2G custom Wilwood rear brake installation questions.

[twicks69]

I am in the process of parting together a better rear brake system for my 1999 GSX.

My current setup is Wilwood 12.2" x 0.81" scalloped front rotors on Wilwood cast aluminum hats with Wilwood Forged Billet Superlite 4-piston calipers on TCE Performance brackets with Wilwood D-pads, and stainless lines. Ther rears consist of stainless lines and EBC Green pads on stock calipers/rotors/e-brake assembly.


I am looking to remove the stock E-brake, and replace it with a hydraulic hand brake (preferably one that can lock so I can utilize it as a parking brake).

The brake setup I am going to be running will revolve around Wilwood scalloped 11.75" x 0.81" rotors, Wilwood Dynalite calipers and Wilwood BP-10 pads with stainless lines.

The two things I will need to still do will be caliper bracketry, and rotor hat sizing to fit the application.

Now....those are my two major questions.... Has anyone ever used 11.75" rotors with a Dynalite caliper, and what did you do for your caliper bracket? As well, what size rotor hat did you use to offset the brake rotor?

Finally, I will need to purchase and install the hydraulic hand brake. Could you give me some information on who has the best hydraulic hand brake for our application? As well, I would like to have it capable of locking for parking-brake usage. How should I do the brake plumbing to install the hand brake?

This application will be used primarily for drag racing, and I will be using the hand brake for launching. I will have my parachute also. This setup is just going together to reduce unsprung mass and provide a better hand brake for launching at track.

FYI, each 12.2" scalloped rotor weighs around 4.8 pounds, and the 11.75" rotor weighs 4.4 pounds!

I appreciate any help that I may get!

Thanks,

 

[Dallas J]

I havent heard of anyone doing hydraulic parking brake setups on DSMs personally, but I have seem them on 240z's. The major problem with them is reliability in holding the pressure. Some people come back to their car with it resting now against what ever decided to stop it cause the hydraulic valve bleeds off pressure over time.

Id suggest checking out hybridz.org to see what those guys are doing now cause theyre upgrading drums to discs and often using smaller front calipers for the rear brakes. So if theirs a good solution these days, they would have it.

 

[twicks69]

Thanks for the info Dallas, I will make some time to research what they are doing on hybridz.org


Anyone else?

 

[TSiAWD666]

Any particular reason you're not going with bolt-on evo rear calipers and rotors?

Edit - err nevermind, I realize it's most likely weight

 

[twicks69]

Yeah, they are heavy heavy heavy. I want to reduce unsprung mass, not increase it.

I will be able to reduce quite a bit of weight with removing the parking brake assembly, heavy caliper, and super heavy rotor assembly/dust shield.

Hell, even my front assembly will be reduced around 10 pounds from last year with a changeup in pads/design, and rotors/hats.

 

[kmv]

Is it ok to delete the e-brake, I don't see it being a safety thing as for saving your life.I use to drove an automatic camry with no ebrake for years with no problem.
I was thinking of doing the same thing using Evo calipers with wilwood 12.19" x .81 rotors with custom hat and maybe using stock front calipers as a ebrake caliper. The hardest part is how to power the second calipers by it self. Hopefully you figure this out for us or delete it and just park your car more carefully.

 

[tma1c]

Yeah, they are heavy heavy heavy. I want to reduce unsprung mass, not increase it.

I will be able to reduce quite a bit of weight with removing the parking brake assembly, heavy caliper, and super heavy rotor assembly/dust shield.

Hell, even my front assembly will be reduced around 10 pounds from last year with a changeup in pads/design, and rotors/hats.

It will save some weight

 

[mike96]

just out of curiosity. any reason in-particular you want/need to use a hydraulic parking brake? i have a friend that uses a pair of the mechanical spot calipers on his car for parking brakes and they work really well, super light (just over a pound each).

http://www.wilwood.com/CaliperList.aspx?subname=Mech Spot

 

[DGajre777]

Not sure if this works for you...
Ksport USA - Performance Suspension

 

[kmv]

just out of curiosity. any reason in-particular you want/need to use a hydraulic parking brake? i have a friend that uses a pair of the mechanical spot calipers on his car for parking brakes and they work really well, super light (just over a pound each).

http://www.wilwood.com/CaliperList.aspx?subname=Mech Spot

just wondering how did your friend put them on. I don't see any mounting bracket avalilble for it.

 

[twicks69]

Not sure if this works for you...
Ksport USA - Performance Suspension

This hydraulic brake was also mentioned in my DSMLink Forums thread. I will look into this one, as well as a staging brake from CNC brakes.

As for the mechanical spot calipers, I could run something like that if I chose to, but it is additional weight, which is what I am trying to reduce.

As well, I am sure he fabbed up his own bracketry to run the spot calipers. I already will have time into fabbing the bracketry IF Todd doesn't have the bracket design already made up. It sounds like he might have one ready to go for my application; I just need to do some measurements for confirmation.

 

[99gst_racer]

I'd recommend the CNC (412 series) staging brake, Tim.
I've sold them to a few DSMers over the years, including Jake Montgomery, and I've never heard a complaint about them.

CNC, Inc. - Hand and Staging Brakes


If you decide to have some caliper brackets made, count me in on a set.

 

[350war]

Check this out if you got the hand brake 99GST suggested this might be an option for a parking brake. hydraulic hand brake tech - DirtyImpreza Forums dont mean to be posting other forums up just thought this could be useful.

 

[twicks69]

I'd recommend the CNC (412 series) staging brake, Tim.
I've sold them to a few DSMers over the years, including Jake Montgomery, and I've never heard a complaint about them.

CNC, Inc. - Hand and Staging Brakes


If you decide to have some caliper brackets made, count me in on a set.

Paul, do you want 11.75" or 12.2" diameter rotors for the rear? I was intending on running 11.75" rotors as they are cheaper, lighter, and are still more than plenty to slow our cars down, while clearing all 15" and 16" rims out there. The 12.2" require a 16" or larger rim.

Thanks for the heads-up on the staging brake also!

 

[gixxerdrew]

Tim, they sell mechanical line locks. Search on pirate 4x4 I have one on my desk I been meaning to put together at some point.

Also why not just get a girodisc (or other) rear evo rotor kit, rear evo calipers. The whole thing is a bolt on affair and then the mechanical line lock (I paid $50 for mine)

 

[kmv]

Tim, they sell mechanical line locks. Search on pirate 4x4 I have one on my desk I been meaning to put together at some point.

Also why not just get a girodisc (or other) rear evo rotor kit, rear evo calipers. The whole thing is a bolt on affair and then the mechanical line lock (I paid $50 for mine)

good idea, would we need 2 line lock to lock our rear wheels?

 

[MIdsm]

Take a look at following hand brake kits as they have a mechanical retention of the hand brake:

Professional Motorsport Parts, Spares & Rally Equipment from Rally Design

One cylinder rear hand brake is usually used with a single circuit for rear brakes . One would have to use master cylinder with threaded fittings for both the reservoir and the brake line. The hand brake master cylinder would be installed in line with the rear brake circuit. The reservoir port would go toward the foot activated master cylinder.

An alternative would be to use two master cylinders, one for each rear circuit.

Summit racing sells line lock kits - once the pressure gets applied to the brakes the solenoid gets engaged with an electrical switch and keeps the pressure in the lines so the brake pedal can be released. The driver can then concentrate on the tree, the clutch and technique. The driver can preload the drive train and instead of moving the brake lever can just release an steering wheel or shft lever mounted electrical switch and be off. One could use two line locks - one for each circuit.

Search Results for line lock - SummitRacing.com

As previously stated the hydraulic systems truly shouldn't be used for parking brakes as they could develop leaks at the most inopportune of times. I would recommend a purely mechanical parking/emergency brake system.

Good luck.

 

[Todd TCE]

I mentioned to Tim that I have a set of brackets for the rear now that fit a 11.75 rotor kit (believe, need to dbl check) but the plates were made for a FWD car only. The bearing package on the AWD is not the same.

Anyone running a FWD car that could use a deal on some mounting brackets/plates??

 

[Todd TCE]

Here are the FWD brackets for the rear. These brackets have a 80mm and 72 bolt spread common only to the FWD trailing arms- measure yours if truly interested.

The brackets are to mount any 3.5" spread caliper such as FSL or NMDP model for fit on a 12.2" rotor. This spec will NOT fit inside a 15" wheel and require 16" or larger. The brackets come with the pressed in 'clinch nuts' to make caliper mounting quick and easy.

This design does NOT retain any of the parking brake system. It replaces the steel plate between the bearing and the trailing arm. The brackets are being offers with no additional parts- no calipers, no rotors and no hats. What you see is what I have to offer.

Anyone wishing to expand on the full build of this package; please contact me at the shop and we can discuss the various options. Cost to complete this package would depend upon caliper of choice, rotor of choice and the hats. A rough guess on all that: $600min. with higher costs for better calipers or rotor types.

For those wishing to do your own thing here's a bargain on a pair of brackets you won't get so easy anywhere else....$75 mails them to your door (USA). You can do the ebay thing and design your own spec needs. Please contact me for PP info.

 

[twicks69]

Todd, thanks for posting these up to help out the FWD guys! I thought you would be able to find a buyer on here after we discussed the details about these brackets.

As for my AWD, I will get around to pulling the rear hubs sometime in the next two weeks, as I have a ton of stuff going on with the Holiday season upon us.

I will keep in touch with you concerning the bolt spacing for the AWD rear hubs and the bearing diameter/axle cup diameter to clear the axle cup.

Later on, and thanks for all the help and great technical information!

 

[LocknessMonster]

Have you looked into "The Brake Man" brakes like stm has on there evo.

001-1167 NEW Rear, Mitsubishi Eclipse/Eagle Talon. F1 calipers. 11.75"x .375" Revolution rotors. #1 compound pads. Brackets and mounting hardware. Stainless steel lines

 

[Todd TCE]

Todd, thanks for posting these up to help out the FWD guys! I thought you would be able to find a buyer on here after we discussed the details about these brackets.

No problem. Just figured that they'd look better on someone's car than my pegboard. And while $75 isn't cheap you'd not produce them for that again I'm sure...so it's a fair deal for anyone looking to shave some weight for a track car! No reason it can't be used for a FWD open track car either- with proper rotor and caliper selection.