97 GSX Eclipse help, rough idle, and a strange noise.

[Zufelt]

Hi guys, I am a current owner of a 1997 GSX. I bought the car about 2 days ago wanting to learn more about mechanics and tuning. After buying the car 1/4th a mile later code p0300 comes on, random misfire. Unfortunately the guy told me "well you signed the papers" go figure. The idle is rough, and will sometimes bog and die. My other concern is when accelerating concider ably 4-5000rpm I hear a slight metal noise.. Unfortunately I can't explain in detail more than that. The mechanic here seems to think its the injectors. After an oil change today Mobil 1 Synthetic , i smelled something from the engine, but there is no overheating. Im unsure if the teo problems are related. Any help is GREATLY appreciated. The car mods are as listed.

ENGINE
Crowler 272 intake and cams
3" exhaust piping with Megan's racing muffler
Walbro 255L in tank fuel pump
Magnector wires and NGK plugs

Drivetrain
Rebuilt trans by shep racing. (60000 miles ago)
Act 2600 clutch with street disc
Aasco light weight aluminum fly wheel
Stainless steel clutch line

The car has 107k miles on it currently. My question is would aftermarket injectors be the next thing I would need? I don't believe any tuning has been done. I appoligiZe for asking a question my first post, I wasn't planning on having to work on the car till I furthered my knowledge.

 

[Zufelt]

Okay, the X is right on the Cruise control cables. I didn't mean for that to happen, but at least I know what that is now. I was meaning to talk about the one below that for the intercooler.

No, I just took it out and put in a non cruise throttle cable. Really easy. Our cruise controls tend to break easy and cause stuck throttles. While they are easy to fix, I preferred to delete mine completely. If it's not giving you any issues, just leave it alone. You have bigger things to worry about at the moment. Just put it on your list.

Yeah, it's working fine currently just stubborn sometimes. I'm not going to worry about it at the moment as you said I have bigger issues to sort out.

 

[AngelOfPassion]

Okay, the X is right on the Cruise control cables. I didn't mean for that to happen, but at least I know what that is now. I was meaning to talk about the one below that for the intercooler.

DEJON sells intercooler pipes, the upper one is this model #UIP-2gA on this website: DEJON Powerhouse Under the 2nd generation IC piping section. They are pricey though... if you are strapped for cash right now I bet this guy has a stock one, just message him on his FB page here: Miller Import Parts. He always has DSM stuff laying around and can probably get you a stock upper intercooler pipe. I would still say the AFPR is higher priority right now though...

EDIT: The stock UIP is really flexible... you sure you cant just take it off and see if you can work out the kink and see if you can get it back on and move whatever was kinking it up? Or does it seem really damaged? If it's that beat up it may be leaking air which would not help your fuel situation either.

EDIT EDIT: Correction, part number UIP-2gB on DEJON's website looks like it would be better for what you need. (I still think it is spending too much on something you are probably going to replace later anyways. Unless of course you are planning to keep the car close to stock, then this wouldn't be so bad...)

 

[Zufelt]

DEJON sells intercooler pipes, the upper one is this model #UIP-2gA on this website: DEJON Powerhouse Under the 2nd generation IC piping section. They are pricey though... if you are strapped for cash right now I bet this guy has a stock one, just message him on his FB page here: Miller Import Parts. He always has DSM stuff laying around and can probably get you a stock upper intercooler pipe. I would still say the AFPR is higher priority right now though...

EDIT: The stock UIP is really flexible... you sure you cant just take it off and see if you can work out the kink and see if you can get it back on and move whatever was kinking it up?

Most definately, thanks for that site. Other than more air flow why would you ever get the smaller (stock) IC rather than the bigger piping IC?

EDIT: I'm sure I could, is there any benifit of going with a bigger piping other than it being more durable since it's metal? I can work the kink out, just wondering if it's eventually something I would end up upgrading kind of for future knowledge.

 

[AngelOfPassion]

Well, this starts to go into the realm of: What do you want to do with the car..?

If you plan on keeping the stock turbo I would say upgrading to hard intercooler piping is going to be a good idea, might as well do it now while you need the part anyways. (See my double edit above, I listed the wrong part the first time...) The hard piping is going to flow better because of the bends and sleek surface. It may also stay a little cooler too ( no idea if this is true, never tested it.)

BUT, if you plan on upgrading to a bigger turbo you are going to want to switch from that side mount intercooler to a front mount intercooler. This means you are going to replace that piping anyways so it would be pretty much just a waste of money. Your FMIC kit will most likely come with its own hard piping. This is the route I am going currently. So I skipped the piping stage because I know I am getting rid of all that crap anyways.

So yeah. That is the basic part of it. There is a lot more to it but that should do for now...

This is a VERY GOOD READ if you are curious on what you can do performance wise: 2G Upgrade Path 275-300hp
And some more readings:2G Upgrade Paths

 

[Zufelt]

Well, this starts to go into the realm of: What do you want to do with the car..?

If you plan on keeping the stock turbo I would say upgrading to hard intercooler piping is going to be a good idea, might as well do it now while you need the part anyways. (See my double edit above, I listed the wrong part the first time...) The hard piping is going to flow better because of the bends and sleek surface. It may also stay a little cooler too ( no idea if this is true, never tested it.)

BUT, if you plan on upgrading to a bigger turbo you are going to want to switch from that side mount intercooler to a front mount intercooler. This means you are going to replace that piping anyways so it would be pretty much just a waste of money. Your FMIC kit will most likely come with its own hard piping. This is the route I am going currently. So I skipped the piping stage because I know I am getting rid of all that crap anyways.

So yeah. That is the basic part of it. There is a lot more to it but that should do for now...

This is a VERY GOOD READ if you are curious on what you can do performance wise: 2G Upgrade Path

I'll read it all, as I stated I'm still learning BASIC mechanics and now a mixture of both. Anything I can read about my car I do, I would most likely get a FMIC kit just incase I decide to upgrade the turbo later on. If not I'm sure it wouldn't hur tto have that for the stock turbo right? Thanks for all the great answers. I've had and have so many questions but noone to ask them too. Anywho, I will get the FPR here soon and install it.
Edit: Well whoever modded this kind of jumped the gun. Went almost straight to step 10 haha. It's def helpful to know what should be upgraded next. I have more questions to ask but they are off topic from what's being troubleshooted here

 

[AngelOfPassion]

I'll read it all, as I stated I'm still learning BASIC mechanics and now a mixture of both. Anything I can read about my car I do, I would most likely get a FMIC kit just incase I decide to upgrade the turbo later on. If not I'm sure it wouldn't hur tto have that for the stock turbo right? Thanks for all the great answers. I've had and have so many questions but noone to ask them too. Anywho, I will get the FPR here soon and install it.

There is a little bit of a debate on having a FMIC with the T-25 (stock turbo). The debate is that all the extra piping/core of the intercooler is too much for that little guy and will increase lag on the turbo or make the turbo less efficient. In my honest opinion I think having a FMIC on a T-25 is overkill and will make it unnecessarily inefficient compared to what it would be with the SMIC. I would only do it if I was sure I was going to upgrade turbo's. AND you will most likely have to change your piping AGAIN because the T-25 exits at a different angle than most upgraded turbo's. So you are going to buy your piping twice again if you do that.

I have my FMIC sitting on my bedroom floor until I put my Evo III 16G turbo on. I'm not even bothering installing it until I have the turbo in.

There are people that do it though and that may disagree with me. There are also smaller FMIC kits compared to the one I have purchased. So feel free to ask some people that you see with an FMIC with T-25 how they like it. On the home page of any users profile there is a place to look at current mods/parts on the car. You should fill out yours as well as you learn. Here is mine: AngelOfPassion's Profile

Edit: You will see that 95 percent of the previous owners of our vehicles (unless good members here) upgrade our cars completely wrong/out of order. . They can't make it too easy for us right?

 

[Zufelt]

There is a little bit of a debate on having a FMIC with the T-25 (stock turbo). The debate is that all the extra piping/core of the intercooler is too much for that little guy and will increase lag on the turbo or make the turbo less efficient. In my honest opinion I think having a FMIC on a T-25 is overkill and will make it unnecessarily inefficient compared to what it would be with the SMIC. I would only do it if I was sure I was going to upgrade turbo's. AND you will most likely have to change your piping AGAIN because the T-25 exits at a different angle than most upgraded turbo's. So you are going to buy your piping twice again if you do that.

I have my FMIC sitting on my bedroom floor until I put my Evo III 16G turbo on. I'm not even bothering installing it until I have the turbo in.

There are people that do it though and that may disagree with me. There are also smaller FMIC kits compared to the one I have purchased. So feel free to ask some people that you see with an FMIC with T-25 how they like it. On the home page of any users profile there is a place to look at current mods/parts on the car. You should fill out yours as well as you learn. Here is mine: AngelOfPassion's Profile

Edit: You will see that 95 percent of the previous owners of our vehicles (unless good members here) upgrade our cars completely wrong/out of order. . They can't make it too easy for us right?

Yeah, we'll I suppose I would need to think about what route I would want to take. What's a safe PSI on our stock engines? Do you mind if I instant message you? I would rather keep this posting on topic incase someone else has something similar.

 

[AngelOfPassion]

Yeah bro, feel free. I'll reply as soon as I see it/can. Just send me a PM.

 

[undefined0000]

You can run like 25 psi on a stock engine. It's all about getting the right tune. Tuning involves injectors, ecu, fuel pump and afpr essentially. You can adjust those to create what Hp you want. Exhaust and intake are givens. Cams are another good one, they make the car sound amazing too. 350 horse is reasonable to get to without spending 10k to get to like our JDM friends. You'll find out that's what makes DSMs awesome. Buy a car for 2k, spend another 3k and have a heck of a machine. Just carry lots of tools and extra parts.

 

[Zufelt]

Slight update, the mechanical noise coming from the drivers side in the engine bay only happens when actually driving, I can't rev it to 4-6 and get it to make the noise without actually driving. Also when filling up today the gas cap was pretty pressurized made a shhhhh sound after taking it off, not sure if that relates with the aftermarket fuel pump.
It's also more noticeable now happens from 3000 rpms

 

[GofaST4life]

Slight update, the mechanical noise coming from the drivers side in the engine bay only happens when actually driving, I can't rev it to 4-6 and get it to make the noise without actually driving. Also when filling up today the gas cap was pretty pressurized made a shhhhh sound after taking it off, not sure if that relates with the aftermarket fuel pump.
It's also more noticeable now happens from 3000 rpms

Wow. Ok.



That "shhh" sound coming from your gas cap was you being low on fuel. Has nothing to do with your fuel pump. All cars do this to some extent.


IMO (in my opinion) I wouldn't be free revving to 6k or even doing any kind of pulls until your car is running right. But that's just me.

 

[Zufelt]

Wow. Ok.



That "shhh" sound coming from your gas cap was you being low on fuel. Has nothing to do with your fuel pump. All cars do this to some extent.


IMO (in my opinion) I wouldn't be free revving to 6k or even doing any kind of pulls until your car is running right. But that's just me.

I figured about the gas cap. I'm just paranoid at the moment better to be safe than sorry I suppose. But yeah I agree completely. I was just trying to see if I could identify it and describe it better. I will have to find a shop here in Fresno to tell me what's going on. I can't seem to explain it better than I have already. I am gunna go clean up the engine bay maybe I will find something odd, who knows. I am buying a FPR as soon as I have money to see if that helps the idle. Thanks for everyone's help guys, I had one more question. That is should I replace the spark plugs once the FPR is put on? Thanks in advance for any advice.

 

[AngelOfPassion]

After the car is not running so rich I would change the plugs and the oil again. The plugs could be a little fouled and the oil is probably getting contaminated by all the extra fuel coming in.

 

[Zufelt]

After the car is not running so rich I would change the plugs and the oil again. The plugs could be a little fouled and the oil is probably getting contaminated by all the extra fuel coming in.

Suppose I should have waited on the oil change, thanks for the reply Angel, I'll do some research see what kind of plugs would best fit my application.

 

[AngelOfPassion]

I'll save you some time: NGK BPR6ES plugs. After you upgrade your HP some more switch to 7ES.

Link: http://www.extremepsi.com/store/product.php?productid=19240&cat=0&page=1

 

[Zufelt]

Thanks, I appreciate it.

 

[undefined0000]

Thanks, I appreciate it.

Nice to see you're discovering the DSM life. The shhhhh sound from the gas cap scared me too and I only noticed it when low on fuel and I ignore it and I just show my friend that my car farts. Get that AFPR PLEASE. Running that rich is bad in many ways. Gas in oil, wears out piston rings, waste of precious fossil fuel. How bad is your idle exactly? Is it like a carbed engine starting for the first time in a week? The only temp fix would really be to let in some un metered air, but thats still bad because it would mess with boosting and all.

 

[Zufelt]

Nice to see you're discovering the DSM life. The shhhhh sound from the gas cap scared me too and I only noticed it when low on fuel and I ignore it and I just show my friend that my car farts. Get that AFPR PLEASE. Running that rich is bad in many ways. Gas in oil, wears out piston rings, waste of precious fossil fuel. How bad is your idle exactly? Is it like a carbed engine starting for the first time in a week? The only temp fix would really be to let in some un metered air, but thats still bad because it would mess with boosting and all.

The idle is pretty rough.. May have found my problem.. But I'm unsure. I degreased my engine today at the car wash and washed it all off. There was quiet a bit of degreaser. So I'm unsure if this is degreaser or if my head gasket (I think is the proper term) is leaking. Pics below.

First one is good

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Others

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Also.. While looking at me engine bay earlier today (after degrease) I notice this (see pics below) looks a if bolts are missing from the valve cover.

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Any input is appreciated. Sorry if some of this is choppy, I am currently on mobile.

 

[undefined0000]

What color degreaser were you using? Looks like a yellow solution (OIL). Not really sure if a head gasket would let Oil into the spark plug holes. A bad head gasket will let coolant into the cylinders and burn it off. So go to the back of the car and smell for maple syrup (if you can smell it over the rich mixture) The next thing to do would be to do a compression test and see if the radiator bubbles. You could ALSO prop the front end of the car up and drain out some antifreeze and look for oil in that. It would be shiny floating stuff on top of the oil. But I really haven't heard of a head gasket letting oil up that far. The next higher gasket is the valve cover gasket, and you would immediately see if that was bad. Oil would be everywhere.

Also PLEASE PLEASE tell me that you covered your battery and alternator

 

[Zufelt]

What color degreaser were you using? Looks like a yellow solution (OIL). Not really sure if a head gasket would let Oil into the spark plug holes. A bad head gasket will let coolant into the cylinders and burn it off. So go to the back of the car and smell for maple syrup (if you can smell it over the rich mixture) The next thing to do would be to do a compression test and see if the radiator bubbles. You could ALSO prop the front end of the car up and drain out some antifreeze and look for oil in that. It would be shiny floating stuff on top of the oil. But I really haven't heard of a head gasket letting oil up that far. The next higher gasket is the valve cover gasket, and you would immediately see if that was bad. Oil would be everywhere.

Also PLEASE PLEASE tell me that you covered your battery and alternator

That could be the smell I mentioned above then, I will get a compression test, and if the compression isn't good in one cylinder that means? I have a few bolts missing from the Valve Cover, there shown in the last photo, and in one other photo up top. Could this have caused whatever it is to leak into the plugs?

EDIT: I didn't cover them, and later tonight found out I should have, both are fine and it's charging a healthy 14.1v at idle.

 

[undefined0000]

Time for a rebuild. bad compression could come from a worn piston ring. As long as the difference isn't greater than about 5%, then that's fine. Get it done and come back with your results. If you see like 160 162 160 162 for the test, that's fine.

 

[Zufelt]

Time for a rebuild. bad compression could come from a worn piston ring. As long as the difference isn't greater than about 5%, then that's fine. Get it done and come back with your results. If you see like 160 162 160 162 for the test, that's fine.

Just what I wanted to hear.. I'll get it done hopefully tomorrow to make sure that isn't the case. Would that explain the random misfire, and rough idling?

 

[undefined0000]

It could. Best indicator is oil consumption. Oil burns blue, You would see smoke when revving if its bad. You would also use more than a quart per 1000 miles. Using a quart in that amount of time is fairly normal, so please remember to fill your oil.

 

[Zufelt]

It could. Best indicator is oil consumption. Oil burns blue, You would see smoke when revving if its bad. You would also use more than a quart per 1000 miles. Using a quart in that amount of time is fairly normal, so please remember to fill your oil.

Okay, I'll show my mechanic the plugs and ask him to do a compression test. I'll report back here when I have word on the compression of each Cyl. Thanks!

Don't mean to jump the gun here but it is water/degreaser. I created a little tube to suck it out to see how it feels, and it's a water base. If I just suck out all the water/degreaser out of each plug and leave the remainder is it okay to run it and let it evaporate? I will get a compresion test regaurdless tomorrow. Thanks for any info.

 

[Zufelt]

The compression tests came out 160 for all four and 180 on the last compression test. Also, it does NOT have aftermarket cams. Ill be seeing if it does have the Walbro fuel pump as well as other things mentioned. We are gunna change the spark plugs with NGK ones and see how she runs. If its still running poorly we will check for a dirty injector, does this sound like we are on the right track? Any inputs appreciated.