Starting problem (Videos Included)

[way2slowtalon]

Car will not start when cold. Any ideas? New Battery (optima red top), new fuel filter, new starter (bosch) so far.




COLD START:

IMG_0538.MOV - YouTube


WARM START:

IMG_0540.MOV - YouTube

 

[Boost_freak_87]

How cold does it get out there? Sounds to me like your battery might need replacing. Also, is this your DD or weekend cruiser?

 

[way2slowtalon]

How cold does it get out there? Sounds to me like your battery might need replacing. Also, is this your DD or weekend cruiser?

Daily driver, when I took this it was maybe 25F. Brand new (1 day old) Optima battery, also used other batteries and same issue.

How about the coolant temp sensor, is that in good shape.

Will check this tonight. Didn't think about that even

 

[way2slowtalon]

Coolant temp sensor is good. Anyother suggestions?

 

[OakStreetTuner]

It sounds to be cranking a little slow, possible that the starter drive is hanging up against the flywheel giving you the extended crank/no start

 

[CrawlinZX14]

Im also in the starter area myself. It could be a wiring issue from your IGN not allowing enough voltage to trigger the solnoid correctly. Try taking the trigger line off, and connect it to a 30A relay. Then run a hot line from your battery directly to the relay and the output from the relay to the IGN line you removed. Then ground the relay and try cranking. If there is no problem then its wiring. If it still has the problem, you likely have an issue in your wiring from the battery to the starter.

Check the ohms from the battery to the starter. Obviously Disconnect the battery before doing this. If you discover a lot of resistance you may need to replace a deteriorated wire. Check the resistance in the big (thick main power wire) to the starter from its origin.

I would start in the starter area tho. Looks like you have a sever drain during ign. If its manual, try bump starting it without the starter. If it fires immediately, its in the starter, and start looking in the area's I suggested.

 

[Lofty]

Doesnt sound starter or battery related to be honest. ANY starter will get overwhelmed if you crank it for that period of time. Sounds like a fuel issue to me. Id check your filter, pump and maybe solenoids and vac lines. I dont know what fuel related solenoids they have in a 2g but its definately fuel or sensor related. Dont understand why everyone is saying starter when it cranks fine and it even fired and died out. A starter wont make the car die out like yours did.

Just saw you did the filter. It definately seems the engine is lacking fuel.

 

[CrawlinZX14]

Doesnt sound starter or battery related to be honest. ANY starter will get overwhelmed if you crank it for that period of time. Sounds like a fuel issue to me. Id check your filter, pump and maybe solenoids and vac lines. I dont know what fuel related solenoids they have in a 2g but its definately fuel or sensor related. Dont understand why everyone is saying starter when it cranks fine and it even fired and died out. A starter wont make the car die out like yours did.

Just saw you did the filter. It definately seems the engine is lacking fuel.

the problem I see with your thought is that its not as bad once warm. Which means once started she runs. And if he is jumping the car to get it to fire, then its electrical and not fuel. As I said, i think he has far to much of a draw on the starter and its overwhelming the system. And if there is a massive draw on the starter, it will effect the fueling system as the power is draining and not powering the pump properly until it actually fires. Unless being charged by an outside source like a running vehicle or a battery booster. Just my .02

 

[way2slowtalon]

Thank you for suggestions been busy with work so still need to try all things listed. I have noticed my starter ACC wire (small wire) is half a Volt less than battery terminal.

Does this function as an on off/switch or correct voltage needed and bases that on turning rotation speed?

 

[DeadlyScone]

well as lofty said it seems to me like its not getting enough fuel or maybe too much fuel. does your car when it runs below normal operating temp seen to hesitate when accelerating or sporadic idle when cold/hot, fuel cut, miss, ect...?

EDIT: are you getting good spark also? check your plugs make sure they are not fouled.

 

[way2slowtalon]

Brand New plugs and wires. Car was automatic turned into 5spd.

B&m adjustable fuel pressure regulator (reading 40psi when trying to start,gauge on top fuel filter)

DsmLink v3. Tuned for 550 injectors (stock fuel pump), but not road tuned since I read pig rich at full throttle on highway while using Aem Wideband gauge.

Will any dsmlink logs or settings also help?

 

[JamesH]

That is 1 of 2 things. I'd 90% go with a bad starter solenoid (part of the starter). They get sticky when it gets cold. Mine does the same. Thats the loud clicking you get when you're trying to turn it over.

The other 10% would be a dirty starter ground or the main lead going to it.

To add to this....It's not the smartest way to do it, but if you have a friend, have him watch the starter as you try to crank it when it's stone cold. When it gets to that point where it clicks but doesn't start, hold it there. See if the starter starts to smoke or the red lead going to it gets hot.

 

[DeadlyScone]

Brand New plugs and wires. Car was automatic turned into 5spd.

B&m adjustable fuel pressure regulator (reading 40psi when trying to start,gauge on top fuel filter)

DsmLink v3. Tuned for 550 injectors (stock fuel pump), but not road tuned since I read pig rich at full throttle on highway while using Aem Wideband gauge.

Will any dsmlink logs or settings also help?

well my 92 eclipse did this also. i know how much of a pain in the a** it is to get it started and running. but before you go ruling everything out i would make sure to take your battery and starter to get tested. Sometimes parts can be defective, since you mentioned you got a new starter and battery.

 

[1glaserfwd]

Check to see what your coolant temp sensor is reading when cold. Not sure if you can log that via dsmlink but when a coolant temp sensor goes bad they will read -40 or in that range. In result the ecu is adding a bunch of fuel causing the hard start issue.

 

[98zx23369]

sounds like drain back/ begining of a bad fuel pump too me, mine has drain back does the same thing

when it first starts when it is cold, what happens iff you shut it right back off and try too start it again. i know its not the best thing for your motor to do regularly but for dignostics its ok

if it starts fine i belive drain back or begining of bad fuel pump, if it doesnt i think its the starter solenoid, or too much resistance in the battery to starter connection

 

[way2slowtalon]

Will attempt to take all day trying out all things listed above. We can knock out coolant temp though. It is working as shown in the log. Car has not been turned on.

Also i listed my settings log of V3 just in case.

 

[way2slowtalon]

Still need help with cold starting. Not sure about bad fuel pump since it smelled like hardcore fuel when I tried to start it, and wide band was reading uber rich as it was.

Here are 2 new videos.



1-23-2012 Trying to start when cold again. WITH a jump pack still not working.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3byJYAsGb0g&feature=youtu.be



1-23-2012 Trying to restart while warm
1-23-11 Restart - YouTube


MY AFPR guage on top of the filter reads 40psi.

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[XiKeiyaZI]

CTS - Have we confirmed it's good yet? Does it smell rich at all when you try to turn it over at this point?

The first video (Cold) sounded like the starter WAS having issues, but that could just be what I was looking for.

Also, try adding a little deadtime. It looks like you changed the Injector size in link but failed to match it for your fuel pressure and I believe 180 is stock deadtime. Add just a tad, drop the fuel adjustment to -15.2% and see what happens.

 

[nastynine]

check the ground for the starter... mine popped off once and the car wouldn't crank over

 

[Sebba]

Since the car cranks fine, that would be a waste of time.

Strange that you smelled fuel while cranking.

 

[danielsl1999gsx]

I had this problem with my old 99gsx, it would take about 6-8 cranks before it would start up only to die within a few seconds. But when it was warmed up it would start up just fine like yours. Check your MAF, mine gave out on me and as soon as i swapped it out. Boom! first start no problems.

 

[DeadlyScone]

well when my timing belt slipped and i couldn't figure out why my car wouldn't start and why the garage reeked of fuel, well it was getting flooded is why and later found out that the timing was 180 off(R.I.P 1g Eclipse).
- not saying your out of timing.

my plugs were soaked with fuel when i took them out. so to me it almost seems like your car is flooding. that or you are not getting good spark.

 

[KYNDL7]

I've had this same issue with my gsx twice, once it was the CAS and the other time it was a failing ECU. You might want to check those out and oh, when my Cas was causing these problems it was in the wires coming from the sensors

 

[jamarh85]

My 99 gsx does the exact same thing. Haven't had a chance to address the issue yet becase I haven't really had the time. I agree with the possibilty of it being the maf and cts. KNDL7 pointed out some good possibilities that I may have to look into alos. This link may help. Discusses how bad injeector seals could be the cause.

http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/newbie-forum/385979-injector-seals-manifold.html

 

[98zx23369]

ya this actually sounds like a cas or a crank sensor too me. idk but it doesmt sound like a ecu in my opinion