it on here. I live on the South side of Des Moines. The only other person I know sold his Talon and bought a Tiberon. I tried to tighten my alternator belt last night. I loosened the adjuster bolt and the alt could be moved up and down. I thought you had to loosen the pivot bolt before you could move it up and down. I tightened the pivot bolt and adjusted the alt so it's tension matched the power steering. My battery was dead so I did not get a chance to crank it over and see if it worked. I will try the waterpump pulley but I am 90 % sure that it is on right.

 

[kalla]

The alternator pulley should line up in a straight line with the the one on the alternator, otherwise you put it on backwards. No pictures are necessary.

 

[jaders]

The alternator pulley should line up in a straight line with the the one on the alternator, otherwise you put it on backwards. No pictures are necessary.

The water pump pulley is on correct. I have not been able to work on it much I have been working over time putting remote starters in at Best Buy. I got the battery charged up and cranked the engine over and it sqeeled and blew smoke. I took a look under the car to see if I could pin point where the smoke was coming from. The smoke was pouring out of the alternator pulley. It was rubber burning. Do you think I should yank that out and try another or should I take it to the dealer and see if something else is wrong?

 

[jaders]

I think I may have found an answer to my problem. I was searching on Vfaq.com on how to take the alternator off and it turns out that the guy doing the pull/repair was having the same problem that I have. I will pull the alt out and see if they will give me a new one. If they do not does any one know of a place to get a reliable alt. Thanks for everyone's help. I will let you know how it goes.