92 talon 2.4 build up with questions.

[ThunderChild]

first off, if this is in the wrong section, i apologize and if it needs to be moved, i would appreciate it mods. thanks.

i recently purchase a 92 talon tsi awd. its in very nice shape, save the front body panels being a lil dingy. it has bent valves from a botch timing belt job (didnt do the BS belt at the same time), so i plan on fixing that and driving the car in stock trim for the time being. it is unmolested and i want to make sure everything works ok before i get crazy with it.

now for the crazy part. ive been doing alot of research on this forum and the internet in general. first thing i did was look up power and drivetrain mods. ive already had a few fast cars, ranging from a built 84 z28 with close to 400whp to an 06 legacy outback XT with around 320whp.

my plan for this car is as follows.

-2.4 liter 6 bolt from a 93 expo mini van
-JE pistons
-eagle rods
-ported cyclone IM
-ported 1g head
-delta regrinds (264's)
-custom FMIC
-2.5" IC piping
-3" GM MAF
-3" turbo back
-either an ACT 2600, 2900 or a PTT twin disc
-welded center diff
-COP conversion
-profec boost controller
-JGS waste gate (if needed)
-Greddy BOV

i will be using megasquirt 2 or 3 (havent decided), running redline fluids for all diffs and tranny, Royal Purple for the motor (after break in) and in general id hope for around 400+ whp. my goal is a fun, reliable daily with some definite balls that will see the drag strip on summer friday nights sometimes.

my questions are aimed at turbo choices mostly. i have the following turbos-

first: the stock 14b, obviously going to be outclassed quickly.
second: a cherry Evo 8 Big 16g 9.8t twin scroll
third: a brand new IHI GM8 RHC61 from a gm diesel (similar to an HX35 and slightly larger than a TO4B)

as you can see by the gist of my mod list, im going for lots of low end tq. i dont want to rev past 7500, nor do i think i will see that very often.

my question is, do i go for the quick spooling, twin-scroll 16g? or go bigger with the GM diesel turbo. both are in equally excellent condition. im not even going to consider the 14b.

the gm turbo would only require a T3 exhaust manifold and external waste gate, and if my calculations are right, full boost would hit around high 3k-low 4k rpms. this turbo is a 350-500hp turbo.

the evo 8 turbo would require an evo manifold and the 180 degree adapter, would spool quickly (almost instantaneously with my setup, id think), still be very efficient and provide great drivability.

i dont want to get a bunch of posts saying "buy this turbo, buy that turbo." i will use one of these two, because i have them already and they were INSANELY good deals, as well as the rest of the parts ive amassed. ive spent at least 5 times what i payed for the car on parts alone, so im not dropping 1k-1500 for a turbo.

id spend less money on the 16g manifold and adapter by about $75 vs the T3 flanged manifold for the gm turbo. im wanting this thing to be reliable, so if i can go with a cast manifold id like too (i can get one for both setups) but i know a tubular will flow better. if i get a cast, i will port it to help. i just hate welding tubulars over and over again.

ill post some pictures soon, i need to get a hosting site or make an album here.

so any help would be appreciated, gimme some opinions. thanks!

 

[Cirus_93TSI]

my main question is which of the 2 turbos is going to allow you to keep your power steering? if your going to put a welded center diff in the car, it will be a struggle to drive without power steering if you plan on driving this on the street. we have a welded center in my buddys 90 gsx without the power steering and you have to fight it every step of the way when turning, the welded diff pulls the steering back toward center when turning because welded center locks the rear and both rear wheels spin at the same speed during turns.
i had a welded center in my 92 laser with the power steering still installed, and aside from the rear inside wheel hopping during low speed turns, it was fine.

 

[2gmummy]

Low end torque, I'd go with the evo 8, but your build seems to contradict a bit the ported 1g head and ported intake mani will flow well together, it will make good power but hurt low end torque. Also with the 264's on a ported head with the 2.4l is going to be really restricting and kill top end power. I'd say go 2g head and stock intake mani with 272s on the evo 8 and relocate power steering. Or keep the ported 1g head and im get 272s or 280s and run the hx-35 like turbo.

Also not trying to be a dick but why are you build a low end torque car and wanting to drag race it? and why megasquirt over dsmlink? I would also look into running brad penn oil over royal purple

 

[ThunderChild]

not too worried about the center diff, and either will still allow me to keep PS. driven a couple with welded diffs around town here and its small beans too me, grew up with big ass trucks with front lockers.

neither one should prevent powersteering from being used.

as for the contradiction in build, the 1g head will allow me to use the cyclone (im already set on using this IM to start) due to port size. ive seen the 2g head flow comparison, its good but not what i have to work with. prices for SHOT 2g heads in my area are insane. if i did find one, i could fill the IM ports with epoxy and port to fit, but id rather not hassle that much with it.

porting the head may be being taken a little to seriously. i wont be enlarging ports, more just a casting flash clean up, light polish and deshrouding. nothing crazy.

i think the cyclone IM has been proven so i wont beat that dead horse anymore. ive read just about every article on it, and its a sold subject to me.

as for why im using MS vs DSMLink. it comes down to the fact that im more familiar with MS and its capabilities vs DSMLink, as well as i can get the MS for cheaper. so thats pretty cut and dry.

and the car will not be a sole drag car, but im going to take it to the track on weekends occasionally for fun. its main duty will be DD, just a fun, surprising DD.

just because it will have more low end tq isnt confining it to never rev or make power a little higher, its all how you set up the tq curve, and id personally like mine to be wide and flat. hence my cam selection too. my freind from orofino originally sold delta the camshaft specs for their regrinds, and has built several dsm's in his day. i told him my plans and he recommended them too me. i trust his judgement solely due to him straightening my previous builds out, without fail. i appreciate the concern though, as i know things can get mixed here, and im not trying to confuse anyone.

im fairly certain the GM RHC61 will provide higher HP numbers, while the evo8 turbo will spool insanely fast and still provide decent power. im thinking a fat tq band to at least 6k. im a big "area under the curve" guy.

i should also mention that ill be using PTE 1000cc injectors (because i got them at a steal). im having them flow tested as we speak.

i guess in the end of it all, if i cant make a decision ill buy the parts for both setups, and run them both to see how they behave. im almost leaning towards the evo turbo just because of the twin scroll. i need to find the full specs on it and a flow map.

the gm flows about 620-640 cfm and i believe will crest 28psi. its just a bit bigger than an 18g. heres a couple forum reads that i got most of my info from. theres flow charts in them as well.

Big turbo, small budget. IHI RHC6 GM 1-8 - Mazda MX6 Forums: MX6 Forum

http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=..._qy6Bg&usg=AFQjCNGYtAlHGgYB8cG3cNiADronWdbqqw

if anyone has links to the evo8 turbo specs/flow maps id greatly appreciate a link or post. im leaning that direction anyway, but like i said, i could just try both. although selling one for some cash right now sounds tempting...

no internet at home right now, so i have to squeeze all this in while im in class, and still pass. cheers

 

[ThunderChild]

so heres the flow maps for the two turbos, im still learning how to read these right...

one is for the evo, the other for the RHC61 (cant find the exact one, but the T04B is VERY close to compressor wheels and turbine specs. its a hair bigger than it actually.) as well as a successive chart for the gm turbos.

...and some pictures of each turbo. both are in very good shape, the gm has less that 2k miles on it, virtually no shaft play. the evo8 turbo has around 80k on it and has virtually no shaft play as well. very surprised, considering i picked them both up for less than $300...