Rebuilding 6 bolt

[numlock666]

After problems and solving problems new and worse problems arose and finally got the the point of spinning a rod bearing and trashing my 7 bolt (scored crank, scored rods, piston hit spark plug and pieces of piston hitting my head millions of times). Sad? nope, good riddance!! Picked up a 6 bolt and in the process of tearing it down. Got a few questions about the rebuild though.

First of all, my goals. 300 to 325 whp daily driven. Also make it to the next timing belt change without doing any major work on my engine. (broke a timing belt once and now trashed it)

So far i already ordered 2G 8.5:1 pistons from SBR, 4 layer HG, intake mani gasket, 4 layer ex. gasket, valve cover gaskets with grommets, and rebuilt 14B that was on my 7 bolt for 1 week before motor spun. Ordering calico bearings, Balance shaft elimination, timing parts, all arp studs.

What else would anyone reccomend? gaskets?? seals?? I want everything nice and tight, without any oil leaks or leaks of anykind. As of right now i have the engine out and cleaning up my engine bay and painting it flat black because right now its like dirty yellow was white.

 

[tom04841]

I don't see piston rings on your list, but maybe they come with the pisons.

I would also pop in some new viton valve stem seals since its a older motor. I would also inspect the crank jounals and bearings, replace front and rear crank seals, and oil and water pump...if your going to doit, do it right....save yourself some headaches down the road

 

[Quasimondo]

Get an engine rebuild kit from either SBR or Diamondstarmotorsport. That should have all of the gaskets and seals needed for a rebuild.

 

[numlock666]

Also how hard am I pushing the 1G rods and 2G pistons sqeezing out 300whp+? Should i go with Eagle rods and Wiseco pistons? Dont want to overdo it seriously, just wondering if the 1G/2G combo is good enough to do the 300+ daily.

 

[the_skin_eater]

Also how hard am I pushing the 1G rods and 2G pistons sqeezing out 300whp+? Should i go with Eagle rods and Wiseco pistons? Dont want to overdo it seriously, just wondering if the 1G/2G combo is good enough to do the 300+ daily.

I know someone doing high 12's with those...More than sure he was around 300.... He might have been low 12;s actually...But ya, they will work for that.

 

[numlock666]

Sweet thanks

 

[awdtalontsi1992]

Stock 1G rods and 2G pistons will be perfect for your goals. I would recommend as said before about just getting a complete engine rebuild gasket kit. These kits will contain some small gaskets that can be a pain to find otherwise. I would send you crank rods and block to a machine shop and have all the clearences and make sure everything is in size. I would also recommend you get the engine balanced with those new pistons. Also having the machine shop do a good micropolish on the crank would be a good idea. As for the head a new set of valve seals would be an extremely good idea. All these things are good ideas to keep that motor running a long time.

 

[packinkimber45]

What exactly do you mean get the engine balanced with the new pistons? Do you mean the whole rotating assembly? I was wondering since I myself will be undergoing a rebuild. Also can anyone tell me how much to get the engine balanced approximately? Thanks.

numlock66... That sucks your motor took a crap on you! I'm sorry to hear that, but now you will have a 6 bolt. Just make sure when you do your rebuild that you do some things that are oem parts. For example your oil pump, water pump, and timing belt components. If I am missing any other parts anyone feel free to chime in. I am also in your position where I am going to rebuild the 6 bolt. Good luck with that.

 

[numlock666]

just tore it down today to just the block bare block. WOW it is in REALLY good condition, it looks like it was freshly rebuilt, the donor car had 178K miles on it, pulled it in a salvage yard. Was wondering why the car was there, body was perfect, timing belt in tact, everything looked good. Turns out the balance shaft belt broke and it was lucky nothing happened. Im feeling really good about this engine. WEIRD thing is that the donar car has EXACTLY the same amount of miles as my car does...weird??

 

[perley03]

just tore it down today to just the block bare block. WOW it is in REALLY good condition, it looks like it was freshly rebuilt, the donor car had 178K miles on it, pulled it in a salvage yard. Was wondering why the car was there, body was perfect, timing belt in tact, everything looked good. Turns out the balance shaft belt broke and it was lucky nothing happened. Im feeling really good about this engine. WEIRD thing is that the donar car has EXACTLY the same amount of miles as my car does...weird??

What you should have done first was tear that block down, and sent the block, crank, rods, and bare head to the machine shop to be checked of all tolerances. If the cylinder wall is out of round, or has a taper to it, then it needs to be bored to match specification. The pistons need slight gap (were talkin hundred-thousands of an inch) between the cylinder and themselves. Also the journals of the block, rods, and crank need to be checked, to see if they're out of spec. Also the head and the block need to checked for flatness. If they are out of tolerance you will be going through some headgaskets. This should be a first step to anyone who is going to rebuild a motor before you buy the parts. Since you bought the pistons, before the block was even checked over, and say the block now needs to be bored out, you are stuck with standard sized pistons, and now you need 0.010 or whatever oversized pistons. Same with the crank. If it needs to be cut, now you need to buy oversized bearings. See what I'm getting at?
I've learned the hard way. I'm only 21, but with 5 SBC and 2 neon motors under my belt, I learned from the first motor I ever built. Do it right, and do it right the first time. Don't skimp out on any part.

 

[numlock666]

well ill see when the machine shop gets back to me, If it needs to be bored out then hey, these pistons are going on ebay and im getting wisecos and eagles ^_^.

My main goal is not the 300+whp but mainly its getting to the next timing belt change without having to pull the head or anything of that nature for the whole 30K miles.

 

[lillev23]

Just to give an idea of the tools you will probably need....
piston ring expander
a QUALITY piston ring compressor (there are two different kinds)
a rubber mallet
a quality torque wrench for accurate torque values (I would use a 3/8 drive)
a good file for gapping piston rings
a feeler gauge to measure ring gaps, thrust bearing clearances, etc.
a good engine assembly lube
an organized tool set so you won't have to look for sockets during engine assembly
a tube of rtv grey
good ol' buddy JB (for balance shaft elimination)
oh yeah auto zone sales a bottom end gasket kit for 6-bolt turbo. ask for the 1990 conversion gasket set. It comes with every o-ring, gasket, seal, and crush washer to rebuild your bottom end. its about $26. I haven't had any oil leak problems with it.
oh yeah on the concave side of all your rod and main bearings, make sure they and the sufaces that they mate to are completely clean and free of dirt.
also, for every inch of bore you should have .004" of gap in your rings. you have stock bore pistons so it should be an 85mm bore. divide that 85mm/25.4(to convert) and you should get something like a 3.34", which is your bore in inches. then multiply 3.34" by
.004" and you should get .013, which what your ring gap should be or very close.

 

[lillev23]

oh yeah download the chiltons manual. It be very helpful depending on how close to stock you are

 

[nightspeed87]

YEA DO IT RIGHT THE FIRST TIME, iam learning this the hard way right now... Had a incompentent guy build my engine , and everything in my engine is new except the crank, the most important thing huh.... Had a cut down crank and it made it a lot weaker, id recommend a new crank, my engine started knocking and spun i bearing a believe, bad clearances im assuming. I have the 2g pistons 1g rod combo. 1gs require a chip/ link to do this properly but since you have 2g timing maps youll be good. The wrist pin is just a 1mm difference. That compression ratio I hear is perfect on turbo cars running decent amounts of boost without going full drag spec. Also consider balance shaft removal while its apart. I did it and cant notice any power gains but the engine seems more free reving, and the extra vibration is tolerable. Once you upgrade your motor mounts anyways I dont thik much vibration will be noticed to be honest. Replace everything you can on that motor and have a good reputable builder do the job to were you get good warrenty on the work and break it in with the motoman technique http://www.mototuneusa.com/break_in_secrets.htm and you will be good to go.

 

[lillev23]

I reccomend doing the engine yourself. So that way if you break something (which you will you will know how to rebuild it. plus you learn from your mistakes. that's the only way that I learned. Plus, no one should know more about your engine than you should. Oh yeah, during break in miles, DO NOT use synthetic oil. If you do your rings will never seat to the cylinder walls. you will be forever using engine oil.

 

[perley03]

Just to give an idea of the tools you will probably need....
piston ring expander
a QUALITY piston ring compressor (there are two different kinds)
a rubber mallet
a quality torque wrench for accurate torque values (I would use a 3/8 drive)
a good file for gapping piston rings
a feeler gauge to measure ring gaps, thrust bearing clearances, etc.
a good engine assembly lube
an organized tool set so you won't have to look for sockets during engine assembly
a tube of rtv grey
good ol' buddy JB (for balance shaft elimination)
oh yeah auto zone sales a bottom end gasket kit for 6-bolt turbo. ask for the 1990 conversion gasket set. It comes with every o-ring, gasket, seal, and crush washer to rebuild your bottom end. its about $26. I haven't had any oil leak problems with it.
oh yeah on the concave side of all your rod and main bearings, make sure they and the sufaces that they mate to are completely clean and free of dirt.
also, for every inch of bore you should have .004" of gap in your rings. you have stock bore pistons so it should be an 85mm bore. divide that 85mm/25.4(to convert) and you should get something like a 3.34", which is your bore in inches. then multiply 3.34" by
.004" and you should get .013, which what your ring gap should be or very close.

You forgot something very important: plastiguage
Whenever you are building an engine, use this to check your bearing tolerances.
Click Here to learn how to use it.
Also you're gonna need quite a few cans of brake clean, you're going to need them to clean every part, and also spray out the oil and water galleys from machining, to get rid of any metal shavings. Also a bunch of clean rags, lots of shop paper towels, and a buddy for when you need those extra set of hands.

 

[numlock666]

thanks for the info on the autozone gasket kit, and the ring gaps. Thanks for the tips, keep it comming rebuild gurus!!

 

[numlock666]

what about gap size on the oil ring, i read that typically you want .015 but, whats your take for a 4g63t?