pump gas limit

[slayer450]

I also only fill up at a station with different nozzles for each grade of gas. You never really know how much 87 octane is in the line before you get the 93 you paid for. I have no idea where it switches over but what if it's at the tank under ground and you get 20ft worth of 87 octane in a 1" hose before the 93 comes out??? Overly paranoid, I know

It switches at the pump. Your only getting what's left in the hose by the handle.

 

[bradselph]

It switches at the pump. Your only getting what's left in the hose by the handle.

still too much for me

 

[95ttalontsi]

Your 70-90mph time is still about the same as in your other thread.

Have you tried shooting for 10.4-10.5:1 AFR to cool it down in the CC a little?

Did you try the BR7ES plugs?

Where do you get your gas? Have you tried a different station? A while back I had to switch from the BP station I normally got premium at since they added something called Invigorate and it would make my car knock. I actually had to pull a couple degrees of timing across the board. I think I switched to Exxon and it got better. I mix in 60% E-85 now so it doesn't really matter anymore...

I also only fill up at a station with different nozzles for each grade of gas. You never really know how much 87 octane is in the line before you get the 93 you paid for. I have no idea where it switches over but what if it's at the tank under ground and you get 20ft worth of 87 octane in a 1" hose before the 93 comes out??? Overly paranoid, I know

Did you install the cyl head yourself? Did the combustion chamber look smooth and have no sharp edges?

I fill up at many different stations, still using bpr7es plugs. I just went out and rechecked my timing and to my surprise it was 3*btdc. I had my powerinverter on with the laptop grounding timing pin in ecmlink. I just did it the manual way with running a wire from timing plug to NEG bat. So that means timing was overadvanced a little? Cylinder head was fully redone with new valves, guides and a resurface.

 

[boost97gst]

Damn, ive never seen a pump with one nozzle around here . Guess im lucky. I personally wont put even 91 in my car and if i do absolutely have to i run in and grab a couple bottles of octane booster. Runs like a raped ape with that stuff in there. Ive been thinking of adding about 1.5G of e85 on my fill ups. OP you should consider that too. It will definitely help with knock. Its like dumping a shitload of octane booster in your tank except way way cheaper.

 

[bastarddsm]

What are your post intercoooler aits. You need to be within a couple of.degress of ambient.

 

[95ttalontsi]

What are your post intercoooler aits. You need to be within a couple of.degress of ambient.

Ive got the vrsf front mount so I think temps should be close to ambiant and i dont think im working the turbo very hard to blow too hot of air. Im going to invest in a meth kit. I have to choose between cams or a meth kit. Hard decision!!!

 

[Archer Fabrications]

i dunno if the 35 has water lines but i have the vrsf fmic an i see 20* above
ambient on hot days it's bad like 120 iat
on a 90* day I'm switching to ets
soon

 

[bastarddsm]

Ive got the vrsf front mount so I think temps should be close to ambiant and i dont think im working the turbo very hard to blow too hot of air. Im going to invest in a meth kit. I have to choose between cams or a meth kit. Hard decision!!!

Read the post below. I saw the same ait rises on a $59ebay core. Thevrsf isnt much better. Id get the meth kit.

 

[boost97gst]

i dunno if the 35 has water lines but i have the vrsf fmic an i see 20* above
ambient on hot days it's bad like 120 iat
on a 90* day I'm switching to ets
soon

Hey urban, when you get that ETS, let us all know what the dif is in IATs. They are PRICEY but ive heard they are hands-down the best fmic money can buy. Its another thing ive been wanting.. the list of wants is long indeed .

OP, you will gain a LOT more power with a meth kit than you will with cams. Definitely put cams as number 2 on your list though. Maybe some hks 272s.... or 280s if you want a real top end screamer

 

[GSXDNA]

I even see some "reputable" forum members advising to do the same thing. That is exactly how NOT to do it. Unless being over advanced is the name of the game, of course.

If you had a choice between being at peak power, being underadvanced or being overadvanced, which would you pick? Of course, peak power would be the no.1 choice but without some sort of measuring device is hard to attain. Then it comes down to being overadvanced or underadvanced. Anywhere between the two you will be making similar power, however, one of these choices guarantees a shorter and harder engine life than the other. You make the decision which one

I've heard many others like to do it the other way...set boost to target psi, then adjust timing up until you see knock. I've also heard that different motors react better to more boost vs more timing, etc. When i saw 30psi on pump and only 7* of timing, my thought was just that he might be better off decreasing boost a bit so that he could run some more timing. In reality, it is a game of balance, and you have to take both factors into account. But, the primary goal shouldn't be to push as much out of your turbo as humanly possible with no consideration for IATs and timing.

You must not know much about Holsets. They wake up at 30psi and plenty running that with pump. OP can i see a log of your timing map? i think a curve like your explaining would work well on my setup with a 9.2:1 compression i gotta run lower timing then the other 2g guys.

I wasn't suggesting that 20 psi falls in the sweet spot of the turbo's efficiency range. And yes, i am familiar with Holsets. I have an HX40 myself. I also know a few others who have had HX35s and HX40s over the years, and i don't recall any of them exceeding 30psi on pump without meth (at least on 91 pump). I myself can only hit about 23psi or so on pump before seeing some knock, but im running higher timing.

 

[dsmcurse]

WATER/METH BABY ! w meth injection you can take pump gas really far. i run a superHX40 w 62mm wheel. when i need to "get down to business" my max boost setting is 37psi. i run 19* timing on the top end. i have no knock. my check engine light is set to do "dumby warning" at only one count of knock. i can pull all the way to 8500RPM see 37psi and never see my knock sensor warning light come on. in the logs there might be one or two lil blurbs where it saw like .3 knock. that aint nothin. this is all on 91 non ethonal octane pump gas. but like i said, WATER/METH ! i have a intake manni that each runner is bunged for like nos or what ever. i have a AEM 300cc meth squirter in each runner. DIRECT PORT METH INJECTION and pump gas love each other. i dyno'd at cobb tuning last summer at 505. i expect about 550 now

 

[Fiascoxl]

I ran my bolt on hx35 @ 25lbs with 15 degrees of timing on pump 93. I was running br8es plugs and a little ets street kit, car ran awesome and really safe with the iats never much higher than outside ambient temperature.

 

[GSXDNA]

I don't think you understood what he was saying. Turbo xxx may "wake up" at 30 psi, but, PSI means nothing. It's about IAT and air flow. If you can't keep your intake temps down, at 30psi, you likely won't make much power as you might at 27psi. Tune for your setup as a whole, not just your turbo's potential.

Yes, thank you. I must be doing a bad job at explaining.

 

[95ttalontsi]

Im going to order my meth kit tonight and see what happens. I noticed that almost all my knock starts at 5500 everytime. timing is around 7 or so at that rpm but at 24 psi I can get to 16* timing at 7000 to 7500 with little knock and airflow around 43-43lb/min. Whats the RPM where I should have max timing?
Is having 8 to 10* timing from 5000 to 6300 to low? I had br8es plugs and had the same knock, there was no difference.

 

[dsmcurse]

use number 7 spark plugs and gap 'em at 20

 

[95ttalontsi]

use number 7 spark plugs and gap 'em at 20

Am running bpr7es currently gapped at .025. U mean the br7 plug?

 

[bastarddsm]

Im going to order my meth kit tonight and see what happens. I noticed that almost all my knock starts at 5500 everytime. timing is around 7 or so at that rpm but at 24 psi I can get to 16* timing at 7000 to 7500 with little knock and airflow around 43-43lb/min. Whats the RPM where I should have max timing?
Is having 8 to 10* timing from 5000 to 6300 to low? I had br8es plugs and had the same knock, there was no difference.

5500 is about where peak torque isso it should have low timing. then as rpM come up it should peak out at max RPM. keep in mind that as rpm comes up the load will fall off therefore you will move into lower rows of timing. also don't tie timing to boost. timing is determined by RPM and load. therefore as a rule timing should be highest at low loads and increase as Rpm increases for a given load

on my car I typically pick up 1 degree for 500 RPM. and then I lose about 5 degrees per load row but my case is different because I don't use DSM link also keep in mind that the cells interpolate so that the cells around the 1 you working on affect it

 

[NewTurboTuner]

Ive been searching the limits of 93oct Pump Gas on my 2.3l. Ive been doing alot of logging and playing with it. Its different with different air temps, but heres what im seeing

70* air I can run around 28lbs boost & 8* total peak timing flowing 57lbs/min
We had a 45* night & with the same boost & tune as above... the cold air gave me 30lbs boost, 8* peak timing, & it flowed 60lbs/min

I installed a Water/Methanol Kit last week & turned up the boost a touch.
70* air @ 31lbs Boost & 9* peak timing was flowing 60lbs/min
55* air @ 32.5lbs boost & 9* peak timing was flowing 62lbs/min

Keep in mind this is on a 2.3l stroker. my previous cars have all been 2l so the hardest thing for me to do is wrap my head around the low timing numbers (I guess I'll get use to it). ****If anyone can point me to some good stroker-timing threads I'd appreciate it!****

Over all Im pretty happy with flowing 60+lbs/min on pump gas (with stock 2g head and Intake manifold too).

 

[NewTurboTuner]

Last weekend I pushed 64lbs/min on 34psi. This on 93oct pump gas, 30/70-water/methanol, and mid-40* temps. It's funny how 6-7 years ago 500awhp was said to be very hard to accomplish on pump gasoline. These days it's not too hard at all

 

[Archer Fabrications]

well ya.... with meth... try it on straight 92

 

[AK Maniak]

I hate you all! The highest octane I can get is 90

 

[Archer Fabrications]

where I'm moving to in ontario canada they have 94

 

[NewTurboTuner]

well ya.... with meth... try it on straight 92

If the main goal is to make max power on pump gasoline, then it woudnt do me any good to leave out something that would help me make more power.

 

[Archer Fabrications]

whats the title say man...doesn't say pump+meth limit

 

[Archer Fabrications]

If the main goal is to make max power on pump gasoline, then it woudnt do me any good to leave out something that would help me make more power.

So use race gas, get out of this thread .