My official GS-T To GS-X conversion thread

[turboglenn]

Thanks!

After doing some re-reading of some things i realized my AWD OEM pump didn't have a spacer in it (and although i made one) my little cap was also cracked but i didn't think that would matter with a good o-ring seal. Well i guess i'm wrong on that one I just can't motivate myself to get out there tonight and work on anything, i'm in so much pain i can't even stand to talk to anyone on the phone ot otherwise (it's all i can stand to sit here and type)

I wish there was enough of the hard line before that large flare in the hanger to allow me to just cuit it off and use fuel line and clamps, but that would be too easy wouldn't it . I guess its time to remove the OEM lines completely and TIG braze in some new 3/8th's metal line so i can use clamps and some blue aeroquip hose inside (that's how i made my 2g FWD dual pump setups and it worked great)

The sad part was that after a nice first gear pull out into traffic i was really looking forward to traction in a gear whgere i can build some boost, and that's when it hit me that i didn't have fuel *damn!*

I am proud of the fuel gauge components working so well though. in 12+ years i had NEVER seen the low fuel light on then GST, today it was coming on and off as i wrked up and down hills screaming at the slow drivers in traffic while praying my way to the E85 station . But i'm glad to know that it works and that the gauge must be a lot more accurate than it was in the GST tank since i had ran the T tank down to where it was less than a half gallon from dead dry and never saw the light.

I have a question on the tank and low fuel light though, roughly how far would you have left to get to a station once it comes on (based on an OEM car with OEM fuel consumption anyway )

I've got the parts alal gathered up from my adventures building GST dual pump setups so that if i get a hair for pulling the sending hanger tonight i can start on making my GSX modified hanger or hopepfullly a dual pump setup. I know people are making my HP levels on one pump but for some reason i can't seem to do it, either that or my other OEM pump hanger in the T was leaking but not as bad keeping me from making much power on my first 255 pump.

I just hope the siphon tube can handle the return of parallel wallys, i've drilled it out to 1/8th inch (max recomended from my reading), and i guess if i had to i could make a secondary return line that would handle only the overflow of the OEM one as to not hurt the siphoning effect, I guess we shall see huh?

 

[phunny]

Great read and glad you got away from the wrong-wheel-drive

Just kidding you GS-T'ers

 

[etay89]

I'm jealous you got your swap done so fast

I really need to find/make those driveshaft brackets :-\

 

[turboglenn]

Great read and glad you got away from the wrong-wheel-drive

Just kidding you GS-T'ers

Thanks, I really wanted to document it a lot better but in order to get it done so fast i had to spend every waking moment turning wrenches and trying to avoid breakingmmy phone i didn't have it on me often enough to get a lot of the pics i wanted

I'm jealous you got your swap done so fast

I really need to find/make those driveshaft brackets :-\

I wouldn't even bother with the front bracket, even if you don't have a lathe you can shape the heads of some 14mm (m10) bolts down enough to fit in the holes already in the GST bracket so you can weld them in the proiper place, it's SOOOo much easier than trying to remove the spot welds, I spent probably 2 hours on the GSX one and the only thing it had that i needed was the exhaust hanger and that was still faster to fab a new one up compared to removing and replacing the sheet metal.

Now the rear bracket i would say is needed unless you are pretty good with sheet metal or have another idea for making that setup

One thing i've really given a lot of thought to is making a custom rear sub frame that's more like a 1g setup, built partially of 4130 tubing and some plain sheet metal in 1/8th or 1/4 inch thick. I just like the 1g design better and feel that i9 could do swaps without having to have a donor car for chassis parts at all really aside from the crontol arms and suspension pieces

headed out to work on pulling the pump hanger and replacing the lines with hard line and also going to try and add the second pump like i did on my GST hanger, I'm posting it in my thread about duial in tank pumps in the "bolt on" section of the forum which i'll link to here

 

[Aproductions]

Great read and glad you got away from the wrong-wheel-drive

Just kidding you GS-T'ers

HAHA this is awesome.

 

[woooop]

Post some pics of your fuel hanger so we can see what your prob was

 

[turboglenn]

Well that fix was way easier than i thought, and just as i thought the O-ring was leaking, the pump was slightly crooked because of the hose clamp holding it to the bracket that comes down (my sock was backwards so i didn't use the factory bottom piece that holds the pump in, and i never really do to be honest)

While i was at it i drilled the inside of the flare fitting area out to 8mm to match the ID of the hard line coming out of the hanger.

What i did was took some of the blue -6 push lock fitting style hose and clamped it around the pumps outlet, then i lubed it up and it still took a LOT of foirce to get it to go into the hanger's flare so i'm sure this one isn't going to leak at all (or at least i hope i'm not proven wrong )

As for putting the second pump in, well, there's a way i've figure out but being late and not wanting to mess with my ONLY pump/sender hanger i left that be for now (if anyone has spare for either side let me know) It looks likei could put a pump onto the siphon line from the other tank, spin the little plastic thing around and add another siphoning line to the edge of the assembly, but being my only one on my DD i'm gonna hold off and see how soon this 255 comes up short on delivery.

Honestly i'm still thinking about putting a -8 or -10 cross line from one saddle to the other to aid in the siphons job and help to keep a pump on the driver's side from running dry at all, but having them right next to each other is much better for this reason. Now i can see why all the AWD guys add the 044 in-line pump

Here's the link to the thread with the pics of the pump install.
http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/bolt-tech/417320-dual-pumps-awd-tank-anyone-got-pics.html

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Well, the fuel pump fix worked great and one pump is providing enough fuel at the moment to allow me to run 22-25psi on the pt67 turbo.

although i've ridden in plenty of AWD eclipse/talons there's nothing like having your own

I can actually make 20+psi in first gear where before i'd get to almost 8psi and the tires would just light up and aggrivate me. second gear is just as fun with a full 25 psi and although the stock trans needs a good granny-shift to avoid damage/grinding it does shift rather well, but there's just no substitute for traction.. 400+ Hp was fun in the GST, but only once i was in 3rd gear and 4th gear was faster than i needed to go on public roads anyway, but being able to jump out into traffic, pull a 1-2 shift and rev it out and be at 609MPH in no time flat is just the best feeling ive had in ages

I do need to work on the tune a little bit and i think the added drivetrain is bringing on some phantom knock that wasn't there before since nothing in the engine has changed, but im' sure i can dial that out on the J&S if needed

My front calipers are hanging up a little and i'm smelling pads roasting after any amount of 45mph driving, so they will get yanked off tonight and gone through to put an end to that.

I still haven't figured out what i'm going to do for a muffler, I'd hate to cut up the thermal system for it's can and ruin any chance of getting some money back on it, but i ust mighthave to. The noise is just inbearable having the piping all the wya back to the rear i figured it wouldn't be that bad, but between 3 and 4k RPM the droning is so loud and annoying i can't even try and talk to anyone in the passenger seat.

overall i'm still very happy for havin almost nothing into this swap at all as far as money is concerned, and the feeling of a WOT 1-2 pull is one of the most addictive feelings i've ever had the chance to enjoy

Something else i'd like to add is that going back to completely stock suspension from a set of blue tokikos and hyperco springs is fabulouse! My back use to ache so badly from any bump in the road that is was miserable to drive the car on any street that wasnm't in perfect shape, but now even speed bumps are soaked up so nicely that the car is just a joy to drive again

I think the last things needed are the muffler and the lubing of the brake calipers that i mentioned earlier and the car will be perfect again

 

[turboglenn]

A few key items to pay attention to durig the swap that i thought of while adding some info to another guys' thread, figure i'll put them here for archival purposes

Some things that were important and should be paid attention to IMO

caliper glide pins: remove, clean, grease and re-install

make sure that when putting the tank into place that any lines you may hgave for water injection/nitrouse dont get pinched and become a permanent fixture (you have to basically drop the rear subframne to drop the tank again - at least for it to be easy)

the sub-frame bolts you move forward,: either weld LARGE plates to them to keep them from spinning or once the sub is in place with the bolts through it , weld them into the uni-body so they don't spin constantly

tank bolts: much cleaner and easier to cut from the inside of the car to place them, my thread and photobucket shows exactly where these openings should be..

***for locating where you need to cut all the new holes for tank and subframe bolts: use a long flat head screwdriver and a hammer, push it up through the holes and hit it with hammer untill you've pierced the sheet metal, much nicer than just cutting away and hoping to get close to where you need to be, using this method all my holes were nice clean cuts that welded back shut very easily (i've seen pics of some hack job cuts that you'd have to put new metal over to get them to ever look decentthere's locating holes already in the FWD chassis for every single bolt you'll need to add to the car's underside

it's much easier to just weld new bolts into the front carrier bearing bracket already on the GST than it is to actually swap the one from the AWD into the FWD chassis (too much drilling into the body removing spot welds for one simple exhaust hanger since you're gonna be welding anyway, might as well just weld in a new hanger and shave a few hours of tediouse frustrating labor out of the job (grind the heads of the bolts round with a hand grinder or bench grinder to where they slip into the holes, but leave the "washer" lip that the bolt has built into it for added weld area, see my pics above in the thread for an example

**remove the one existing exhaust hanger stud from the rear carrier before welding it in and just weld a bot in like you would for the front hanger to hold the exhaust hanger bracket in there or it won't sit flush when you try and weld it in

** cut a good amount of loom from the AWD's tank connections from the chassis so you have clean connectors to put onto the car's chassis that's being built (mine plugs in like a factory AWD because of saving these)

** an important one IMO< remove EVERY suspension bolt for the arms and strut mounts and add a good amount of anti-sieze before you install the rear subframe - this makes future work much easier since you'll be breaking things free while you have easy acess to them instead of when they're in the car and some being impossible to get an impact wrench on at that point

Finally, if you're gonna upgrade clutches, do so now, you don't want to drop the trans again after this swap when you relaize the ACT 2100 justr isn't gonna cut it unless you're running a factory T25

The emergency brake cables won't all line up at the very rear on the FWD chassis after install (at least mine didn't) so save the brackets from the FWD units so you can swap/add them to the AWD cables to help secure them as best possible

 

[Boostinsideways]

On a FWD (non saddle tank) I usually get the light when I am about 1 gallon left in the tank. (16.9 gallon tank, takes ~16.5 gallons at fillup, unsure of actually amount of fuel that fits in the filler neck)

I wish I could help you on the saddle tank, but normally I just fill up when I hit 1/4th tank or less.

 

[97gst_spyder]

Glenn, did you swap the front subframe over too?

I can't believe you got the swap done and running so quick! Thanks for adding as much info as you did also!

BTW, any news on the Saturn alt brackets?

 

[turboglenn]

I did not swap the front sub frame, the FWD unit was fine(i only wanted the AWD one because i had a thread get stripped that i had to repair on the FWD stock one, but the swapping of the rack that would have been needed wasn't worth the time of one bolt hole)

The tank is working fine as far as fuel level and light working, I actually thought they were only 13 gallon tanks. Anyone know how many the AWD 2g saddle tank holds?, that way i can judge when the light's on how much i have left

as for saturn alt brackets,. i just need into my storage unit (behind on payments on it) so i can get them and finish them because that's where my spare engine sits and i was mocking them up there, some i'm working to bend into place and other's i'm working with a spacer to see what's better, I'm sure i have afew laying around the house even but i am, not sure of their fit untill i mock them up against' the engine with alt since i did 2 different runs that only vary by a slight amount i can'rt be sure what i have untill i get back in there

I got the muffler on (used my thermal systems muffler) and i swear (and i don't know why) but the AWD exhaust is much more tolorable than my FWD exhaust was, i'm using the same muffler and DP, just the cat to muffler mid section has changed to the straight back GSX style and i like it a lot better already, even with the open dump gate.

I'm actually still working on the tune with only one fuel pump, surprisingl;y it isn't changine much but i haven't hit the areas where i was out of fuel yet though either since i'm affraid of what the stock AWD trans can handle on a straight pulll

To be honest i'm affraid to launch the stock trans at all!!! also affraid to shift it fast or even put too much boost behind it out of fear it will fail. Am i being too affraid of it or what?

I am hearing new noises that make me unsure of the car as well, i'm not sure if i hear the different trans + t-case, or if it's in the driveshaft or what, it's nto a "bad noise" just more/different sounding than the FWD TRE Trans was. (God do i miss the smooth shifting of the TRE trans while driving the AWD areoud though ) although i never really beat my other trans i could at least shift fast wioth it, this thing is like rev out first, shift, wait, wait,okay there's second, okay let out clutch go LAG!!!!!!!! boost weeeeeeeeeeee. I think i had become unaware of just how much of an improvement a built trans makes even on daily driving as i'd kill for a double synchro 1-2 shift right about now and to know i have good forks, rails and hope that the synchros in there are ar least in "ok" shape.. I mean it's not a crap gear box and does fine for daily driving but don't dare shift above 7K RPM unless you want to have a smoke between gears

Who knows, maybe i'll come across something i can either build, selll, swap or trade to get something better, maybe even just some clusters from jacks, but i need to sell the FWD TRE frist cause i can't even pay bills right now

 

[Boostinsideways]

Everything I am seeing says that they all have the same capacity. 16 gallons. But that doesn't explain how I fit 16.9 after I drove it home from the guy I bought it from with the light on, and back to the store (8 miles of very very conservative driving) once I did the overhaul.

http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/new...city-merged-11-6-gas-tank-size-gallons-2.html

 

[turboglenn]

Everything I am seeing says that they all have the same capacity. 16 gallons. But that doesn't explain how I fit 16.9 after I drove it home from the guy I bought it from with the light on, and back to the store (8 miles of very very conservative driving) once I did the overhaul.

http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/new...city-merged-11-6-gas-tank-size-gallons-2.html

OK, that kinda makes sense to me now because when i drained the GST tank i got about 5 gallons of e85 from it, and the new tank was bone dry and when i added the 5 or so from the T's tank which was enough to start it, move it around for the trans swap after the tank and rear sub frame were in, and then pretty much checking all the vacum lines and such (maybe 30 minutes of idle in driveway and such) but the whole time to the gas station after that the fuel light was on and it took 12.7 gallons to fil it up, so that's almost 17 total, minus the fuel burned from moving around/idle etc.. and the addition of the fuel neck being full.

Thanks

 

[turboglenn]

Well, today i have a couple of friends that know about the swap hounding me to go to the 1/8th mile tonight. Normally i just get angry because my car usually spins tires for the whole 8th mile, but now that she's AWD the only excuse i have is money for entry fees and not wanting to break parts..

Think im gonna try and get the 20 bones and launch easy to see what i trap for MPH if nothing else

Now, it's a given i have no cash to repair the trans should she let loose so i'll be basing my launches around making the CD last. from reading on here i've started to believe the thing is made of glass, but i see tons of videos on youtube and websites of people launching stock trannies really hard (much harder than i plan to)

I know all about slipping the clutch and preloading the driveline (which i will probably use the e-brake as a staging brake if i go) And i will not flat shift the car, never really have, and don't feel a need to at this time anyway. Temps will be in the 45* F ambient range, power should be GOOD, traction, well it's gonna be better than the fail wheel drive no matter what


Questions are as follows.

1.) Should i use the 2-step or not? It will probably build a PSI or 2 if i do use it and i know it will launch harder but will it be that much easier on the trans if i'm solely free-revving the engine by foot control or should i just put the limiter about 4500 RPM and have at it in that sense?


2.) TIRE PRESSURE, should i use a higher or lower pressure to be easier on the trans? I know lower = more traction, but also leaves some sidewall flex to absorb shock, stiffer is less traction but less shock absorbing ability from the tires..some one with AWD experience please gimme some tips

I feel like the larger laggier turbo is helping preserve the driveline by keeping the torque onset soft and later on in the power band, and i've got the trans shifting pretty good but the damn parts store master cylinder is pissing me off, I am running out of threads on the adjustment rod before i get to the poinr where the reliefe valve stops the slave from returning, thus keeping me from getting the best adjsutment from the clutch. ** On a side note about parts store masters. I've noticed they come with assorted attachment pieces where it mates to the pedal and i learned long ago you must use the type the MC comes with because they change the length of the push rod in it to match the length of the new piece.

There's the flat folded metal one like OEM, and then one that's large and round like a cylinder which is longer and it's master has the shorter rod. None of the vfaq stuff mentions this so i try and put the info in my threads for other to find that have clutch issues, now as far as i know this may only be a 2g thing with the replacement masters, but if any of you 1g guys have seen variations please chime in on that

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EDIT: Well, I didn't go to the track, just couldn't spend the 20 bucks and risk breaking something much more expensive. If only some of my damn front wheel drive parts would sell. I know there's people out there building them still but this is the slowest i've seen the classifieds in a long time, usually people are sending me a few PM's a day on anything i post up, and although i'm getting a few offers inquiries on them i haven't had anything solid work out yet.

I guess all in all it's better i didn't go, there's still a few noises i'm trying to sort out in the new driveline system

 

[turboglenn]

I think i've figured out all i need for drivetrain upgrades..

If i got a shep/jacks/TRE trans and then just went straight to a twin disk clutch how reliable would the clutch be for daily traffic drving? I figure it i go straight to the twin with a strong trans i'll be able to pre-load it and feed the power well enough to do a lot of preservation on the rest of the drivetrain, so honestly, does that sound logical? I know most people stick with the 2600 it seems untill they have upgraded the T-case, axles etc.. but with the limited funding wouldn't it just make a lot of sense to get the clutch that can handle some insane abuse early on in the game?

I just don't know their street life expectancy, we've had to go through my friends RPS a couple times now but they claim htere was something wrong or defective on the original install since it barely lasted for 500 miles of hard driving/dyno pulls, and we've yet to get the results of the rebuilt units as we're waiting on the trans to come back from TRE, but it felt greaton the street, just didn't live too long at all for a coupkle thousand dollares spent already