AMS GT37R (PT67R dbb) T3 or T4 hotside?

[jkimes]

Which turbo should spool fastest on a 2.4 motor? A divided housing T4 .96 AR dbb 4088 or a dbb pt67r w a .63 T4 non divided hotside? I want to be able to make 700hp on race gas without nitrous with the fastest spool possible. Anyone have experience with both?

 

[Black94TSI]

You'd probably want the 1.15 A/R on the GT4088R to make 700 WHP, but no smaller than a 1.01. I'd pick a GT4088R over a PT67, it's perfectly sized to make 700 to the ground.

 

[nanokpsi]

You'd probably want the 1.15 A/R on the GT4088R to make 700 WHP, but no smaller than a 1.01. I'd pick a GT4088R over a PT67, it's perfectly sized to make 700 to the ground.

Maybe I never looked hard enough, but I havn't seen anyone making 700whp on a dynojet with a 4088.

 

[super95awd]

We've made over 700awhp on a .63a/r T3 housing T67 DBB. I don't know what all this talk is about these massive exhaust sides.

 

[sbengineering]

We've made over 700awhp on a .63a/r T3 housing T67 DBB. I don't know what all this talk is about these massive exhaust sides.

True that, I have a T67 with a T4 .81a/r and i feel thats a bit much for these little motors.

 

[nanokpsi]

We've made over 700awhp on a .63a/r T3 housing T67 DBB. I don't know what all this talk is about these massive exhaust sides.

To make the power at a lower pressure
What boost were you running to make 700? Shoot me over some pics of that kick ass exhaust mani while you are at it

 

[super95awd]

I'd rather run more boost than have a big, laggy pile of useless metal hanging off of the front of my motor. Maybe a little harsh, but anyways... It made just over 700awhp right at 39-40psi. My mindset is, if you're going to put a DBB67 on your car, you should have the motor to run any boost that you want. Is that far off base? It doesn't even think about waking up until 35psi.

You want pics of the FullRace mani Nathan??? Hit me up on dsmlink and remind me. I have some engine bay pics on my camera that I just havn't gotten around to loading up yet.
<~~Lazy

 

[Remy]

You want pics of the FullRace mani Nathan??? Hit me up on DSMLINK and remind me.

 

[super95awd]

Touchee.

 

[jkimes]

Anyone know where the cheapest place is to buy a .63 t3 dbb pt67r or 37r? The cheapest I've found one is $1300

 

[super95awd]

That's about as cheap as you'll find them. I got mine off of Full-Race. They are an awesome bunch of guys. Give them your business if you can.

 

[nanokpsi]

Yeah, Andrew, that mani is sexy. I'm going to have to scoop one up one of these days. I'll stick witht he t4 flange though so I can get a real mans turbine housing, but I'm sure I'll have moved to a better compressor by then too.

 

[jkimes]

This should be just the kind of real world comparison I am looking for. Nanokpsi and Super95awd are both using the 67r but super95 is t3 and Nano is t4. Their mods are similar if I remember correctly. So what is the spool and transient response difference in your cars? Does the T3 really spool that much faster than the T4? How much lower boost pressure could you achieve 700whp on a T4 67r vs the T3 model?

 

[nanokpsi]

The .68 will be more laggy than a .63 t3. For BB chra, I don't think transient response will be much different either way. Andrew is currently on a 2.0 so our spool comaparisons won't be comparable at all. I hit 23-24psi in 3rd before 5k rpm via my AEM 5 bar. In 4th fomr a2k roll I get the same boost by 4300. IF you are that worried about it, get the .58 open t4. I only say that as a personal prefrence as I love the V-band discharge on the t4 housings.
As far as power vs boost, Ecoli made 69x awhp on my same turbo ( I bought it from him) at 33psi. He had a 2.4l though, but a well built 2.0 will make similar power, just higher in the rpm band.

 

[jkimes]

Andrew is currently on a 2.0 so our spool comaparisons won't be comparable at all

My bad, I remember reading a long time ago about super95awd breaking into the 10's w an FPgreen on pump gas and a 2.3 sbr motor, but I guess he is using a different setup now. Does anyone know if the .96 divided housing T4 67r will spool the same and make more power than the T3 .63?

 

[red91gst]

.63 a/r FTW!

 

[nanokpsi]

.63 a/r FTW!

.81 T4 and 100shot FTMFW

 

[red91gst]

.81 T4 and 100shot FTMFW

1.15 FTRDMFSAEMCW! (For the real deal mother f*ckin slow ass eighth mile car win!)

 

[jkimes]

1.15 FTRDMFSAEMCW! (For the real deal mother f*ckin slow ass eighth mile car win!)

HAHAHA!! I think I just pissed in my pants a little bit from laughing so hard!

 

[jkimes]

Well, I leaned out my fuel settings a bit and put an oil restrictor on the turbo and it seems to have quit smoking. I guess I'll get her dyno tuned and see how much power I can squeeze out of the scm6176 but I know I'm gonna want more and when that time comes I think I'll go ahead and upgrade to a bb 67r. I still don't know which housing is the best compromise for spool/power though... T4 .68 open..... T3 .63..... or T4 .96 divided...???

Thanks again for all the suggestions.

 

[biglady112]

See I told you leaning it out would help make it stop smoking. Glad the oil restrictor helped too. When you want to get a great tune just call me and let me know.

Steven

 

[jkimes]

Geoff from Full-Race posted this on the evo forums....I think I may go with a larger divided T4 housing after all.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Angles217
My future plans is to run a full race twinscroll gt37 kit on 2.0L. I wanted to know what yall though about a twinscroll gt37 on 2.0L, I know i will have to rebuild my motor. Does anybody know what other supporting parts i will have to get. I search and saw some threads on 2.0l running gt37 setups but i havent heard nobody running the twinscroll setup.Thanks

considering the turbo size -- a twinscroll GT37R (67mm/63 trim compressor, 11 blade/76 trim turbine) is definately a decent high power highway/street-drag turbocharger. When people tell us they are considering this turbo i usually recommend the smaller twinscroll GT40R(63.5mm/52 trim compressor, 10 bade 78 trim turbine) . This is actually a slightly smaller compressor inducer turbo than the 37R, however it is far more efficient due to the 10 blade turbine and low trim compressor. Additionally, the bearing structure on the 40R is very stout and it is one of the strongest/most durable turbochargers ive ever used...either turbo would work very well, im just obviously partial to the 40R


Quote:
Originally Posted by xxNosTankxx
the twinscroll setup is only substantially functional when the turbo is like a 3076(30R) or 40R. The twinscroll setup on the 35R and 37R do not help spool it much quicker. Geoff also told me the twinscroll 40R would spool like a 35R yet produce power like a 37R. I've been contacting him lately to see the graphs and numbers from the twinscroll 40R kits... Also, if someone can explain why the twinscroll setup doesn't work well on the 35R and 37R, I would appreciate it.

the reason i said that i prefer to use the 30R and 40R in twinscroll is because they are easy to get. It is possibe to get a twincsroll 35R, but its difficult. Additionally, its possible to make a 37R twinscroll, but it just doesnt work quite as well as the 10 blade GT turbines.

BTW, just like Ted B mentioned above -- there is no such thing as a GT37R, its just an erroneous misleading name that evo guys have given these turbos... its not GT at all, and no one except for evo ppl calls it a GT37R

HKS called it their T04Z, we call it a T3/T67 or T4/T67... precision calls it a PT67..


Quote:
Originally Posted by Ted B
NO. It was the other way around. The larger turbo felt much better on the street than the 35R, simply because the larger turbo used a TS configuration.

isnt it cool how that works? I went from a single scroll 35R, to a singlescroll 37R to a twinscroll 40R, the 40R felt so much stronger and faster, even at low rpm despite its size


Quote:
Originally Posted by xxNosTankxx
I'm looking for a turbo that isn't too laggy for the street, but I want big power. I will track my car sometimes but its mainly a street monster that I look to build. It IS my project car and it is NOT my DD. So should I be looking toward a TS PT67 BB (37R)? I am aware of the supporting mods of a big turbo, and think that I would like to stay with the 2.0l. What are some other good ideas for turbos? Should I look up information on the PT67 BB?

we can provide any of the turbos, but i still stand by my recommendation of 40R



Quote:
Originally Posted by Ted B

If I wanted a more a bit more top end power than possible with a small turbo, but wanted to minimize lag, I would use a TS 3076R.

If I wanted yet a bit more peak power potential, and was willing to accept a little more lag, a TS 35R will do, but IMO will require a special 1.06 A/R TS hotside for best power potential in T3 configuration.

The PT67R, GT40R, and GT42R are larger still, require TS T4 hotsides, and require better supporting hardware tuning capability to make them truly worthwhile. The the record however, for whomever has driven a regular 35R open scroll car, they will be surprised at how much better a larger turbo with TS feels in comparison. Been there, done that.

^^^^ i dont know why i even both posting, ted summed it up right there
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[Remy]

My bad, I remember reading a long time ago about super95awd breaking into the 10's w an FPgreen on pump gas and a 2.3 sbr motor, but I guess he is using a different setup now. Does anyone know if the .96 divided housing T4 67r will spool the same and make more power than the T3 .63?

It was a 3052.

A t4 .96 is going to spool alot later than the t3.63 Infact it will spool later than the t3 .82 as well.

I think you would need something like a t4 .70 turbine housing.

-Remy

 

[Turbo Monk3y]

I have a T4 garrett .70 A/R divided/TS that i will be using in a few weeks on my t-67dbb... Ken made 670AWHP @ 34-35psi with this .70a/R housing, which seems right on par with Super95's 700+ @ 40psi It seems that maybe a Garrett .85 Divided/TS housing would suit best for Peak power(680-720awhp) and still combat lag... I will be trying the .70 out but I'm still looking for a divided .85 if you know of anyone selling them...

 

[stockfornow]

I have been looking at this thread for quite some time now. I have a question, does a T4 .96 divided spool up as fast as a T3 .63/.82? Or would it be better just to get a T4 .68 open? All with intensions of making 700+ AWHP... I'm really going to need this info down the road, once my car is together. Thanks.

Also "Remy" mentioned a T4 .70, did you mean a divided one?