With my setup, how big of injectors for 50trim

[jjgrizz73]

Hey everyone, I know theres a few threads on here but Ive seen mixed things. Ive seen 680s are good size and then others saying a 50trim can max out 750s. With my bolt ons, listed in my profile, I pretty much have everything bolt on I can get, what size injectors should I be looking at. Keep the 680s or go to 1000+cc's for now and any future upgrades? Thanks !

 

[2gdanny]

i think the 680'cc will do you just right, what max boost are you trying to run on it?
also if you had dsmlink or aem. i would say just got big to 1000'cc but if you already have 680'cc i say stick with it

 

[jjgrizz73]

Im going to run abour 22-23psi with it with meth injection. I have the evo ecu package that will certainly handle the 1000+cc injectors without a problem, I just dont want to run into a problem. although I can log IDC's and see where about I am with the 680's in the spring. I just want to be safe.

 

[2gdanny]

when you talk about meth that kinda changes the ball game and 22psi, you will be good with 1000'cc, i dont know to much about the evo ecu package, is it like dsmlink?
but ether way your supporting moods and meth are ok for the 1000'cc make sure you tune and do some logs and see where you at.

 

[jjgrizz73]

Sort of ECUflash allows for the same kind of tuning. So Im better off going for a bigger injector to be safe, plus for further upgrades in the future?

 

[2gdanny]

if i was in your shoes thats ### i would, its better to have some left over then to be on point or over run the injectors thats my .02.

 

[jjgrizz73]

Absolutely my thoughts also, I just picked up some 1000's should hold me over for a bit now. Thanks for the help bud

 

[94Jettameowpsst]

If you can run 1000's run them. You'll regret anything less in the future if you upgrade at all.
650s with meth however will also be efficient but in the long run, stay safe rather than sorry.

Now, if you're running 85, 1000's probably wont cut it.

 

[jjgrizz73]

No e85 for me, closest station is on the turnpike about 50miles away For now Im limited to meth and 93 pump which will be sufficient for the 50trim I believe.

 

[crimsondragon]

I run 850ccs on my 50 trim. As others have said 680cc is fine but I played it safe. Also it leaves room for expansion say like a 60 trim...maybe. Or a Holset.

 

[Boosted98gsx]

Get link, get 1000's, call it done.

 

[jjgrizz73]

Well thats the thing, Im going with a holset 35/40 hybrid shortly so I want to not be bothered with upgrading these for awhile.

As for link...not needed Im very satisfied with the way ecuflash is working so I'll save myself some money. And yes 1000's are already purchased

 

[Robertm1212GST]

Im running FIC 850's

 

[turboglenn]

If you're going to run pump gas i would suggest 720's I hadn't maxed them out on my 57 trim yet until i swapped to running E85. They were great for idle, but the 1000's i have now, even though i have a full stand alone and can tune for them as good as any other system, they still don't have that whisper smooth idle that i was able to get on 720's... That is until i put E85 in an raise the idle pulsewidths up enough for the injector to open consistantly and reliably.

No matter what your ECU. MOst injectors don't like to to operate at pulse widths below1.5 - 2ms

EDIT: I just read that you're upgrading to a large frame turbo soon. Go ahead and get the 1000's or even some 1600's with DSM link and go all out on E85

 

[dsm-onster]

Hmmm, my 1000cc injectors idles like the 450s from which I swapped. . . Others report the same. Which brand do you run Glen?

FIC 1000cc, fp2X cams, NGK 7s, 850rpm idle:
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[jjgrizz73]

Heres another question though...Im going back and forth deciding how much I can actually run with the 50trim on a stock block. Only work done is HKS cams, ARP head studs, and cometic HG. I want to run between 22-24, Im trying to get all that I can out of it. Anyone think 24 might be too much or should I be fine with a good tune of course. Im sure me and my buddy can get a great tune and be safe, just if the block can handle it. Its a JDM EvoIII 7 bolt block.

Note: this is with 93 pump and meth injection.

 

[kawboy]

My idle is exactly the same as above with RC 1000cc injectors and FP2 cams

Jeff, I ran FIC 750's and saw up to 80%idc on a rich tune, about 26 psi of boost or better.

That also answers your second question, as I was making that boost on a bonestock 130k mile 99 GSX 7 bolt longblock.

As long as your block/head were surfaced correctly for the MLS gasket (or you copper-sprayed), and the ARP's were torqued correctly (sequence/spec) I don't see you running into any problem with 24lbs.

The EVO3 shortblock is pretty stout and will take 24psi graciously, if of course it's been maintained.

 

[94Jettameowpsst]

My idle is exactly the same as above with RC 1000cc injectors and FP2 cams

Jeff, I ran FIC 750's and saw up to 80%idc on a rich tune, about 26 psi of boost or better.

That also answers your second question, as I was making that boost on a bonestock 130k mile 99 GSX 7 bolt longblock.

As long as your block/head were surfaced correctly for the MLS gasket (or you copper-sprayed), and the ARP's were torqued correctly (sequence/spec) I don't see you running into any problem with 24lbs.

The EVO3 shortblock is pretty stout and will take 24psi graciously, if of course it's been maintained.

< 28psi, stock everything ftw! haha
well, i have a leak in my hg now due to a misfire but you get the poing, the 4g is stout to say the least in stock form.

 

[dsm-onster]

Chicken $h!t. I ran 32psi with a 60-1 with the stock bottem end 6bolt

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Just messing wit you guys.

Back on topic. I agree with the above. You can run that boost. . . But it's not really about boost. Its about how much you make of the boost. How much flow you ahve for the boost. I suggest sticking with a HP goal. The 7bolt is good for 450whp after that, things get shady. Yes, this is somewhat close to the limit of the 50-trim for the typical tuner.

 

[jjgrizz73]

Well I do understand that, the typical 50 trim setup flows the most around 23-24psi which is right around where I want to be(according to some of the flow charts I have read). I am looking on meth to try and make 450-470whp with it and should be possible with the setup I have. This also is pushing the block true, hopefully it holds up but I do have a 4g64 block waiting to be used also in case of emergency.

Reason Im worried about it is because its my DD so having it running throughout the summer is a big asset for me. But I also want to make the most of the car, Im not afraid to push it either.

 

[soldave]

I'm using 750cc injectors on my T04B 50-trim and with a 75% meth content injection system am peaking at about 74% duty cycle. Expecting without the meth it would be 85-90ish.

 

[turboglenn]

Hmmm, my 1000cc injectors idles like the 450s from which I swapped. . . Others report the same. Which brand do you run Glen?

FIC 1000cc, fp2X cams, NGK 7s, 850rpm idle:
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deit is in caps below
I cna get an ALMOST idle that smooth out of my 1k's, the slight cariation in tone/RPM i what i was talking about with the 1k's comapred to the 720's. With the 720's i could get it to just hold perfectly at 800 RPM and never sputter or fluctutate unless the lights or AC/defrost was on and then it would vary with alternator load and the lo0ad from the AC compressor.

I found out my idle problem was some where else (leak in the intake) and has since ben solved... SOrry if i mis-informed, but i honestly still don't get as good of an idle on them as i do smaller injectors.... It's a proven fact thatinjectors don't like small pulsewidths and as long as i can keep them in the 1.08 - 1.10 at idle it will do perfect at 1000RPM.. it's when i have to lower the RPM to 800 and decrease vacum with the cams that i get trouble with the small openings of .80 to .91ms

 

[jjgrizz73]

well even though this is old, I figured I'd update to inform some people for future reference:
I dropped my 680's in (havent replaced them with my 1000's yet) with my 50 trim setup. I am running about 12-13psi right now doing base tunes before turning it up and I'm running 84% IDC on that amount of boost. Most likely will never handle the 25psi I plan to run. So if you have the means to tune bigger injectors, even with a 50trim I say go for it and dont waste your time with small injectors.

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