What is this?!? under the battery tray 1g AWD

[ECLIPSE95]

I am pulling my motor out of my TSI AWD and I am getting really close to getting it pulled out..to make some more room I removed my ABS hydralic and took out the battery tray and I notice some lines comming out of a can shape thing that has a line running to where the intake used to be and a couple of other smaller lines running around the engine..what is this for?..is this somthing that can be removed? because I have seen pics of engine bays without those lines that run up to the throttle body and they have them blocked off and i was just wondering if I can do the same thing, and what else I can remove that isnt needed..Thanks ~Dustin

 

[loweperf]

Sounds like the charcoal canister. It's part of the evap system that holds the fuel vapors and it can be removed unless you have to go through an emission inspection!

 

[ECLIPSE95]

nice..so I could just plug the lines and leave the charcoal canister on just in case I need to hook it up again..so what about those lines comming off the throttle body..how come I have seen pics of ppl blocking those and they dont have a mess of lines everywhere like I have..because I am sure I am going to have a hard time hooking them up when my engine comes back from the machiene shop

 

[Perch - Tsi]

EGR vac lines, not gonna help or hinder you,
leave em on and keep it green...

 

[97GS-TSpyder]

http://www.taboospeedshop.com/emissions.htm
or
http://www.taboospeedshop.com/emissions1.htm

1g, 2g respectively

 

[ECLIPSE95]

thanks that helps out alot..because most of those lines are unplugged and is going to be a hassle to connect them up again..~Dustin

 

[1gcrazy]

So, I found this cylinder under my battery tray. I'm not sure what it is. I've been parting the car out and the chassis is being picked up tomorrow at noon and I need to know if i should grab this thin before it gets hauled off?

 

[kottyking]

It's for emmissions.

 

[spoolup]

Charcoal canister. Most new emmissions stuff is expensive, however most DSMers I know do not have these in their cars, along everything else emissions related. Since the hoses that run to them are just another place a boost leak may occur, ect.

Oh and http://www.smogtips.com/charcoal.cfm just to give you some idea on how its used.

 

[ZiggysDSM]

its your evap canister you dont need it, just take it out. no dont really but you dont need it

 

[1glaserturbo]

Charcoal canister, don't need it! I passed emissions w/o it, so you can probably too unless your car is insanely messed up






Chris

 

[VelocitàPaola]

It isn't just used for emissions... Your gas mileage will suffer horribly if you take it out.

 

[1gcrazy]

It isn't just used for emissions... Your gas mileage will suffer horribly if you take it out.

How so? Whats it do? What makes it mess with the gas mileage?

 

[VelocitàPaola]

It recovers vapors from your gas tank and injects them into the throttle body. Without it, you'll lose the fuel you could be burning to evaporation.

Technically, it's only an "emissions" component because it prevents those gasoline vapors from getting into the atmosphere. However, it was designed just as much for fuel economy as it was for emissions reasons.

 

[boostedinaz]

It isn't just used for emissions... Your gas mileage will suffer horribly if you take it out.

Mine is gone and I get good milage if I stay out of it. Care to explain.

 

[VelocitàPaola]

Mine is gone and I get good milage if I stay out of it. Care to explain.

(see previous post)

Maybe it's less noticeable to factory turbo cars - you guys don't have very good gas mileage to begin with.

 

[92awddsm]

(see previous post)

Maybe it's less noticeable to factory turbo cars - you guys don't have very good gas mileage to begin with.

My fuel milage didnt change a bit when I removed the charcoal canister, egr, anf fp regulator solenoid. I have never even heard of anyone with a n/t losing fuel mileage after removing it either. I guess that blows your theory all to hell, huh?

Leave it on the car so it can be scrapped with the chassis. Thats all it is good for, considering it is probably really old and not functioning anyway. As stated, it is a charcoal canister and they function the same way as a charcoal filter in an aquarium. They get "used up" eventually and no longer function like intended.

 

[boostedinaz]

My fuel milage didnt change a bit when I removed the charcoal canister, egr, anf fp regulator solenoid. I have never even heard of anyone with a n/t losing fuel mileage after removing it either.

Same here. Huh.

 

[VelocitàPaola]

My fuel milage didnt change a bit when I removed the charcoal canister, egr, anf fp regulator solenoid. I have never even heard of anyone with a n/t losing fuel mileage after removing it either. I guess that blows your theory all to hell, huh?

No... not really. I've experienced the effects of this on more cars than one.

Although, you were right about the charcoal getting "used up" - that could explain why your older cars (going on fourteen years now?) don't experience these effects as much.

 

[CanadianTSi]

If you really think that some fumes will significantly increase your gas mileage...you need to give your head a shake...

 

[VelocitàPaola]

Wow, I can't believe that this is sparking such debate. It's true though; I'm not making this stuff up. Gasoline is a highly volatile substance, mostly because of the various additives.

When I worked for Environmental Health and Services up here in Boston, I actually had to calculate the figures for this. Even with the EVAP system in place, something like 20% of all hydrocarbon emissions are from evaporative sources.

Octane by itself (one of the main constituents of gasoline) evaporates at a rate of 1.4 (where BuAc is 1.0). Hexane is 9.0, and n-butane is 114.0; both are other major components of gasoline. For the record, an evaporation rate of anything greater than about 0.8 is considered high.

As you can see, if left alone, gasoline, being nearly 100% volatiles, will evaporate in no time. The EVAP system catches stray vapors and recirculates them into the intake to prevent this loss.

As I said though, with older cars, the canister may not be functioning as efficiently as it once did; hence, the negligible differences.

 

[1gcrazy]

No... not really. I've experienced the effects of this on more cars than one.

Although, you were right about the charcoal getting "used up" - that could explain why your older cars (going on fourteen years now?) don't experience these effects as much.

Ya know to be honest, i believe him. If it's SUPPOSED to increase mileage and it doesn't hurt performance then why not leave it in? Maybe even put a new one in. If you get better mileage then badass but if mileage suffers or stays the same then we can graciously say i told you so and mark him as full of it. It's simple. Instead of argueing about it why not try something new to move this extremely addictive hobby forward instead of denying a dead theory and staying idle?
We dont have to understand it...yet, just test it.
Just my .02

 

[boostedinaz]

Wow, I can't believe that this is sparking such debate. It's true though; I'm not making this stuff up. Gasoline is a highly volatile substance, mostly because of the various additives.

When I worked for Environmental Health and Services up here in Boston, I actually had to calculate the figures for this. Even with the EVAP system in place, something like 20% of all hydrocarbon emissions are from evaporative sources.

Octane by itself (one of the main constituents of gasoline) evaporates at a rate of 1.4 (where BuAc is 1.0). Hexane is 9.0, and n-butane is 114.0; both are other major components of gasoline. For the record, an evaporation rate of anything greater than about 0.8 is considered high.

As you can see, if left alone, gasoline, being nearly 100% volatiles, will evaporate in no time. The EVAP system catches stray vapors and recirculates them into the intake to prevent this loss.

As I said though, with older cars, the canister may not be functioning as efficiently as it once did; hence, the negligible differences.

It appears you have a good amount of info on this subject. Could you let us know how much gas evaporates from our tanks say in a week through a 10mm hose? This would be a good indicator of how much you feel we are losing.

 

[VelocitàPaola]

It appears you have a good amount of info on this subject. Could you let us know how much gas evaporates from our tanks say in a week through a 10mm hose? This would be a good indicator of how much you feel we are losing.

That's almost impossible to answer because of all of the variables involved with evaporation rates (fuel composition, temperature, etc.); which happens to be the main reason why evaporation rates are given as ratios compared to butyl acetate.

In order to answer your question specific to automobiles, you would also have to factor in how much gasoline is in the tank, how often the car is driven, and how efficiently the EVAP system is working, among others.

Given a sealed tank, however, at about 37*C, with a 10mm hole, I would estimate that much more than half of the contents could evaporate in a week's time. Obviously, you aren't losing 6-8 gallons of gasoline in a week because of the various gas saving design elements incorporated into the car; but it gives you an idea of how quickly gasoline can really evaporate.


I was rummaging through the tech articles earlier today when I found one written by Doug99RS on the EVAP system. The final line is this:

While many people see this system as a headache and troublesome, not only does it help prevent pollution, but it also helps prevent a full tank of gas from evaporating while the car is parked.

 

[92awddsm]

That's almost impossible to answer because of all of the variables involved with evaporation rates (fuel composition, temperature, etc.); which happens to be the main reason why evaporation rates are given as ratios compared to butyl acetate.

In order to answer your question specific to automobiles, you would also have to factor in how much gasoline is in the tank, how often the car is driven, and how efficiently the EVAP system is working, among others.

Given a sealed tank, however, at about 37*C, with a 10mm hole, I would estimate that much more than half of the contents could evaporate in a week's time. Obviously, you aren't losing 6-8 gallons of gasoline in a week because of the various gas saving design elements incorporated into the car; but it gives you an idea of how quickly gasoline can really evaporate.


I was rummaging through the tech articles earlier today when I found one written by Doug99RS on the EVAP system. The final line is this:

Im not trying to argue with you but at the same time, I put 5 gallons of race gas in my car in october. Well, I made 2 passes on the race gas and it stayed parked afterwards until febuary of this year. When restarted, I still had 1/4 tank(same as when parked) and I drained the tank and removed approx 4 gallons. If I put 5 gallons in on an empty tank, made 2 full 1/4 mile passes, and let it sit, I should have less than 2 gallons according to your formula. What you say looks good on paper but has no real world effect. A 1g dsm works on a vacuum style evap system. The fuel tank has to reach a set amount of vaccum(set according to the check valve located in the fuel tank vent line) befor it begins to pull fresh air into the tank. All the evap canister does is filter the fresh air released in to the tank. It is not a vent for the tank so no fuel or vapors can be released. The vapor release is built into the stock filler cap so the evap system has nothing to do with it. Maybe some cars are built the same as you theory states but a 1g dsm is not.