Vacuum Pumps

[MNGSX]

6 to 8" is a big help

15-16" is like a dry sump and gas ported pistons...

 

[Coup D E'Tat]

Alright, I can get my hands on two if I call the guy.

I just need a few more answers. Do these work the way they have been described? Other (well respected) people don't seem to think so, but again, so many people are running them that it seems probable to help in my case, at least until I can get some money together for a rebuild.

However, he may be thinking something else is causing my blowby (out of round bore, etc.) as I can't give a specific reason because I don't know myself.

Now, if I set this up, I would run a line from my straight-fitting PCV to the vac pump, and then to a catch can. I would also run my breather tube to the same catch can. Any problems with this?

Again, I do apologize for all of (somewhat repetative) questions.

 

[beat90tsi]

Which vac pump(s) did you decide on and where did you get it/them?

 

[Coup D E'Tat]

One, possibly two, LT1 pumps, sourced through a local. Again though, I haven't fully decided.

PM sent.

 

[CarTunr22]

I tried this on my Formula Atlantic engine to see if there was any gain on the dyno, but found none. The crankcase vent line coming from the center of the valve cover was routed to the scavenge side of the dry sump pump, just like you see the Nascar guys doing, but we got nothing. This is a 12.7:1 normally aspirated Toyota 1.6 liter 4age engine, which is turned to 10,500 for road racing, and makes 250+ hp.
http://home.earthlink.net/~rps1976/Images/Formula Atlantic/Valve Cover Rear View.jpg

Not to beat on a dead horse or anyhting but like it was already stated a drysump already created the amount of vacume needed so if you orriginaly had 3 scavange lines for the oil why would you take one and put it in the valve cover? It just seems like you are basicly trying to suck 1/3 of your scavange'd oil out of your valve cover which seems silly

 

[Suparata]

Do you really want vacuum in a wet sump crankcase?

 

[MNGSX]

Sportsman V8's are a little different than a 4g63...

The 4g63 pump and oil system are very capable provided they are in good condition.

There are many differences oil squiters and things like the oil passages on a scat H beam. We dont have to rely on splash lube for the upper recip because we have spray lube..

He makes some good points like recomending an accusump.. However on a engine with a good oil system and the relief valve and or pulley ratio set sensibly you wont be starving the oil pickup...

 

[Coup D E'Tat]

Set it up, and one LS1 pump keeps my dipstick at bay.

Question, though. It's wired right to the battery, through an inline fuse, to a switch. The switch is grounded, and the pump is grounded. The third prong on the switch goes to the power wire of the pump.

Now, it ran great for a little while when I flipped it on for testing (3rd gear pulls.) After a little while, the fuse blew. I'm assuming it's getting too much juice, so what should I do here in terms of wiring?

Thanks,

Edit : Switch and fuse were both 20A, just for clarification.

 

[Dauntless]

Not to beat on a dead horse or anyhting but like it was already stated a drysump already created the amount of vacume needed so if you orriginaly had 3 scavange lines for the oil why would you take one and put it in the valve cover? It just seems like you are basicly trying to suck 1/3 of your scavange'd oil out of your valve cover which seems silly

It's not a silly thing (or question) at all. The drain-back holes on this engine's head are sealed to prevent oil falling down onto the crankchaft, so I must use a scavenge line to recycle the oil out of the head.

 

[spshocker61]

Ok...just finished reading all 4 pages and i must say, this thread has a LOT of good info in it. Threads like this need to be copied or something into a subject that contains Q&A type threads where more experienced tuners have educated us...or at times maybe been educated by other experienced tuners

As far as my intrest in this subject:

I understand that it may be necessary to run 2 pumps if you choose the LT1 setup. Now what I was wondering is if i decide to go with the electric 24V EVP ( here: http://www.starvacuumpumps.com/viewPart.php?id=STR.04.06.000)...will one do the trick I assume? Thanks....and also...what about the combination of a vacuum pump and an accusump? Just thought maybe this would provide the most reliable setup. Or is our oil system really good enough to take AWD launches from a 600hp engine? I guess I've just come to the conclusion that one of my main focuses on my 2.4 hybrid build is going to be the oil delivery system....I've read to many threads about guys hitting 4k miles on their new rebuild/build and spinning a bearing, etc.

Thanks for humoring me

 

[Kevin Johnson]

It is likely that you are drawing oil through the line. Pumping fluids is a far greater strain than pumping gases and if this is a vacuum pump that was never intended to draw fluids that may be why the pump is overloading and then blowing the fuse.

That's an educated guess.

Set it up, and one LS1 pump keeps my dipstick at bay.

Question, though. It's wired right to the battery, through an inline fuse, to a switch. The switch is grounded, and the pump is grounded. The third prong on the switch goes to the power wire of the pump.

Now, it ran great for a little while when I flipped it on for testing (3rd gear pulls.) After a little while, the fuse blew. I'm assuming it's getting too much juice, so what should I do here in terms of wiring?

Thanks,

Edit : Switch and fuse were both 20A, just for clarification.

 

[Coup D E'Tat]

Kevin,

opened up my catch can, and there was almost no oil in it, so I doubt I pulled much out.

Someone else suggested to take the ground off of the switch. Did that, took the car out, flipped the switch and almost immediately blew the fuse.

I guess I should tap into something else. Any suggestions?

 

[Kevin Johnson]

Well, that is good news in one way -- you aren't drawing vacuum from an area of the engine that is being flooded with liquid oil.

To be safe, I would remove the pump from the car and do further testing with it completely isolated. If you have a short in the circuit you do not want to start a fire under the hood.

Does the case of the pump give its power requirements? It could be that the voltage is wrong or the fuse is too small or the size of the wire supplying the power is too small. If you cannot see anything and know the manufacturer give them a call and find out. Usually the tech people don't mind answering strange questions like that if you can reach them directly.

I did not catch if you said it is a new or used part. Both can have above average failure rates. I remember taking a project car out with a brand new electric fuel pump. It started failing about 15 miles away from home. How wonderful.

Kevin,

opened up my catch can, and there was almost no oil in it, so I doubt I pulled much out.

Someone else suggested to take the ground off of the switch. Did that, took the car out, flipped the switch and almost immediately blew the fuse.

I guess I should tap into something else. Any suggestions?

 

[Bostedquest]

well, it seemd I got some rep points for my postings in here, so it got my interest back into it.

If you are thinking you will ever get a true vacuum in the crank case, your wrong. Actually, no, you could, but you would be drawing in air through the valve cover, which is pointless.

The thing is, your not looking to create a real vacuum, your just tring to remove excess pressure, nothing more.
You do not need 5 gabillion vacuum pumps, you just need to realize that you only truely need enough vacuum to negate the pressure that your crankcase sees.

Now I have read some of the new posts, and they are speaking and talking about a relief valve. You already have one... the two ports on the valve cover. In this usage they would be benifitial with all the baffling they have. The baffling creates a slower entrance and acts like a regulator kinda. Though you would want some sort of filter on the now inlets.

Now as far as where to actually hook the vacuum pump up to, the closer to the source the better. If you feel like running it through the valve cover do that. It most certainly would be much easier.

now, the LT1 pump has already been mentioned...
I know the 80's GM diesel cars also had them.


To coupe's blowing fuse...
what amp is the pump rated at? that is the minimum fuse you should use.
Or run it through a relay system.
Can you post a link to what pump you are using...

 

[Coup D E'Tat]

Boosted,

I ripped the pump out. I was tired of the hassle. I ended up welding two nipples into my intake and running the PCV and side breather into it with catch cans in the middle. No problems since.

I sold the one to beat90tsi, and the other is sitting in my garage if anyone wants it. I just didn't feel it was necessary for me to have it in. I'm not sure if he got his setup properly or not, as I haven't heard back from him. However, a lot of other people do this and get it to work. Maybe I'm just an idiot

It's an LS1 pump, by the way.

Later,

Jesse

 

[90laserRSfwd]

Fast forward almost 11 years... For guys looking for a simpler kit, GZ Motorsports has a "bolt on" kit. I found this thread via searching, and figured I'd update it for others looking for newer information. If you don't know why you would run a vacuum pump, you should ask google.

http://www.gzmotorsports.com/4G63T-vacuum-pump-kit.html

 

[Operate]

http://www.ebay.com/itm/221653507805?_trksid=p2055119.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK:MEBIDX:IT

 

[90laserRSfwd]

http://www.ebay.com/itm/221653507805?_trksid=p2055119.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK:MEBIDX:IT

That's been on eBay for a while. The reason I purposely didn't link to it is because it's missing parts. Saving money isn't worth it when you have to spend time hunting down the rest of the parts and ends up costing you more in the end