420A 2g na fuel sytem upgrades

[dsmaz]

I have a 95 eclipse 420a and I want to upgrade my fuel system. I have many upgrades already and this one is next on the list. I have high comp pistons bored 50 over. I comp tested and got 260 across. Portnpolished head with stage1 cams and ofcourse intake and full exhaust. Im having problems not getting enough fuel. I noticed I dont have an fmu. Should I get an aftermarket one or oem. And where would I get one oem. Another question I have is would 26lb injectors be to big for my set up because all the charts and stuff ive done on like rcengineering say I should use about 290cc to acheive 200 hp. Any help would be extremely helpful thanx

 

[Fotowntalon]

I highly doubt you are short on fuel unless you have a faulty part in your fuel system. And also WTF are stage 1 cams? Stages are marketing terms that very greatly. Stock fuel system is good to about 180-190 horse power, judging by where you are, I doubt you are close to that, but then again I dont know what the hell you have with your vague description fo your mods. Exhaust measures? What kind of cams? What CR pistons? Full intake, does that mean like a cold air, for did yo do the manifold and throttle body as well?

 

[Bud92gsx]

I had some 420a guy want my old stock 390 injectors..He's going all motor shooting for 200 ish hp..That might be an option for your as well.

 

[necrotopsy]

with high compression, the lack of power you're experiencing is the engine pulling timing because of the knock sensor.

You'll never get any real power out of hi compression 420a without aftermarket tuning which includes timing

 

[Fotowntalon]

Actually just read your profile, I see you have trash cams, I'd rather run used stockers over trusting obx cams numerous reports of them being out of spec, and I am also curious to how you bored the block and gained a .2 litters.. Stock is 121.85 CID (aka 1.997L), if you did bore to .050 over that puts you up to 125.41 CID (aka 2.055L)

Also you have no way to tune your car, are you aware you cant just throw on bigger injects and have everything work perfectly right?

Regardless after all this, here is to answer your question more directly 2GNT.com - How_to_Choose_Fuel_Injectors

 

[clipto]

So along time ago I had a 98 eclipse 420a I was soo excited. I bought a Greddy header, intake, full exhaust man it was rocking. But then I realized it made like 5 extra hp then stock. Not only did I waste like $1000 but it was rather pointless. The parts on the car are more then suitable for any power goal that car can put out. So I stopped trying to make n/a power as it was rather exspensive and useless unless you put alot money in the car then you could make like 200hp. But is it really worth it? A nice 2002 nissan maxima would be a better purchase. I am not saying don't do it your more then welcome too. I did go to a 50 trim turbo kit on the car and it was alot faster. Then the crappy 420a stock motor blew then I built it and then sold it. So hopefully this gives you some insight.

 

[warhurst13]

I remember my 420a....that I blew up 3 weeks ago. they always said sell it and buy a 4g63t....lets say I finally got one haha

 

[dsmaz]

I forgot I had that on my profile I will change that. But I bought the lower end on my car the way it is and he said it was a 2.2 and that was around the time I started my profile cause I didnt know dsm's. Since then I took the block to the machine shop and they said all the machine work was done right. idk the brands or the compression ratio. When I did a compression test the results were 260. I had the machine shop mill the head,and pnp the head and intake manifold. I would rather have a 4g63 but I got the car and motor for a 500 bucks. I couldnt pass it up and I didnt really know about the 420a. I do realize I need a way to tune everything and im ordering a list of parts and I want to order the correct stuff. I know I have obx cams but I got those for a deal also brand new 200. I couldnt pass that up either and plus I have spare oem cams incase I experience misfiring problems but so far no problems.

Im positive(after lots of searching)that my cp ratio is up in the 11 area. There was a guy on here who had 12:1 pistons and pulled a compression test of 270 and thats only 10 lbs higher than me so I have to somewhere around there right? My cams are 242 duration with .355 lift. Heres a list of some more parts in ordering, afx ecu, 190lph fp, adj fpr, 26lb injects, 55mm tb,port im to match, and an innovative wideband and controller. Im pretty sure that should put me around 200 whp does anyone else agree or am I missing something

 

[necrotopsy]

i doubt that'll get you 200 WHP.
200whp is not easy, the record for hp on a NA 420a is only like 216 hp and that engine has a crap ton of money dumped into it.

the af/x ecu will help you a lot though.

might want to invest in some true, custom, long tube headers

 

[Fotowntalon]

I forgot I had that on my profile I will change that. But I bought the lower end on my car the way it is and he said it was a 2.2 and that was around the time I started my profile cause I didnt know dsm's. Since then I took the block to the machine shop and they said all the machine work was done right. idk the brands or the compression ratio. When I did a compression test the results were 260. I had the machine shop mill the head,and pnp the head and intake manifold. I would rather have a 4g63 but I got the car and motor for a 500 bucks. I couldnt pass it up and I didnt really know about the 420a. I do realize I need a way to tune everything and im ordering a list of parts and I want to order the correct stuff. I know I have obx cams but I got those for a deal also brand new 200. I couldnt pass that up either and plus I have spare oem cams incase I experience misfiring problems but so far no problems.

Im positive(after lots of searching)that my cp ratio is up in the 11 area. There was a guy on here who had 12:1 pistons and pulled a compression test of 270 and thats only 10 lbs higher than me so I have to somewhere around there right? My cams are 242 duration with .355 lift. Heres a list of some more parts in ordering, afx ecu, 190lph fp, adj fpr, 26lb injects, 55mm tb,port im to match, and an innovative wideband and controller. Im pretty sure that should put me around 200 whp does anyone else agree or am I missing something

Well i am glad u are willing to learn, get and AFX ECU, and 60mm TB would be a good start. First off compression test and your compression ratio are two completely different things. Also ditch the obx cams, they will cause your more problems than they are worth.

For horsepower wise, let me put it this way, look at my profile, my car only made 150hp to the wheels then when i had it. MB is the record holder is only around 230, and beyond him no one has hit 200hp to the wheels on an NA set up.

 

[dsmaz]

Honestly ill be happy at about 180whp. That should put my hp at the crank somewhere in the 200 range. I think those sound like realistic numbers when im done. Im gonna continue to use the cams I have until they either become faulty or I come across something else for a deal. Ill document my experience since its hard to find anything about people who actually have obx cams stating their experiences. Although one thing im not to sure of is should I get the afxecu or ms. Im not scared to do a wiring job but what would I need to tune my car on ms a laptop or something?

 

[Fotowntalon]

AFX is amazing for plug and play potential, and the use in a street NA application. However if you want to go above and beyond that, squeeze every last horsepower out of it, or even have future plans for power adders, than MS is the way to go.

 

[gusu]

i doubt that'll get you 200 WHP.
200whp is not easy, the record for hp on a NA 420a is only like 216 hp and that engine has a crap ton of money dumped into it.

the af/x ecu will help you a lot though.

might want to invest in some true, custom, long tube headers

I agree.

If you were a master machinist who is probably working for a F1 or WRC team you might be able to make it. Your goal would require not only more compression, but insane porting, tons of math, a freaking sick ass tune, and a MASSIVE bump in RPMs.


The 4AGE motor from the AE86 was only rated around 130hp, for them to bump it too 270ish (Crank) it took raising the rev limit to 12000 rpms, compression, timing, CRAZY porting, and of course balancing. If you are thinking of the one from Initial D it was making 240hp at 11000 RPMs. These motors are also only able to be purchased if you know someone or are part of one of their racing teams. They are dirt cheap at a measly 16,000 dollars.



Interesting fact. The highest HP (Could not find one higher and it was stated as being as such by multiple sources) made on a 4 cylinder motor is a Ford Cosworth that made 416hp at only 11,900 RPMs. Made guy those crazy ass guys who did the badass 4g63t build... the one with the 108mm twin-scroll quad bearing turbo.

 

[Fotowntalon]

at only 11,900 RPMs. .

God Bless 4cylinders

 

[LandSpeed-DSM]

I agree.

If you were a master machinist who is probably working for a F1 or WRC team you might be able to make it. Your goal would require not only more compression, but insane porting, tons of math, a freaking sick ass tune, and a MASSIVE bump in RPMs.


The 4AGE motor from the AE86 was only rated around 130hp, for them to bump it too 270ish (Crank) it took raising the rev limit to 12000 rpms, compression, timing, CRAZY porting, and of course balancing. If you are thinking of the one from Initial D it was making 240hp at 11000 RPMs. These motors are also only able to be purchased if you know someone or are part of one of their racing teams. They are dirt cheap at a measly 16,000 dollars.



Interesting fact. The highest HP (Could not find one higher and it was stated as being as such by multiple sources) made on a 4 cylinder motor is a Ford Cosworth that made 416hp at only 11,900 RPMs. Made guy those crazy ass guys who did the badass 4g63t build... the one with the 108mm twin-scroll quad bearing turbo.

Those guys (Extreme Tuners) were a sham, with no real proof of anything.. and as such were kicked off EvoM for ripping off a couple of members. Half the pictures they posted were not products for a 4G63s. It was shock and awe marketing with nothing substantial behind it.

Go check it out, theres a couple 50+ page threads documenting the meltdown.

I have no doubt they've got a couple motors makin some power, but goofy correction factors and lying seem to be their favorite tools in the shop.

Not to mention that of the couple cars that made it out, several blew up and none ran any times or traps that would back up the power claims. They were basically a money black-hole

 

[dsmaz]

Initial d!!!! I love that show. But anyways hey fotown are you running stock piston compression?

 

[Fotowntalon]

I sold my DSM a few months ago, but at the time, yes I was. Saved up for the rebuild for high comp (10.5 pistons for a 2.2 stroker build) when i found out the wife was pregnant again so switched to a 4 door grocery getter.

 

[dsmaz]

i hate it when its time to get grid of toys but good luck with the kid.

Can I put two step with ms?

 

[Fotowntalon]

i hate it when its time to get grid of toys

My 4 door grocery getter is an 09 wrx =D. As for 2-Stepping, i never officially used MS but there is tons of info on it