Tein Basics: Need Help W/ Ride Height!!!!

[ILLiCliPSE]

Hey guys..

I installed my Tein Basic coilovers on my 2g GS. It looks great, but it could be a little lower.

Today I jacked the car up, and went for it. I started on the drivers side front coilover. I moved the two pieces that you set the right height with DOWN.....it didnt make a difference at all. I moved it up past where it was originally, and it went up more than it was. Makes sense. But the problem is, I lowered the it down more, thinking it would lower the car more... but its not lowering any more! its the exact height as the other side, but the drivers side is set lower, but its the same height as the other side! Is this as low as the Tein basics go? Or am I a complete idiot?

as you can see here, the threads below the coilovers spring seats are different, yet the ride height is the same....

DRIVER SIDE AFTER ATTEMPT TO LOWER:

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PASSENGER SIDE (NOT TOUCHED AT ALL):

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Thanks
Brian

 

[jtmcinder]

Normally, you set one end of the car at a time, not one corner. The reason is that lowering one corner can cause weight to shift without changing how the car sits. But that usually only happens at one of the light corners. So, usually, on a DSM, dropping one front corner will cause the car to sit differently. Which brings us to the second theory: you're sitting on the bumpstop. But this should be obvious, either visually or from the extremely lousy ride. Can you rule this out?

- Jtoby

 

[ILLiCliPSE]

Normally, you set one end of the car at a time, not one corner. The reason is that lowering one corner can cause weight to shift without changing how the car sits. But that usually only happens at one of the light corners. So, usually, on a DSM, dropping one front corner will cause the car to sit differently. Which brings us to the second theory: you're sitting on the bumpstop. But this should be obvious, either visually or from the extremely lousy ride. Can you rule this out?

- Jtoby

The ride is perfect. Whats got me wierded out is the two front coilovers were set at the exact same height. I went to lower them today; started on the front drivers side. Lowered it...It didnt work. Now the drivers side front coilover is set to be lower, but the wheel gap is the same on either side. Is it ok to break the coilovers in like this? Will the springs eventually settle in?

 

[ILLiCliPSE]

UPDATE:

I just set the passenger side coilover to the same settings on the drivers side so they would break in evenly. The passenger side is a LITTLE lower than the drivers side, but not visually noticably. I guess I didnt realise that I need to wait for the springs to settle...Ive had them in the car for 3-4 days. Anything else I need to worry/ watch out for?

 

[jtmcinder]

As I wrote privately, Teins are not crap, so there's no settling to wait for. If you are not on the bumpstops, something strange is going on.

- Jtoby

 

[wret]

Just a couple observations:
1. Your ride height already looks pretty low. How low are you trying to go.
2. From your photos it appears that your perches are within 2-3mm of each other left to right and you still have a significant amount of threads left underneath.

Unless, as jtoby suggested, you are sitting on your bump stops, a spring perch change of x makes a ride height change of around 0.5x, depending the starting percentage of weight on the particular corner and a few other factors. Is possible that your incremental changes are too small to be detected by your ride height measurement technique?

 

[jtmcinder]

a spring perch change of x makes a ride height change of around 0.5x

Oh, my, Ron. That's just nuts. (If I were fair, you'd get some neg rep for that one.) 2Gs have a front motion ratio of .72, which means that a change in perch height of X makes a ride height change of 1.39X.

- Jtoby

 

[suicidal2af]

Just a couple observations:
1. Your ride height already looks pretty low. How low are you trying to go.
2. From your photos it appears that your perches are within 2-3mm of each other left to right and you still have a significant amount of threads left underneath.

Unless, as jtoby suggested, you are sitting on your bump stops, a spring perch change of x makes a ride height change of around 0.5x, depending the starting percentage of weight on the particular corner and a few other factors. Is possible that your incremental changes are too small to be detected by your ride height measurement technique?

I counted 5 threads remaining on both sides. Not sure about Teins, but I do know that GC's lower the car ~1/8" per thread. So then logically, you would have about 5/8" left to go if Tein Basics are in fact the same.

That said, if you are on uncut bumpstops, you're low enough to be sitting on them. I'd check them.

 

[wret]

Oh, my, Ron. That's just nuts. (If I were fair, you'd get some neg rep for that one.) 2Gs have a front motion ratio of .72, which means that a change in perch height of X makes a ride height change of 1.39X.

- Jtoby

While this would be true if all the weight of the vehicle were riding on the one wheel, when four sprung wheels share the weight, and the spring perch is lowered on one, the ride height goes down on that wheel, the one behind it, and the corresponding wheel on the opposite side. The opposite corner goes up. Likewise, the weight resting on the adjusted wheel decreases, as does the weight on the opposite corner, while the other two increase.

And as I said, the corresponding change in ride height to a change in perch height will be somewhere around half (or maybe half of 1.39, the difference of which is covered by “around”).

 

[jtmcinder]

OK, now I see what you're saying, but it's still going to be much more than half of 1.39. First, there is a heck of lot more weight on a front wheel than a rear (950 vs 600 on my car). Second, unless we're talking about a car set up for drag racing (or to be loose as all heck), the front wheel-rate is higher than the rear wheel rate (375 vs 350 on my car). What these mean is that adjusting a front perch will have almost all of the calculated effect on ride height, while adjusting a rear perch will often have little effect. This is why, when you balance or level a car, you first set the front end and then match it in the rear. You can spend all day tweaking the rears and not change the side-to-side (or corner-to-corner) stance much at all.

Also, be sure to disconnect the swaybars while doing all this. Better yet, loosen the mounts for the leveling process and then, when you done, retighten them with the car on the ground. You will probably find that the small slots in the brackets are sufficient to eliminate preload. After going through the hassle of making some adjustable endlinks, I found that the slots were enough and went back to OE endlinks.

If you are dreadfully serious, then do all of this with weight in the driver's seat. Even with decent springrates, it makes a small but non-zero difference.

- Jtoby

 

[wret]

Not to belabor the point but when the front:back spring ratio is similar to the weight ratio, a change in perch height on either end will have a similar effect. This doesn't help much in the real world when all the calculations pretty much go by the wayside and trial and error (mostly error) take over.

And how the heck do you tighten your swaybar brackets with the car on the ground.

 

[jtmcinder]

Also trying to move on, but it's not the spring ratio that matters; it's the ratio of wheel rates.

Rear is easy; it's right there. For the front: a) oil-change pit or b) drop car onto four cinder blocks and crawl under when the wife isn't looking. Guess which route I took.

- Jtoby