Saikou Michi Dual Chamber Catch can 3d design

[sniperelite]

Hey I have been reading about catch cans and the way they are supposed to be hooked up to work correctly and efficiently. I think what I am going to do is pick up the Saikou Michi Dual Chamber Catch Can http://www.saikoumichi.com/SPLIT_DC3_page.htm . It looks like they seem to know what they are doing and has a good design with the filter and things like that. My question is, is this the correct way that I would hook these cans up to my setup? From what I was reading, I thought I need to plug the OEM PCV and just make two new ones in the head and route the lines to that. I just made this model in 3ds max for those of you wondering and I just wanted to know if this is all that would be needed to hook it up correctly?

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[slowgsr]

vent your can to atmosphere.. unless you have strict emissions laws and must keep the system a closed loop unvented.

 

[thom2white]

We usually run both the PVC line and the VC breather into the same sealed Catch Can and then run a line from the can to the intake pipe going into the turbo. This method requires you to have to plug the intake manifold port that you will abandon. This helps with the fact that our PCV valves always seem to leak under boost.

If you vent the can to the atmosphere you are going to be releasing metered air, which is essentially a boost leak. Notice on a stock set up all the air in circulation takes place behind the MAS.

 

[romeen]

sniperelite, strong work on that model. It sounds like you read through the "Stupid PCV" thread. It looks like you incorporated the check valve between the IM and catch can on the PCV side. If so, then yes this will work. In fact, it looks perfect! Those catch cans incorporate a "maze of stainless mesh" to help the oil vapors condense to liquid form. In that thread I talk about loosely stuffing the catch cans with some type of filtering media which is the same principle as what they are talking about. Again, great job. You should consider posting the diagram in the other thread.

..vent your can to atmosphere.. unless you have strict emissions laws and must keep the system a closed loop unvented.

This is a bad idea for reasons which have been discussed thoroughly in other threads including the reason that thom2white gives.

This helps with the fact that our PCV valves always seem to leak under boost.

Agreed that this is a common problem but a solution has been found to fix this. If interested you can read about it here:

http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/newbie-forum/229338-stupid-pcv-question.html

 

[TerminalTalon]

The valve cover needs some sort of help evacuating the "nasty" stuff which is a sealed can. I have a filter on mine and even though it works, I am still in the wrong.

 

[DSMunknown]

$120?! Yeah, okay.

 

[projecTSI]

$120?! Yeah, okay.

Not that bad of a price really, JMF catch cans are $60 each.

 

[sniperelite]

Well ya 120 might seem like a lot for a pair of catch cans to some but to me i would rather pay the 120 and make sure i hook it up correctly and then I shouldn't have to worry as much about long term problems with my setup instead of taking the cheaper route (which if done correctly may work just as good as the cans i am getting) But if there is a good amount of people who let me know if this is all hooked up correctly or even not let me know what is wrong and I will fix it and then fix the model and post it up as another thread saying it is the correct way to hook up a catch can system.

And yes, that is a check valve on the one line....at least someone knew what i was trying to make haha.

I think that making models for people to see is easier for them to comprehend rather than drawn up pictures or even pictures of the actual thing because it is hard to get good pictures of a catch can setup installed because there is just so much stuff in the way to see the whole diagram correctly.

Also, if anyone else has some good ideas of designs for me to make to show people how to hook up things correctly just let me know and I'll start working on it.

 

[DSMunknown]

I can get custom catch cans that work extremely well for about $10 each. (And yes, they're better than the Husky.)

 

[crimsondragon]

I use something similar to Huskys between my PCV and IM. It's basically an air compressor filter and works great. I can unscrew the bottom and dump it into my jug of used oil. As for between the intake and VC, I used a white fuel filter that cost me $3 from Pepboys. Reason being, much less oil leak through here so it's not so much worth the $11 compressor filters. It's been like what, 6 months, and the thing is nowhere near full. The sides are at most covered in the sludge and my intake has been as clean as the day I bought it.

 

[me612]

I would adjust your diagram slightly. I would NOT plug the stock PCV port. Retain the stock PCV port, and also retain the stock PCV. Put that line into the catch can, then a line out with the check valve to the IM like you have.

The reason that you should keep the stock PCV valve is because it isn't just an Off/On check valve. It has intermidate Open/Closed position as well. And the ECU incorporates that idea that in certain situations, it may be only partially open. The 2nd check valve is just meant to assist the PCV in holding back that pressure while your boosting, and also reduces the amount of pressure the catch can is seeing. It is simple on or off. So by just using that one check valve, you may experience a worse idle because it's output doesn't vary like the ecu is expecting it to.

Hopefully that made a little bit of sense. Here is a quick MSPaint drawing of what I'm talking about. If you want more ventalation while in boost if you have a large turbo setup, incorporate a 2nd line going to the intake pipe.

 

[me612]

I use something similar to Huskys between my PCV and IM. It's basically an air compressor filter and works great. I can unscrew the bottom and dump it into my jug of used oil. As for between the intake and VC, I used a white fuel filter that cost me $3 from Pepboys. Reason being, much less oil leak through here so it's not so much worth the $11 compressor filters. It's been like what, 6 months, and the thing is nowhere near full. The sides are at most covered in the sludge and my intake has been as clean as the day I bought it.

I would not place one of those fuel filters in your line going to the intake pipe. You cover that paper filter in oil, and you greatly reduce that filters efficiency to pass air, and you greatly reduce the amount of air being drawn out of the crank case.

 

[romeen]

I would adjust your diagram slightly. I would NOT plug the stock PCV port. Retain the stock PCV port, and also retain the stock PCV. Put that line into the catch can, then a line out with the check valve to the IM like you have.

The reason that you should keep the stock PCV valve is because it isn't just an Off/On check valve. It has intermidate Open/Closed position as well. And the ECU incorporates that idea that in certain situations, it may be only partially open. The 2nd check valve is just meant to assist the PCV in holding back that pressure while your boosting, and also reduces the amount of pressure the catch can is seeing. It is simple on or off. So by just using that one check valve, you may experience a worse idle because it's output doesn't vary like the ecu is expecting it to.

Hopefully that made a little bit of sense. Here is a quick MSPaint drawing of what I'm talking about. If you want more ventalation while in boost if you have a large turbo setup, incorporate a 2nd line going to the intake pipe.

^^^You are right on.

In the previous post I had made I didn't realize that the OP was talking about not using his PCV valve inline with the check valve.

 

[Defiant]

I would not place one of those fuel filters in your line going to the intake pipe. You cover that paper filter in oil, and you greatly reduce that filters efficiency to pass air, and you greatly reduce the amount of air being drawn out of the crank case.

Nah. Not a concern. Where it taps to the intake tract, it's not being "drawn" out, to start with (it's being blown out by crankcase pressure), and you'd not have enough restriction to matter anyway.

 

[me612]

Nah. Not a concern. Where it taps to the intake tract, it's not being "drawn" out, to start with (it's being blown out by crankcase pressure), and you'd not have enough restriction to matter anyway.

That is exactly what the purpose of that line is. While under boost, the intake pipe is the vacuum source for drawing excess crankcase pressure out. You can just leave a hose dangling there if you like, but adding in a vacuum source increases the efficiency at which the pressure is released. That is why that line is there. While not in boost, the PCV is open and the intake manifold is the vacuum source, while the line from the intake pipe brings in fresh air to ventilate the blow-by air out better.

 

[90 GSX]

Nah. Not a concern. Where it taps to the intake tract, it's not being "drawn" out, to start with (it's being blown out by crankcase pressure), and you'd not have enough restriction to matter anyway.

If I may be so bold, I disagree. Air is being pushed out by crankcase pressure AND being drawn out vacuum in front of the turbo. I would even venture to say that the force of the vacuum and amount of air drawn when you have a big turbo at 20+ psi fully flowing past the aperture of a 5/16 or 3/8 tube is much greater than pressure and amount of air generated by air blowing past the small ring gap and ring seal to pressurize the crankcase. There are two forces involved in venting the crankcase of air so indeed it is crucial to have both pressure and vacuum. I used a fram catch filter and once the filter is saturated with oil there is a significant decrease in flow. I mean the difference is major. I know because I experienced this first hand. I replaced my filter but I will building a real catch can as soon as I have time.

 

[dcshoeco1041]

how about some 420a apps???

 

[hatch]

I'm ordering the dual setup. However, he needs to know the PCV and breather outlet size. I don't have my car with me so I can't measure them myself. Can someone post up the sizes please? Its so he knows what size hose to send with the kit.

Thanks!

So as I typed this I figured I better do a bit better search but I still didn't come up with anything conclusive. Looks like the breather is 1/8"? The PCV = 3/8"?

 

[me612]

I personally use 3/8" on the PCV, and on the fitting on the side of the manifold.